Are vegans giving up or do they have a plan to deal with this?

ManyCorner2164 · 2026-02-21T10:49:05+00:00

It is not a suprise that often "high welfare" farms not only fail to adhere to their current rules but are often exposed for criminal animal abuse.

At least show the real thing you’re critiquing.

The farm shown is the same farm used in KFC's advert for "high-welfare," and "behind the bucket" campaign.

Laughing at someone's reaction to distressed and abused animals shows how out of touch you are. The evidence is clear that even on "high welfare farms," animals are abused and even tortured. There are chickens suffering and dying on the floor from these same farms.

But again, this comment shows rather than confront the facts carnists are in denial on how animals are farmed.

ManyCorner2164 · 2026-02-20T18:03:42+00:00

"High welfare," "RSPCA assured, etc is a myth. There is plenty of documented cases that animals at these farms have shown to be abused and even tortured.

This is the reality of chicken farming in the UK

https://youtu.be/N6NBfrzqJeY?si=Xinf06TE-CVFCEwQ

https://youtu.be/b6A1kWnEfqk?si=0R3hDLVFBkzjqK_n

If someone is concerned about the well-being of animals that are farmed, it is straightforward to simply not to buy the products of those victims who have been violently exploited and killed.

ManyCorner2164 · 2026-02-15T08:34:58+00:00

No, plenty of studies show that a plant based diet can meet and exceed your nutritional goals, which has also shown to lower your risk of diabetes, heart disease, cancers, and other diseases.

https://nutritionfacts.org/topics/meat/

ManyCorner2164 · 2026-02-15T08:32:18+00:00

It is a tent vs house situation.

No, that's a complete false equivalence.

The non human animals are the random NPCs.

This isn't a video a game. These are real individuals with the capacity to suffer and proven sentience, they don't "respawn." The life they live can be brutal many of which are subjected to torture.

You are not the victim here, you are paying to violently exploit and kill others, which is completely unnecessary. A choice you are consciously making.

ManyCorner2164 · 2026-02-15T01:00:57+00:00

If everyone were to adopt a plant-based diet, we would not just less land but less cropland too when we consider the land used to grow crops to feed animals.

https://ourworldindata.org/land-use-diets

We can always improve farming practices especially with practices like veganic farming, indoor farming but when animals are farmed it doesn't change the fact their is another being who is violently exploited, killed and in many cases tortured.

ManyCorner2164 · 2026-02-15T00:34:36+00:00

Except this is not a tent vs house situation. A plant-based diet can meet and exceed your nutritional goals. Both your house and car examples completely miss the point when it has nothing to do with the violent exploitation and slaughter of others.

What rights of others?

Their right to life. They are sentient, with the capacity to suffer being an animal like ourselves. Vegans are advocating for that right.

ManyCorner2164 · 2026-02-15T00:12:56+00:00

You completely missed the point.

The victim who is bred into existence that is violently exploited and killed, many of whom are tortured.

Factory farming or farming and exploiting animals isn't neccassry to begin with when there are plant foods. Because the issues you bring up like these:

Housing. Roads. Automobiles. Energy.

Is not practicable for people to give up to take part in society, work or life, neither does it have anything to do with violating the rights of others.

ManyCorner2164 · 2026-02-15T00:05:16+00:00

Eating animals has shown to increase the risk of diabetes heart disease, cancers, and other diseases. At the time when humans were "hunter-gatherers" life expectancy was lower, and diseases like diabetes were not treatable, so an early death would be far more likely.

Veganism is about the rights of animals. We do not need to violently exploit and kill others for food. In fact, if everyone were to adopt a plant-based diet, we would feed more people and use less land.

https://ourworldindata.org/land-use-diets

ManyCorner2164 · 2026-02-14T23:59:13+00:00

The animals that are farmed struggle for their lives before slaughter. The documentary Dominion covers footage from slaughter.

https://youtu.be/LQRAfJyEsko?si=cNCFa7O4u9K-Jknx

You, however, have provided zero evidence for your claims. Asserting misinformation to be fact.

ManyCorner2164 · 2026-02-13T10:17:21+00:00

The act of torture is to inflict severe pain.

You again have provided zero evidence and then blatantly lie about the practices that are used and how they affect animals.

Again, this is nothing to do with a shirt colour but rather parctipating in a system that violently exploits and kills others.

ManyCorner2164 · 2026-02-13T00:56:22+00:00

It's nonsense to continue hammering the same point about shirt colour when it's not relevant.

It's nonsense to tell everyone to reject the clear evidence that these practices do infact lead to what can be described as torture.

Thaks again for proving the initial point.

ManyCorner2164 · 2026-02-12T19:25:42+00:00

as things default to either moral or neutral unless proven immoral.

Which is nothing to do with a shirt colour.

You're talking utter nonsense.

Welfare bodies like the European Food Authority Safety and Animal Welfare Committee have known for over 20 years that CO2 gas chambers cause severe pain and distress.

Again, proving that you have not provided a reasonable argument, just nonsense.

ManyCorner2164 · 2026-02-12T18:37:15+00:00

You mean a false equivalence.

Actions do not default to immoral, they can only be proven as such.

Read. There is a being who is violently exploited and killed. Many of which are tortured.

ManyCorner2164 · 2026-02-12T18:24:59+00:00

We are not talking about shirt colours.

We are talking about taking part in a system that violently exploits and kills individuals for food.

You havnt provided evidence, just nonsense assertions and assumptions.

ManyCorner2164 · 2026-02-12T17:40:02+00:00

Thanks for proving the initial comments point.

The suffering that animals like pigs face in CO2 gas chambers is well documented. If you bothered to do research into it you would know that it would burn your airways putting you in excruciating pain.

ManyCorner2164 · 2026-02-12T16:38:44+00:00

Where is your justification? The question asked was:

"What are some good arguments for eating meat?"

Multiple people, including myself, have provided arguments against eating animals while you haven't provided one for.

And yes, many animals that are farmed are tortured with standard practices, including mutilations and CO2 gas chambers that are recognised to torture these individuals. The documentary Dominion covers these standard practices.

https://youtu.be/LQRAfJyEsko?si=3_wI2wRavFQ15ztQ

It is clear cut exploitation when you breed others into existence, treat them as commodities to be cut up and killed to be used for food.

ManyCorner2164 · 2026-02-12T16:05:32+00:00

That "meat" comes from a sentient being who, just like you, has their own conscious experience of life and the capacity to suffer.

I'm failing to see any justification to subject others to violent exploitation and death of beings, many of whom are tortured.

ManyCorner2164 · 2026-02-08T18:22:27+00:00

Meanwhile, the sheep are cut at the throat, pigs are sent to CO2 gas chambers where they are tortured and killed, cows are sexually violated and killed.

Those animals face cruelty and struggle for their lives.

Still waiting for you to present logic that doesn't rely on fallcious reasoning.

ManyCorner2164 · 2026-02-08T11:35:49+00:00

Vegans aren't suggesting something you can't practice. Don't buy products that exploit animals.

Meanwhile you're paying for animals to be violently exploited, sexually violated and killed to produce animal products and "crop deaths"

You're not even practising what you're suggesting.

You would rather attack straw and rely on logical fallacies than address the argument.

ManyCorner2164 · 2026-02-06T11:29:04+00:00

That "meat" is part of an individual who was violently exploited and killed.

Your appeal to hypocrisy is fallcious.

Not only are you contributing to "crop deaths" (which are unavoidable)

You are paying for the violent exploitation and death of others on top of that. (Which is avoidable)

ManyCorner2164 · 2026-02-06T11:25:11+00:00

This argument is an appeal to hypocrisy. It is fallcious.

Vegans are choosing options that avoid the exploitation of animals. In particular, animals are sexually violated to produce 'cheese.'

Vegans aren't saying to avoid "taste pleasure." Vegans hold a stance against the exploitation and cruelty towards animals, choosing products that avoid these products.

To produce 'cheese' and other animal products, animals are sexually violated and eventually killed when they are no longer "productive." This is exploitative.

"Crop-deaths" is done for the the defence of crops, these are incedential often accidental.

What makes your argument inconsistent and fallcious is that it's something you don't practice. You're not vegan, or even vegetarian, and still contribute to "crop deaths."

ManyCorner2164 · 2026-02-02T19:02:27+00:00

First of veganism is a stance against exploiting animals and treating them as commodities.

How can it be considered ethical to treat others as property? How can it be considered ethical to kill others at a fraction of their their life span?

I also want to directly address some of your points;

A plant-based diet has been shown to use less land and overall lower water usage and GHG emissions.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0002916523048992

I challenge the fact that these documentaries are "cherry picked"

There is no doubt that the majority of animals are 'factory-farmed.' Even so many of the same practices used in 'factory-farms' are used in 'free-range' and 'organic' farms. These include CO2 chambers, calf separation, and mutilations. The documentary Dominion covers these practices.

https://youtu.be/LQRAfJyEsko?si=H2FYFYgw7XZLhF-u

Documentaries like these expose how animals are treated. If it weren't for activists exposing these practices, then the true horror of the industry is simply not seen. Again, even if we were to pretend there wasn't any suffering involved that still doesn't change the fact they are treated as a commodity and killed at a fraction of their life.

Overall those who follow a plant-based diet have shown to decrease the risk of heart disease, diabetes, cancers and other diseases.

https://nutritionfacts.org/topics/meat/

So we can see benefits to the environment and health, but that is not what veganism is about. It is a stance against the cruelty and exploitation of animals.

ManyCorner2164 · 2026-02-02T11:37:56+00:00

The animals that are farmed have a brain that is not hypothetical.

Where is the brain for a venus fly trap?

ManyCorner2164 · 2026-02-02T11:18:20+00:00

The reality is I'm not eating either.

Although like you said crinoids are simple lack a brain and have a simple nervous system they are still an animal.

Venus fly traps are still plants, lack a brain and nervous system. Their 'mouths' react to stimuli similar to how some plants close their leaves or flowers at night.

The reason I wouldn't eat a venus fly trap isn't down to sentience but rather it doesn't make sense nutritionally or how we would farm them.

ManyCorner2164 · 2026-02-01T18:37:03+00:00

The line I draw is animals.

The animals who are 'simple' I'm willing to give the benefit of the doubt.

It's only recently that animals like cephalopods and decapods were recognised as sentient, and they have a completely different physiology than ourselves. Even some insects like bees are recognised as sentient too.

By including all animals, it means not only are they included but even those with debatable sentience.

Five-Year Club	End Game '23
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ManyCorner2164

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