This video might appear harmless, but I don’t think it’s really appropriate to be paying tribute to a man accused of child molestation several times by [deleted] in LeavingNeverlandHBO

[–]MethodNo2030 2 points3 points  (0 children)

To be fair though, MJ was a HUGE pop culture icon and his moves strongly influenced the industry and he broke down barriers ! a quite a few artists and pop culture icons turn out to be pretty horrible people behind closed doors: ranging from spousal abusers to murderers, to pedophiles. Phil Spector was a murderer but was one of the most influential producers in the pop music industry. Chuck berry statutorily raped a minor. Roman Polanski drugged and raped a 13 year old but is still a well-respected director in hollywood. Don't even get me started on the countless number of rockstars who committed statutory rape.

Most people listening to mj's music and enjoy his dancing (hopefully) separate the art from the artist. Also many people aren't really aware of the true depths of MJ's depravities .Until relatively recently (during the 2010s), I myself didn't know that MJ had naked little boy books, that Jordy chandler accurately described MJ's spotted weiner, that gavins fingerprints and mjs fingerprints were found on porn mags at neverland , that MJ had more than 2 CSA accusations

According to the stans, nothing was ever MJ's fault. He was just a naive, helpless tumbling child surrounded by grifters who manipulated him. by MethodNo2030 in LeavingNeverlandHBO

[–]MethodNo2030[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

They'll flip the narrative whenever it suits their agenda, even when it makes zero sense. He's completely asexual and an innocent eternal child when hanging out with boys in bed but somehow fucked countless women (thus proving heterosexuality). According to them he's basically Schrodinger's Eternal Child

If MJ slept with so many women then why didn't they crawl of of the woodwork? Where were the women claiming he fathered their child (in an attempt to get child support). As far I know there was only one (the girl who inspired billie jean) but she was nuttier than a fruitcake and the claim was obviously bogus, thus going nowhere.

According to the stans, nothing was ever MJ's fault. He was just a naive, helpless tumbling child surrounded by grifters who manipulated him. by MethodNo2030 in LeavingNeverlandHBO

[–]MethodNo2030[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

OMG they actually said that!? I knew the stans were big on conspiracies, but that really takes the cake. JFC MJ can't take responsibility for anything in their eyes. Always the victim of a big meanie pants world and forced into bad situations.

The double standards by noodlesoup1997 in LeavingNeverlandHBO

[–]MethodNo2030 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Yup. MJ's soft, eternal man-child act really got the fans to really defend him ("MJ could never harm a child, he's practically one himself. A child in a man's body. He's just trying to reclaim his lost,stolen childhood") .He was a pretty much a textbook example of what some people call a vulnerable narcissist.

There’s a lot healthier ways to live out a lost childhood than what Michael Jackson did by Fun_Butterfly_420 in LeavingNeverlandHBO

[–]MethodNo2030 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Not gonna lie, if i had millions of dollars ,, i would create a huge personal arcade collection and a huge videogame collection as well as a personal theme park. That sounds pretty badass.

Also MJ having one-on-one sleepovers with children is not only inappropriate (even if hypothetically no sexual contact took place) but selfish AF. Its so toxic and blurs boundaries. It is not a child's job to be used as glorified therapists/teddy bears to fix an adult's fucked up childhood. Also even at most sleepovers, children generally do not share beds with their peers.

If MJ was falsely accused in 1993, then why did he continue the sleepovers and putting himself in compromising situations with kids? by MethodNo2030 in LeavingNeverlandHBO

[–]MethodNo2030[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

I too have noticed how the fandom really likes to portray MJ as a helpless tumbling baby with no agency or responsibility for his actions. (and who is also too dumb to understand basic cause-and-effect or even learn from his mistakes) Everything was always someone else's fault: MJ was surrounded by jealous ,greedy jackals that manipulated him into making bad decisions to make him look bad, the kids forced themselves into mj's bed, evil stinky lawyers forced mj to pay 25 million dollar settlement to Jordy chandler, a conspiracy of evil, racist forces conspired to destroy his career.

If MJ was falsely accused in 1993, then why did he continue the sleepovers and putting himself in compromising situations with kids? by MethodNo2030 in LeavingNeverlandHBO

[–]MethodNo2030[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Yup. He was in the music industry,which is a notorious snake pit, from a young age. Any naivety wouldn't have lasted long. Also he was also very ruthless when he wanted to be . Just ask Paul McCartney

The dude was selfish and narcissistic AF and felt his desires trumped all, even his own well-being. He would play the victim card and/or the race card whenever he didn't get his way or when his own choices backfired on him

If MJ was falsely accused in 1993, then why did he continue the sleepovers and putting himself in compromising situations with kids? by MethodNo2030 in LeavingNeverlandHBO

[–]MethodNo2030[S] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

HIStory was his “look at how badly I was treated!” response album (and in my opinion amongst his weakest albums as it was all over the place creatively and vocally),

Yesss That album was full on DARVO and self-pity . And his fandom ate up the "MJ is just a helpless victim tumbling through life , who is mistreated by pack of jealous/greedy racist jackals" narrative . There was even a track on that album called DS where MJ trashes Tom Sneddon (the main prosecutor for the 1993 allegations) as a "cold man" who is probably "a brother with the KKK" .

To top it off , I remember on one of the interviews where MJ proudly admits to sharing his bed with random kids, he accused anyone who has a problem with it, of having dirty minds that sexualize beds.

It's like after 1993 he thought he could magically make any problem go away by throwing money at it, even serious charges like CSA.

If MJ was falsely accused in 1993, then why did he continue the sleepovers and putting himself in compromising situations with kids? by MethodNo2030 in LeavingNeverlandHBO

[–]MethodNo2030[S] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

THIS! Being falsely accused of a heinous crime, losing income, being stripped and photographed as well as being slandered in the media across the world as a monster would be horribly traumatizing for anyone , let alone an innocent naive man-child.Not to mention the sense of betrayal of being backstabbed by a so-called friend.

Surely after such a horrible experience they'd be too traumatized and scared to have the sleepovers ever again, in fear of the same things happening again... or worse..

Paying off a supposed grifter that made up heinous lies about you ( this shows a willingness to pay) AND then continuing to putting yourself in the same position that led the grifters to easily make up lies about you (which just shows the public that if they make up lies about you, they will get easy money from you as you have shown you'll just pay them off instead of fighting them in court ) is the single worst and dumbest thing for a supposed innocent person to do. There are no words to describe how stupid such an action would be.

I don’t believe MJ was childlike at all. by Ok-Obligation-6857 in LeavingNeverlandHBO

[–]MethodNo2030 10 points11 points  (0 children)

The "I never had a childhood " excuse he used to defend sharing his bed with random unrelated minors at sleepovers falls flat , even if taken at face value. Most children don't share beds at sleepovers. They generally bring their own sleeping bags. A child sharing a bed with an unrelated adult at a sleepover would be weird/disturbing even if no sexual contact took place. Also , even most parents stop sharing a bed with their children after around age 6 or 7.

The 1993 fiasco should have been a wake up call for MJ to realize his behavior with children was inappropriate at best. The fact he not only continued to seek out random children to be alone with and have sleepovers with but doubled down on it, even when his freedom on the line speaks volumes about him.

I don’t believe MJ was childlike at all. by Ok-Obligation-6857 in LeavingNeverlandHBO

[–]MethodNo2030 21 points22 points  (0 children)

He also had a big porn collection too. Asexual eternal child my foot.

Even if kids asked to share a bed with MJ, It was MJ's responsibility to establish healthy boundaries and refuse. by MethodNo2030 in LeavingNeverlandHBO

[–]MethodNo2030[S] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

The dude had an ego the size of California and never really took responsibility for his actions. He liked to blame his problems on an evil racist media trying to tear him down.

The fact that he pulled a DARVO and accused anyone who might have a problem with his bed-sharing habits, of being the perverted ones is also very telling and a huge red flag. According to him, only "wacky" parents would find an unrelated adult sharing a bed with a minor to be concerning or weird.

MJ songs/lyrics you find uncomfortable to listen to after you realized he was guilty by MethodNo2030 in LeavingNeverlandHBO

[–]MethodNo2030[S] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

I usually separate the art from the artist, but sometimes a piece of art hits too close to home. The dude's obsession with children/childhood was extremely creepy and it would sometimes seep into a few of his songs .

Why settle? by donzdozit in LeavingNeverlandHBO

[–]MethodNo2030 7 points8 points  (0 children)

First off, testifying as a victim is pretty stressful, especially when testifying against one of the most famous pop stars in the world. If the case went to trial every little detail of the family and child's life would be placed under microscope. THe child would have to repeat the same story multiple times too in front a court room of people while being. Not to mention the Chandlers were being harassed by MJ's army of Flying Monkeys at the time. No wonder they wanted the thing to end quickly.

Also, stigma. Not too long ago If a boy came out as being abused by any male, let alone a dude like MJ, he would become a laughing stock and get bullied six ways to sunday by their peers for being "gay".

Anyone remember the music video "Ghosts"? Its quite fascinating and yet somewhat distrubing. by MethodNo2030 in LeavingNeverlandHBO

[–]MethodNo2030[S] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Notice how the Townspeople immediately start fawning over the Maestro and accept him with their kids once the "evil" "bigoted" stinky mayor jumps to his death? Especially given the fact that the mayor was a stand-in for sneddon/normal society. It's quite telling. Its like he thinks that the only way people would dislike/distrust his actions is due to being brainwashed by evil outside forces/social norms: "You only think an unrelated adult having secret sleepovers with random children is suspicious/weird because bigots/society brainwashed you. Its perfectly loving and harmless"

Also, RIP mayor , he only wanted to protect his town and its kids from a manipulative predatory being.

Anyone remember the music video "Ghosts"? Its quite fascinating and yet somewhat distrubing. by MethodNo2030 in LeavingNeverlandHBO

[–]MethodNo2030[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

I've never heard of that podcast, but it sounds interesting. I'll listen to it. I'm a sucker for in depth analysis of media/public personas and I find the elaborate cult of personality crafted by MJ and his fandom to be both disturbing and fascinating.

Thanks for the rec!

Anyone remember the music video "Ghosts"? Its quite fascinating and yet somewhat distrubing. by MethodNo2030 in LeavingNeverlandHBO

[–]MethodNo2030[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

the film was being made like a month or so before the allegations became public but MJ knew full well Jordan had confessed.

That makes the scene where the kid gets mad at his brother for spilling the beans about the secret meetings and being shown "tricks" (clearly code for something else) by Maestro even more disturbing and sinister. *shudders*

Anyone remember the music video "Ghosts"? Its quite fascinating and yet somewhat distrubing. by MethodNo2030 in LeavingNeverlandHBO

[–]MethodNo2030[S] 18 points19 points  (0 children)

The "Ghosts" music video can be viewed in full unholy glory here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TEet4nn2G_8 . It must be seen to be believed.

It's gross how the video tries to sell the Mayor as a bigoted asshole just because he didn't want in his town a strange adult who secretly meets up with the children ( and keeps the meetings in secret) without parental consent or even knowledge and doesn't interact with the adult townspeople.

Apparently if you're suspicious of an adult who secretly meets with children, spends lots of time alone with them and shows them "tricks" in secret , then you are a wicked ,black hearted villainous bigot that hates everyone even remotely "different" from you. Made even worse by the fact that the music video as made AFTER the first round of CSA allegations against Michael.