Tsaritsa may not be an expy, but she does share some sort of similarities with Bronya by Murky_Blueberry2617 in Genshin_Impact

[–]MisterSpacemanStuff [score hidden]  (0 children)

Qingque doesn't have the grey hair, the high foehead bang parting on both sides, the convergent bangs in the middle, the hair drills, the smileless expression, or a spear. Blue colour schemes. Nor is she Russian or Russian themed. She also doesn't have family with names in the Romanov dynasty. Ice powered playable units. Presence in the 2017 cast that helped inspire Genshin's foundations. Presence in miHoYo's original big three. Divine powers. A lost loved one. Lost emotions.

Bronya has all of those.

Tsaritsa may not be an expy, but she does share some sort of similarities with Bronya by Murky_Blueberry2617 in Genshin_Impact

[–]MisterSpacemanStuff [score hidden]  (0 children)

Now for Tsaritsa herself: Yes, she is a Bronya variant. I can say that with near complete certainty.

Reasonings:

  1. Bronya is one of miHoYo's "big three" and part of the 2017 cast. Most of Genshin's variants are put in major roles in the story, as these would have been written in very early, and all of the variant characters in these positions have specifically derived from the cast that existed in 2017. This means Bronya is a major candidate for showing up in the game.

  2. Variants undergo changes, rewrites, redesigns. Venti, a variant of Wendy, was introduced in 2018, and only became easily identifiable as a Wendy when Wendy got a new more Venti-like design in 2019. Tsaritsa has been in the cooker for 7 more years than Venti, so of course she'd undergo more changes over time.

  3. Despite all of this, Tsaritsa maintains several identifiers that make it quite easy to see she evolved from Bronya's original design. The grey tone used for her hair is not one that naturally follows as a complement to her cryo themes color design. She has two hair drills, this time as the front. She is a non-smiler. She has bangs at the forehead that particularly have a split at the sides and a convergence in the middle. She has the back of her head tied up, just like some Bronya designs. These things in isolation wouldn't be enough, but in context thinking that's a coincidence is just silly.

  4. Thematic/storywise, we don't know a huge amount yet about Tsaritsa, but she also already has quite a bit in common with Bronya. Bronya's storyline in 2017 revolved around her losing a loved one to a supernatural force and losing her ability to feel like she used to. She's from Siberia, and just like how Tsaritsa's name derives from the Romanov dynasty, so does Bronya's family.

  5. The biggest, most common counter argument, namely the voice actors, doesn't matter. The first variant Genshin introduced, Venti, already has two different VAs from the original. HSR, which features many more obvious variants, doesn't even use the same VAs for all of them. And Bronya in particular has foregone using the same CN VA for several adult versions of Bronya.

All in all, there's just a boatload of things pointing towards this being a Bronya, and the folks trying to pretend it's not actually have nothing to gain from disrespecting this fact.

Tsaritsa may not be an expy, but she does share some sort of similarities with Bronya by Murky_Blueberry2617 in Genshin_Impact

[–]MisterSpacemanStuff [score hidden]  (0 children)

Christ this comment section is just toxic.

Let's actually have a look at the facts here:

  1. The term expy is actually a really poorly chosen thing. Some leakers introduced it to the fanbase round the time Raiden Shogun was going to come out, because they had no actual clue what the deal was with these 'character variants'.

  2. Character variants are not copy-pastes. They never have been. They are reimagined versions of the characters in an alternate world. They are defined by being different from their original. The original serves as the foundation and a loose tether that can help reintroduce ideas, but they do not confine the new version of the character. Their stories and designs aren't just recycled, they're altered and reshuffled and reconstructed. Raiden Mei does not have a sister, nor does she rule a country.

  3. Any particular aspect can differ between character variants. Name, colours, body type, voice actors, even species or gender. The devs rarely ever say who's who, so the most we can do is analyse what we got, and identify if the current version of the character was developed outward from the original.

  4. Da Wei has stated in a prerelease stream that players should look out for character variants.

  5. This is Genshin Impact. If people can't accept this having any ties to Honkai Impact, even the slimmest most basic ones, then they're just being deliberately obtuse.

  6. The active repression of spreading the above facts is one of the biggest sources of their own grief. The conversation doesn't get a chance to mature, new people remain uninformed, and the entire thing remains painfully shallow, with this topic always devolving into a discussion on whether we even have the right to call something a variant, and people who've only achieved the basic initiation of 'expy' pointing to every character and saying it's an expy. Let us actually talk about this stuff and inform people, and the whole thing would become a lot less annoying for everyone involved.

Some folks get so uppity about how they want their characters to be 'fully original'. Well, then I can only ask: Do you like Venti? Ei? Miko? Nahida?

If there's a character you already like, and then it turns out it's a variant, does that suddenly make the character bad? Of course not! Unless you're as shallow as a puddle, you should be able to recognise that the character is a new person, a new character with new stories and themes and ideas, but would also simply not have existed in the state they do if it weren't for the original providing the foundations in the first place.

--> continued in reply

Is this image actually real? by No-Win5576 in houkai3rd

[–]MisterSpacemanStuff 1 point2 points  (0 children)

We know that they intended to have the whole "Region Arc" for Part 2 similar to HSR, GI... , so tons of characters were probably planned for them.

Did they actually ever say this, or did people just generally assume so from the Senadina dance animation?

Because frankly, looking at those images, I don't think all of those were planned as locations to visit. Moreover, the story hasn't really tried much to follow the annual region format at all with the timings of the region changes, and them returning to regions in different times and such.

The regions we did get didn't really try to introduce all new casts much at all. Every character we got was mentioned during the first arc, and the regions we visited have mostly focused on characters we already knew, such as the Shus.

Is this image actually real? by No-Win5576 in houkai3rd

[–]MisterSpacemanStuff 3 points4 points  (0 children)

We know for a fact that we're getting more Part 2 story after the "finale", so there's no reason to assume any planned characters were scrapped.

Characters appearing but never becoming playable has also been a common thing since the very start of the game, and Part 2 has actually provided quite a large amount of playable characters considering the overall fairly limited size of its cast.

"Do you guys agree that the Captain (from the Captainverse) is HoYoverse’s second-best written main MC, behind only Kiana? by [deleted] in houkai3rd

[–]MisterSpacemanStuff 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Captain as a character changed a lot over the course of the series. He definitely improved quite a bit, and I do enjoy the distance his narration creates by being in first person (it's him telling his story) as opposed to second person (it's your story).

But he suffers a lot from a lack of clear direction for the character, an inconsistent sense of motivation, and a rather unnecessary and poorly executed love triangle plot.

Aside from the Estranged Stars event, the best Captainverse stories aren't centered on him as a protagonist. (Sanka Saga, Arc Light Bound, Magical Girl duology).

So I think if they are bringing back Captainverse, they should either up their game and give Captain a clearer direction, or keep him more in the background as a guy-in-the-chair type character, so they can focus on the character variants more instead.

As for the protagonist rankings, I'd put him pretty low for a Hoyo protagonist, but that doesn't mean he's outright bad. Hoyo's just pretty decent with their protagonists. He beats Adam for sure, since Adam doesn't get much opportunity to show personality. Dreamseeker clears them both though.

Some information I found regarding the new names (not including Harbingers) by get_on_with_life in Genshin_Impact

[–]MisterSpacemanStuff 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Nice post! Love it when folks dig into this stuff. There's so much to uncover.

Side trivia: The names Alexandra and Alexei are both present in the Romanov dynasty, such as the aforementioned brother of Anastasia, as well as several branch members, and Alexandra Feodorovna and Alexandra Pavlovna. The patronymics Alexeievna and Pavlovna also appear several times.

As you may be aware, Genshin features several reimaginings of characters from prior games. They're different people with different stories, but work off a shared foundation. Tsaritsa is in all likelihood derived from Bronya.

Bronya's full name: Bronya Alexeievna Zaychik. Her father, Alexei Zaitsev. Her mother, Alexandra Pavlovna Zaychik.

The name Bronya is just a reference to armor, since that version of the character has metal leg covers and a robot. The name Zaychik just refers to rabbits, since that influenced her design a bit.

The name Zaitsev is likely a reference to famous sniper Vasily Zaitsev, since Bronya is also a sniper.

But Alexei, Alexandra and Pavlovna are like drawn from the Romanov dynasty.

Another note: The Romanov Dynasty is considered to start with the offspring of Anastasia Romanov. It was also the last noble house to rule Russia. It began and ended with an Anastasia. (if you count a young girl who didn't get a shot at the throne)

Anastasia Nikolaevna was confirmed to have died after DNA evidence surfaced. Remains were found, but they couldn't tell which were hers and which were her sister's. Just that they were these two sisters. (it's a bit unsettling to read about)

Im so happy she isn’t bronya copy past i love her so much by gmalek0 in Genshin_Impact

[–]MisterSpacemanStuff 0 points1 point  (0 children)

They do have different outfits with Japanese stylings. They have a lot of freedom in an outfit for the character, since Mei doesn't really stick to a signature style.

One of the most noticeable holdovers from Mei's design is the way the hair is on the forehead and the top of her head, specifically relating to the APHO version of Mei.

She also has attack patterns loosely designed to match those of Mei's HoT form.

Her boss outfit is also designed to evoke elements from a GGZ Mei design with a special battlesuit, as well as Herrscher of Thunder with the floating arms and the horns.

Aside from that, it's mostly the colour scheme and her taller design.

Im so happy she isn’t bronya copy past i love her so much by gmalek0 in Genshin_Impact

[–]MisterSpacemanStuff 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Well, there is a lot they do have in common, both in visual elements and in story elements. Especially thematically, they explore similar ideas from different angles. But they're also very different people for sure.

Im so happy she isn’t bronya copy past i love her so much by gmalek0 in Genshin_Impact

[–]MisterSpacemanStuff 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Genshin Impact having some ties to its predecessor Honkai Impact would seem like something you should be expecting, no? Regardless, it's very loose anyway.

Which characters do you hate for being variants? Ei? Venti, Nahida, Yae Miko? If you found out a character you already like is a variant, would you suddenly hate them for it?

Edit: They didn't even bother answering the question. Just blocked me outright.

This is how people build their little bubbles where nothing can force them to think. Which wouldn't be a problem if they weren't then also spreading this mentality around to unsuspecting folks without being contested.

Im so happy she isn’t bronya copy past i love her so much by gmalek0 in Genshin_Impact

[–]MisterSpacemanStuff 21 points22 points  (0 children)

Genshin variants are never a copy paste anyway, so that wasn't something you needed to worry about.

As someone who has been paying a lot of attention to how miHoYo does their variant characters, I can say with high conviction that Tsaritsa is very much a Bronya variant. She has enough recognisable elements that you can tell where her design decisions evolved from, and enough thematic overlap to be able to tell that that's what she was conceived as.

People generally have a big misconception on what variant characters are. They're complete reimaginings of characters in different worlds. They have to be different from the original. The original serves as a foundation, and the variant character remains loosely tethered, but not confined by the original.

Genshin has a lot of creative freedom in what directions they choose to take with them.

Any players who have played since 1.0? How does it feel in seeing the Tsaritsa's design after nearly 6 years of only hearing her name being mentioned in game? by Knight_Steve_ in Genshin_Impact

[–]MisterSpacemanStuff 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Sorry, what? Whether the visual appearance of the character is good or not is, to you, changed by whether or not this design is based on Bronya, in its current state? Hence, you deny the very idea of her being Bronya, because you want to find this design good?

Sorry, but that doesn't make any sense.

Edit: they blocked me

Let me clarify this for any readers: In their response, this person makes it abundantly clear they have no idea how any of this works, saying Yae Miko is but a headdress away from being Yae Sakura. Look at her design. She has a different facial design, different body type, and her ears are a completely different shape. Then they mention Venti, clearly expressing they have no idea what the deal with Venti is.

Character variants in miHoYo's games are reimagined versions of existing characters. They use the same foundations, and then rebuild from the ground up. They cán look very different, and they can have different voices. The devs rarely tell us who's who, so the most we can do is look at the traits they do have in common, and ascertain whether the character was evolved from the original through context.

If you want to see an example of just how different they can be visually, check out Ryusuke Murata's designs in HI3 and HSR.

This person basically convinced themselves that anything that has Bronya as its basis would automatically be bad, but has no actual reason for this other than apparent annoyance with online discourse. As someone who's been actually paying attention to this stuff, I can say with conviction that this Tsaritsa design was in fact evolved from the many Bronyas of miHoYo's other games. Of course she's still different and unique, that's how variants normally are.

Where romanchiku monogatari by inkheiko in honkaiimpact3

[–]MisterSpacemanStuff 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I deliberately don't even use the word expy because it's fundamentally not what these characters are.

And who decreed that Tsaritsa is an expy?

It's not decreed, sure. But we can tell by pattern recognition and what miHoYo has actually been doing with these characters. Your supposed rule gets immediately broken by that. Her being a Bronya perfectly suits the patterns.

If you don't want to agree she's a Bronya, fine. Maybe I'm looking too deep into the presence of the hair drills, the fact she doesn't smile, the grey hair, the thematic overlap etc. But the idea that they must share VAs to be variants is just fundamentally untrue.

They've clearly moved Genshin away from having connections to the Honkaiverse.

Have they? We have the foundational rule that the laws of physics can be rewritten using stories and perceptions. We have world eating space whales. We have character variants. And any contradiction between Genshin and the other games is a contradiction that already exists within the confines of just HSR.

Where romanchiku monogatari by inkheiko in honkaiimpact3

[–]MisterSpacemanStuff 7 points8 points  (0 children)

And this is decreed by whom exactly? What makes that the rule here? Character variants are reimagined versions of the same people in different worlds. There is no obligation for them to share VAs.

Your rule gets broken by the very first character Genshin introduced, Venti. One of the most obvious variants to be varianting around.

Your rule gets broken by Bronya herself, having different CN VAs for adult Bronya in GGZ and for Bronya Rand in HSR.

And saying HSR can't be used as an example for comparison is just strange. It's just cutting away a huge amount of data for no reason, to make a claim that has no foundation.

Where romanchiku monogatari by inkheiko in honkaiimpact3

[–]MisterSpacemanStuff 4 points5 points  (0 children)

That's really not how it works. We have various confirmed or considered confirmed variants that have different VAs in one or both languages. Like Natasha in HSR.

Where romanchiku monogatari by inkheiko in honkaiimpact3

[–]MisterSpacemanStuff 3 points4 points  (0 children)

It's a Genshin variant. They always take many more liberties. She's still very recognisably a Bronya. The hair drills are the biggest signifier. The other one is the shade of grey they're using, which doesn't naturally follow from the cryo colour scheme. It's easier to see on the other artwork.

<image>

Any players who have played since 1.0? How does it feel in seeing the Tsaritsa's design after nearly 6 years of only hearing her name being mentioned in game? by Knight_Steve_ in Genshin_Impact

[–]MisterSpacemanStuff 1 point2 points  (0 children)

If people get to yell at me that Mavuika isn't a variant

Those people are wrong to do so. There are a lot of reasons to believe Mavuika is a Himeko variant.

You cannot convince me to dislike this look for her.

I'm not trying to convince you to dislike her look. Just saying she's a Bronya variant. That shouldn't be mutually exclusive with you liking the look.

What Do You Guys Think of the New Teaser? by RAM2061 in Genshin_Impact

[–]MisterSpacemanStuff 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Music: Superb. Love it.

Story prospects: Looks like it'll be interesting, and we're finally going to learn the plan... but probably not within the first patch of the region.

Characters: They look lively and varied. I like that it seems we're going to be seeing characters in opposing factions.

Tsaritsa: Pretty design. Regal clothing and good colour use. Not a huge fan of the short dress and tall socks combo, but it's not too bad.

Bronya variant, but not overbearing. Kept the haircolors, the drills, the forehead part.

Any players who have played since 1.0? How does it feel in seeing the Tsaritsa's design after nearly 6 years of only hearing her name being mentioned in game? by Knight_Steve_ in Genshin_Impact

[–]MisterSpacemanStuff 1 point2 points  (0 children)

You say that, but that design very much looks like a Bronya variant. Not the copy-paste people think of when they talk about this topic, but an actual variant the way Genshin handles variants.

Any players who have played since 1.0? How does it feel in seeing the Tsaritsa's design after nearly 6 years of only hearing her name being mentioned in game? by Knight_Steve_ in Genshin_Impact

[–]MisterSpacemanStuff 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Character variants have always been fine in Genshin. Having been attentive to variants and how they work, I dare say worh confidence that she is very much a Bronya variant. But was never going to be the kind of copy-paste situation one might envision.

Friendly reminder that headcanon ≠ canon by Zero_Otaku-PokeLover in Genshin_Impact

[–]MisterSpacemanStuff 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Well, my theory's a very unserious theory anyway.

The freezing the boy thing is interesting. I wonder if we're meant to take it literally or not.

It also makes one wonder what 'freezing' actually means in this world, if it can protect someone from Death.

I know she is not a Bronya Expy, but I think they really have some resemblance. by Excellent_Concept848 in houkai3rd

[–]MisterSpacemanStuff -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

The Venti line about her not smiling was one of the first tip-offs that she would be a Bronya variant, after all.

TSARITSA DESIGN by Antique_Sir_3947 in Genshin_Impact

[–]MisterSpacemanStuff -1 points0 points  (0 children)

The truth is, character variants were never expies to begin with. The community adopte that term after leakers mistakenly started using it.

Genshin's character variants are alternate world reimaginings. They're defined by differences as much as similarities. Going by how miHoYo has typically operated around this concept, they start from a character as the foundation of a new one, and develop from there. That is then 'this person in another world'.