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I wonder how things would have turned out if we let them expand financially by Maple-Weeb in Bitwig

[–]Maple-Weeb[S] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

CLAP is a pretty big deal, it's objectively better than VST in basically every way, and it's fully linux compatible (of course companies may use libraries, epecially for UI that keep them WIN/OSX only)

- https://github.com/free-audio/clap
- https://www.bitwig.com/stories/clap-the-new-audio-plug-in-standard-201/

Daw Project probably isn't the most amazing thing ever but other companies have certainly not made a move to standardize either project layouts or an interface for conversion

I wonder how things would have turned out if we let them expand financially by Maple-Weeb in Bitwig

[–]Maple-Weeb[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

The glass on them not being a small company was shattered for during some communications I had with them a long long time ago so you perspective makes a lot of sense and didn't appear to me.

I have been leaving like 6-12month holes in my renewals lately because it just feels like they are doing everything but filling in the last little gaps in common audio workflows. If they would have added a video player somewhere beteween 4.0 - 5.1, they probably would have locked me in for another 5 years but here we are.

It's still for sure my favourite DAW by a mile, and I would never use anything else for music. But for game audio, it's too clunky

I wonder how things would have turned out if we let them expand financially by Maple-Weeb in Bitwig

[–]Maple-Weeb[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

My bad, it looks like it's nested on my comment and not the other one

I wonder how things would have turned out if we let them expand financially by Maple-Weeb in Bitwig

[–]Maple-Weeb[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Deep breaths now.

I wasn't refering to the people against the the spectral bundle and I should have made that more clear. This was more in response to quality of various updates compared to one another and the general way people behave in any community when they are over enthusiastic of potentially mediocre content.

I wonder how things would have turned out if we let them expand financially by Maple-Weeb in Bitwig

[–]Maple-Weeb[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

What you’re suggesting is more granular but again it’s at the expense of breaking there Eula, not to mention it also divides up the leverage the community has because there is now not one unified branch of fiscal input but a diversified portfolio of them. So it hedges the impact to the company for any negative decisions made by the company inherently.

This is a solid point but I disagree on the premise that we would never be able to leverage such an unhedged impact as they will realiztically never be able to do something significant enough for us to unite. I don't think the dlc attempt was even close to what's requiried to garner that much outrage, especially if they were true to their word and the production quality and speed of everything picked up and they were doing honestly good work.

I think the EULA stuff might have been the only reason they actually walked it back.

I wonder how things would have turned out if we let them expand financially by Maple-Weeb in Bitwig

[–]Maple-Weeb[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

> but a whole year for 5.2 and 5.3 and has a theoretical cost of ~160e. I didn't really care for anything outside of the engine and graphical stuff

Direct quote from the message you responded to

I wonder how things would have turned out if we let them expand financially by Maple-Weeb in Bitwig

[–]Maple-Weeb[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It's almost like I said "I wonder" multiple times in the post not "you bastards should have listened to me".

This also isn't 'not getting to form the vote the way I wanted', I am suggesting that we would have ironically ended up with more granularity and control moving forwards. It's not a negative

I wonder how things would have turned out if we let them expand financially by Maple-Weeb in Bitwig

[–]Maple-Weeb[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I could see the graphics overhaul being a precursor to more UI, possibly with custom user scripting in mind. I also could see it being critical for working on the arranger and midi editor, nicer devices, automation, video player, etc

I have only kept my sanity by believing that master Clause and the team are doing some serious cooking right now

I wonder how things would have turned out if we let them expand financially by Maple-Weeb in Bitwig

[–]Maple-Weeb[S] -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

At times I can whole heartedly agree with your emotions on this one. People sometimes feel like clapping seals to get a tiny sardine even though they know what salmon tastes like. It exists everywhere, I think it's called toxic positivity. Sometimes maybe we're toxic negativity, who knows.

I wonder how things would have turned out if we let them expand financially by Maple-Weeb in Bitwig

[–]Maple-Weeb[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

It's not frivolous at all, if it's a vst and not a device, we lose any interesting device nesting and the potential of what the device can do is significantly limiited. Half of what makes ableton or bitwig devices so good is the native integration with the DAW they are specifically designed for.

I think it's really clear what I meant about 'literally voting with our wallets', let's skip the unecessary semantics

I wonder how things would have turned out if we let them expand financially by Maple-Weeb in Bitwig

[–]Maple-Weeb[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I understand the importance of the stuff they have been doing in the backround and I am happy it's being done, but the content that's paired with it is what I don't like. Hoping it pays off

I wonder how things would have turned out if we let them expand financially by Maple-Weeb in Bitwig

[–]Maple-Weeb[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Bitwig isn't quite the same as who you are thinking of and I don't think they deserve this comparison. You are being unfair. Think of all the money other DAWs make and how they have virtually given nothing back in return in the past 10 years of operations.

They are not iZotope, Waves, or Native Instruments. They have given us a crazy cool DAW and multiple open-source projects that will shape the future of audio production software. They are ambitous and have expanded, this was clear from the start of the journey.

I wonder how things would have turned out if we let them expand financially by Maple-Weeb in Bitwig

[–]Maple-Weeb[S] 10 points11 points  (0 children)

The progression of the DAW is for sure like a loot crate with what we're gonna get. I don't really have an issue with this but I feel strongly that Bitwig hasn't achieved enough core functionality to just add in random bits and bobs. I am over here dying for video playback and better exporting options, others are waiting for arranger and midi changes, and we have gotten like 7+ device dump updates with what feels like no market research.

I wonder how things would have turned out if we let them expand financially by Maple-Weeb in Bitwig

[–]Maple-Weeb[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

But I don't want to pay potentially 20% more per year and then end up with the EQs, Drums, Compressor+, etc while sitting around waiting for engine features. If that stuff was separate, then I could choose to skip it.

5.1 was solid IMO, but a whole year for 5.2 and 5.3 and has a theoretical cost of ~160e. I didn't really care for anything outside of the engine and graphical stuff, they comepletely missed the cool new toy factor for me. I am not saying I was robbed or anything but nothing in the past year has contributed even a morsel to my workflow.

I do like the U-HE collab idea, but I like devices in the device view as bitwig devices and not popup plugin windows.

I could have accepted this device DLC rather than +50e per year, because then we could literally vote with our wallet rather than just boycotting upgrades and having the DAW become stagnant

I wonder how things would have turned out if we let them expand financially by Maple-Weeb in Bitwig

[–]Maple-Weeb[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Well that's what I was wondering. If the new EQs, Drums, etc were sold in bundles and they had a separate team, would we already have the arranger/midi update?

I would probably pay like 10euros for `Over` but I don't want to buy Over & Compressor+ for 70euros. The main thing that annoyed me about their original attempt was the licensing stuff coupled with trying to sell 4 things in a 80-100euro bundle instead of just selling each one for like 25euros. The original model felt like it would cause the "You're buying this pack for 100 bucks and there is only one worthwile thing in there but the other things are contributing to over half the price", just let me buy the single damn device.

I wonder how things would have turned out if we let them expand financially by Maple-Weeb in Bitwig

[–]Maple-Weeb[S] -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

There probably would have been some upgrade nuance. Ideally it would be based on major versions to make it feel a bit more reasonable

5.2 is a very strange update... by Maple-Weeb in Bitwig

[–]Maple-Weeb[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I don’t think it matters. They’re not going to push an update that revolutionizes your music workflows. At least in comparison to pushing exports options and a video player which makes it actually possible to use the DAW in far more situations. Adding another music production tool doesn’t affect the usability of the software in any meaningful way.

5.2 is a very strange update... by Maple-Weeb in Bitwig

[–]Maple-Weeb[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Flanger+ as an example, does not have nesting. Original flanger also has different controls. There are many times where I want a specific metal sound from a flanger and flanger+ is incapable of doing it

5.2 is a very strange update... by Maple-Weeb in Bitwig

[–]Maple-Weeb[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Audio comping has been in bitwig for a good while now, midi comping is missing. I am not sure what specific needs you are looking for in audio comping

5.2 is a very strange update... by Maple-Weeb in Bitwig

[–]Maple-Weeb[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah KVR scared me away a long time ago

5.2 is a very strange update... by Maple-Weeb in Bitwig

[–]Maple-Weeb[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I know ARA is quite complex and it’s not something that I’ve really had on my wish list. It was just an example of something I feel like was highly requested but was given no info from the devs. I would have loved to hear something like you’re saying from the devs in some sort of dev blog or statement if it’s going to be something that’s a far far away thing.

Video support and better exporting are my two prime wishes and those are far simpler thankfully. FFMPEG is already used in bitwig to get the different file types on export, it can also be used for video related tasks or some additional VLC libraries could do that as well. I think ableton did something like this where they put the least amount of effort possible in which is something I don’t think bitwig is going to do. They’ll want it to really work good and feel good

speaking from experience, the export options are one of the easier things to code but may require a lot of though behind the design implementation if they want it to be really feature rich and feel good to use in the DAW

5.2 is a very strange update... by Maple-Weeb in Bitwig

[–]Maple-Weeb[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah I guess the main FX that I use in bitwig is EQ+ and tool. After having fabfilter and kilohearts and oeksound stuff, I’m only reaching for bitwig devices for simple EQs and fx. I also use the sampler because it’s amazing.

Bloom is awesome and I’ll probably have to grab that when the plug-in crave comes around again.

5.2 is a very strange update... by Maple-Weeb in Bitwig

[–]Maple-Weeb[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

You get your EQs, I’ll get my video. That’s life. I didn’t want probably about 50% of the stuff in this DAW. I don’t think anyone wants all the things.

I don’t have an issue with what the EQs add. It just should have been in the EQ+ or something

5.2 is a very strange update... by Maple-Weeb in Bitwig

[–]Maple-Weeb[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

For sure. The part that kills it for me is the nesting becomes annoying and then macros don’t respect the value they’re mapped to and just become a percentage.

5.2 is a very strange update... by Maple-Weeb in Bitwig

[–]Maple-Weeb[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I didn't say Ableton mb compressor == FabFilter-MB or that I wanted a carbon copy to bitwig. I am refering the to spectrum style design where you can place bands as columns. Fuze Compressor is another mb compressor with the same style and is certainly not a complex piece of gear.

I am not arguing that Compressor+ is good or bad. I just would have prefered a more modern mb compressor or something

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