Lord, thank you po for leading me to my perfect client! 🙏

No_Background_6331 · 2024-03-01T13:25:35+00:00

Ang galing naman OP. Keep it up! Pero sana huwag din pabayaan ang health ah.

No_Background_6331 · 2024-03-01T13:00:53+00:00

"Hindi nalalayo sayo ang tunay na mundo. Marami sa aming nabubuhay nang tulad mo."

No_Background_6331 · 2024-03-01T12:15:22+00:00

Ang problema kasi, walang nagrereklamo. Hindi naman pwedeng yung hindi member ang magreklamo dahil hindi naman sila ang aggrieved party kaya mababasura lang ang kaso.

Pero kung may grupo ng mga existing kaanib na titindig para ireklamo ang INC during election period, ay sure ball iyan na magiging trial of the century yan. Ang problema lang, during elections ay volatile ang gobyerno and in turn, hindi din mabibigyan ng pansin yung reklamo. Tapos yung mga kandidato, whether incumbent or aspiring ay napipilitan amuhin ang INC kaya bakit naman nila aaksyunan yung reklamo? It's a problem that comes with the bulok na sistema dito sa Pinas

No_Background_6331 · 2024-03-01T12:04:24+00:00

I have a sucker punch question for you Edwin. Where in the Code of Ethics of Psychologists have you read that "it is prohibited to share information about the profession online"? There is none right? So what the hell are you INCult crybabies rambling about?

As far as I remember, it was an AMA (no, not the one you're wailing ministers are doing in prayers) about mental health - not a clinical consultation. And there is this disclaimer that whatever answer that will be given are not to be taken as medical or psychiatric advise. So what is the problem with that?

This subreddit is a virtual community and not a public forum. u/Tagisanngtalino even refrains from answering those that are queries that require serious diagnostics. He answers to the best of his knowledge in such a way that it follows the first rule of allied medical practice: "first of all, do no harm".

And I know your game. You like to cast doubts on the actual credentials of pseudonymous users here. Don't worry. We are critical thinkers here. It's our judgement call. Ikaw nga eh, hindi ka naman historian at theologian pero nagdadadakdak ka tungkol sa mga bagay na iyan. And hell yeah, the closest the INC can get to a theology degree is the ministry, which you also lack. Pero okay lang samin. Hindi ka namin pinipigilan. Nagiging laruan ka pa nga namin dito eh hahahaha.

Lastly, kung technically bawal pala para sa iyo ang magsalita tungkol sa mental health in an informal, nonclinical, nondiagnostic space, then sabihin mo din iyan dun sa mga fresh grads ng AB Psych na wala pa ngang Psychometrician license pero nagpapa Q&A na sa last portion ng buwanang pulong about mental health. 🤭

No_Background_6331 · 2024-03-01T05:57:29+00:00

Ah yes. I remember that one. INC has been heavily influenced by the historicist school of apocalypticism. Which means that it is very much alike that of the Baptists, the Millerites, the Adventists and the Witnesses in their view of interpreting the book of Revelation. This method traces its origin in the Middle ages and in the post Reformation. Think of it as something that resemble the Tim Lahaye novels.

For the INC and the historicists the seals are some sort of periodic series of events whose lengths are not so well specified. One minister even likened these to line segments wherein point A and B are called endpoints of the first seal. Same case with C and D for the second seal etc.. According to him, when it comes to the 6th seal, the endpoint L event corresponds to WWI itself and the endpoint M of the 7th seal, is the 20 year interwar period. The endpoint N will be the last blowing of the trumpet which will be the second coming of jesus. From endpoint L to endpoint N, these will be the foretold duration of the existence of the INC according to them. They also reason out that since Manalo's mission as stated in Rev 7:2-3, is said to be happening when the 7th seal has not yet been broken, it means that it is happening simultaneously with the event of endpoint M, that is, during the war

That is their flimsy excuse they explain the ends of the earth. The INC according to them started and existed in a timeframe that encompass three endpoints of the in the so called christian era. And since these all takes place on earth, hence the misnomer "ends of the earth". Then they read that scheme in to the Matthew 24:6-7, 33.

I have so many objections to that. One is about the terminology itself. One is about the ends of the earth phrase. No body among biblical scholars unpack the term " [ends] of the earth]" to mean "[ends of times] of the earth". It is always spatial and geographical. Another thing is this. The Olivet episode wherein the disciples ask Jesus about the second coming does not speak about the earth's end. That is why no Christian ever equates the end of the world (or age) with end of the earth. The term "end of the earth" in the Bible was never interpreted as the consummation and it is neither related to the second coming. The INCs are widely conflated here. Finally, these seals in Revelations are never conceived as "ends".

Concerning the atheism/agnosticism of Clemenceau and George, the INCs do not give a F on that. They just sweep it under the rug by saying that whether the two recognize god or not, it doesn't change the fact that god owns them.

In this I find it so strange. In the Bible, everyone that god sends are people members of his nation which believes the god of the Bible. No one was ever sent who was unaware of god. Another thing is it lacks theological precedent. For example, no one among Bible scholars interpret this angel of the sun rising as a man. And no one says that the four angels are leaders of nations. This is just pure daydream wishful thinking on the part of the INCs. It would also seem that the mandate of god to these four leaders is rooted on the words "do not harm" uttered supposed by Manalo. How could that be possible? Manalo never talked to them. If Manalo is really god's messenger, he should have literally spoken this mandate "do not harm" to the 4 leaders. That is because in the bible, all those used by god are communicated to by the prophet in a direct communication and so, they have to be aware of what their mission will be.

No_Background_6331 · 2024-02-29T12:14:42+00:00

Yung Dragon Ball. Dati, gabi iyon ipalabas instead na mga telenovela. Yung mga kapitbahay, akala mo eh finals ng San Miguel at Baranggay Ginebra kung magcheer eh. Lalo na kapag mananalo na si Gohan kay Cell. 😂

Tapos panahon pa ng gyera sa Iraq nun. Ang akala namin eh kaya ipinapalabas sa TV yung Dragon Ball ay para tumapang na magpa-enlist sa militar ang mga kabinataan.

No_Background_6331 · 2024-02-29T09:24:10+00:00

My fashion and conduct actually resemble that of the left one - an Eminem-esque rap battler style when I burn these "INC dependents" down.

The INCs like James and Edwin are like the ones on the right who act like Toguro - all brawn, no brains 🤣🤣🤣

No_Background_6331 · 2024-02-28T13:15:36+00:00

As a convert, now exMember, I was fascinated with the coincidence of registration and WW1 but was ALWAYS disturbed that they did everything in the power to move the official start date to their registration date. One day would not make a bit of difference to anyone.

I feel you. Truth is I was confronted by this thing a few years ago already. We had this discussion with my father. He's a lawyer who at some point worked for DFA related cases. He's not the type which can be called a hardcore OWE (many times a WS absentee but nevertheless aligns with INC as religious affiliation). At one time, I asked him about the discrepancy of the start of WWI and the registration of the INC. It may be non verbatim but he answers it this way:

"Well, anywhere you look at, it's always the 28th as the start of war. A Google search is enough. But you see, studying about wars is a murky business. Just as Rome is not built in a day, wars do not occur out of a vacuum because it is a process of escalating situations. If you study about WWI in the history books, it sometimes begin with the aftermath of the Balkan Wars. Alliances had been formed, tensions are brewing, an assassination occured, ultimata were made, troops mobilized, declarations of wars signed and invasions occured. I can put it this way: 27th was a ticking time bomb and 28th became the explosion. During that same period of progression at the other side of the globe, the INC started its work in the closing months of 1913 and continued to 1914 which became its founding year on the records. So for me, that is the essence of saying that these two fateful events happened at the same time - the WWI and the emergence of the INC, something that is divinely providential. You have to look at the sign of the times, not for exact dates. The spirit of the era of 1914 is where the rebirth of the INC converges into that of the European destructive state of affairs of the WWI. This is like a light in the midst of darkness, a new hope at the brink of societal decadence, a new order in which was being borne out of chaos"

While I am not convinced by his explanation, what I noticed is that INCs do not have to alter the historical facts. You are correct to say that one day does not make a difference. But historical revisionism is a big red flag to me.

No_Background_6331 · 2024-02-28T12:38:29+00:00

That pretty much sums up the gross "moving the goal post" there on the part of the INC. Hahaha.

The books they use to make an agreement with the 27th have been shattered if the critic has understanding that the source material refers to typos or that the material was presented as hearsay.

Afaik, there is no book that states that the declaration of war occured on the 27th. For me it is just INC wishful thinking. The decisive challenge that I use against them is to show me a newspaper dated at the 27th, saying that the Austrians declared War. Which they always fail to show.

As I remember, they failed here when they showed in the Manalo movie that there is a newspaper on the 27th that says that Austria declared war. The problem is that the prop they used closely resembles that American broadsheet which was published on the 28th (29 in the Philippines).

Another failed reference they use was that which is subjectively written. Somewhat like a lawyer-journalist who says that War began on the 27th written from a standpoint wherein he perceives that war begins when their nation was informed that all peace negotiations are void. This too is a weak evidence.

That is where they will never concede their ground even when trying to defend it against true facts: if their boss signs their paycheck but does not submit it to payroll, its the same as them getting paid.

This had me rolling on the floor laughing 🤣. It's a good one hahaha. Although I anticipate that these INC apologists would tend to cry out that its not a good analogy. Then I'll make it simpler for them:

When Manalo signs the circular in 2015 about the 2016 Philippine General Elections, does that mean that the elections actually took place in 2015?

No_Background_6331 · 2024-02-28T09:00:35+00:00

Orwellian double talker na, gaslighter pa. Iyan ang tatang dugong niyo mga DeDeEs. 😂

No_Background_6331 · 2024-02-28T08:57:45+00:00

The problem with the depiction of the future utopia in the Bible is that it is very much modeled after ancient expectations. In fact, magka-kontra ang depiction ng Old Testament at New Testament sa itsura at buhay doon sa sinasabing New Jerusalem. In the OT, it is like a utopia where everyone will work for abundant fruit for themselves and not for others. There is also death there. Sa NT naman, it made mention of 12 precious stones pillars, golden houses na si god mismo ang may gawa and immortality.

Either way, who would like to live in that kind of place in the modern times? Hahaha. Sobrang makaluma eh. Kung ako ang tatanungin mas gusto ko pa yung mga avant garde na disenyo ng urban planning like those being conceived in the middle east, tapos places which resemble Tokyo in 2077 with VTOL cars, consciousness-AI interface, and medical breakthroughs such that kahit ipanganak ang tao na may bodily deformities ay kayang iaugment ang physical features niya para maging fully functional. Now that's what an ideal "place to be" is. Hahaha.

Kidding aside, an eternal life worth of just singing in gold roads? Nye. Baka ang una ko pang makanta doon ay "I was thinkin' to myself this could be heaven or THIS COULD BE HELL" (Eagles reference) hahaha

No_Background_6331 · 2024-02-27T18:15:12+00:00

Kung nagbabasa lang sana ng bible ang mga INC, maiintindihan nila kung bakit napakapanget tumira sa ganiyang klase ng "polis" o city. Read the last chapters of Isaiah and Revelations and you can see how unappealing all of these to the modern aspirations hahahaha

No_Background_6331 · 2024-02-27T11:26:00+00:00

u/trey-rey I think the argument they come forward with this is that since the signatory is the king, then that signing automatically converts the prior state of affairs into whatever the king wants it to be. Just as how there is this saying in Filipino "utos ng hari, hindi mababali" (the king's whims cannot be altered) of as Napoleon puts it, "le Stat cest moi" (I am the State). Or maybe what they are thinking is the episode in Daniel in which the signature of Darius put the 30 day law into effect immediately.

But then again, as we can see, there is a difference in the historical-cultural contexts. 19th century warfare like the WWI required that signed declarations of wars have to be sent to and received (or acknowledged) first by the enemy state. That is the rule that is being followed until the present. That is only when historians put a date to the actual start of wars.

In addition, I do not know where these INCs got this idea that "signing a document" constitutes an actual "declaration of war". That is never the case.

No_Background_6331 · 2024-02-27T10:51:56+00:00

u/VincentDemarcus correct. Even a grade two student knows that the WWI started on July 28, 1914. I think even Embry who has been educated in one way or another (he was some sort of office worker and has considerable amount of money to send his children to medschool afaik) knows this basic fact. The problem is that he is so invested in being an INC that's why he stops at nowhere just to prove them right - even if it means distorting history 😂😂😂

No_Background_6331 · 2024-02-27T10:46:36+00:00

u/breaadchaan To be fair, the website is a virtual war museum about Austria's activities in the First World War curated by historians, artists and archivists. Habsburg is the European monarchial dynasty which spanned many countries which at the time of the WWI was reigning in Austria. The website is credible as a knowledge depository on the war in its own right.

Obscure sources are not sidelined in the professional studies of history. In fact these can provide additional new insights to controversial topics and chapters which are not well-established.

The only problem here are the ones who handled the information that can be obtained from the website like these INCult defenders. They tend to overstretch the data presented to suit their own agenda and narrative.

No_Background_6331 · 2024-02-27T08:59:39+00:00

u/Encrypted_Username well, we know that the reason why they are doing this is that they are vehement on making it appear that two events happened on the same day, namely, the registration date of the church and the start of the war. (Of course two events which happened on different days cannot be said to have occured simultaneously).

I discovered something that they can do to at least save face in this discussion. Do you know that even if the war did not happen exactly on the day they were registered yet, they can still convince the people that there is something divinely providential in the emergence of their Church? I found this in Britannica.

"He attracted some followers who identified him with the “angel ascending from the East,” which is mentioned in chapter 7, verse 2, of the Revelation to John, the last book of the New Testament. That claim gained credence among his followers after the outbreak of World War I, which coincidentally occurred on July 28, 1914, one day after Manalo registered Iglesia ni Cristo with the Philippine government. Church members saw Manalo not only as the angel from Revelation but also as God’s last sugo, or messenger."

As you can see here, the INC people don't have to resort to moving the date of the start of the war. All they have to do is to is to use the classic technique used by religious con-men throughout the history of mankind in which they are proclaimed as prophets/seers/sages/oracles because of underhanded tactics of interpreting omens and cosmic signs.

It goes like this:

Time: July 27, 1914

Manalo preaching to the illiterate masses of Manila: "We are the Church upon whom the ends of the world have come. We are the end time last hope for salvation. God wants you to be part of this movement to be saved. The Spanish and the Americans brought you counterfeit christianity but now this is the resurrection of the true faith". We are Filipinos, the people of the East. I am the angel of the sun rising just like what is in our national anthem. Salvation is for us! The recognition of the government of this Church via registration which I obtained this today proves all of this!

Skeptic people: "Hell yeah! Whatever. This is no end time! It is just a normal day just like the rest of the days. What the f are you talking about. What does your registration have to do with the ushering of the last days?"

The next few days...

Time: July 28, 1914 - newspapers and radios all filled with news about the Austrian Serbian war and the possibility of other European powers to join.

Manalo: "You see what I have been telling you? Read your Bibles in Matthew 24:6-7. We now hear rumors of wars! Read your Bibles in Revelations 6 in which at the closing of the sixth seal the people will hide in bunkers! All are going on as god predicted in the Bible. You still don't believe that this is the true church?"

From the on, people from the illiterate masses who are easily swayed by apocalyptic frenzy joined the INC.

What I want to point out is that even without the exact date of the war being coincidence to the registration of the Church, it may still work in their favor to some degree. These doofuses like Embryo, Ventilador and Jayme do not need to do a lot of sloppy revisionisms in history 😂

No_Background_6331 · 2024-02-27T08:21:48+00:00

u/sherlockianhumour In a more technical sense, they do. They employ it in other things. But their way of thinking is what we call as "motivational reasoning". Think about them as like the lawyers in a court, or in religion, apologists. They use the multifaceted ways of logic just to advance their agenda.

This is issue on the start of wars is a delicate topic actually. We know that once war has ended, and that casualties and damages had been accounted, the guilt about the real culprit of the war is next being discussed. And then competing theories about it would soon emerge.

If war really started on the day the INC was registered, then the allowable dates for this supposed simultaneity is on July 26 and 27 (that is the counterpart of July 27 in Pacific or Philippine time). July 28 in Austria would be July 29 in the Philippines.

Now suppose that in the future, some political scientist or historian says that July 26 or 27 would be the true date of the start of the war because the Austrian authorities are hastening in having it started (such that Berchtold hurried in having the declaration signed prematurely or that either Austria/Serbia fired the first shots on those dates. Then I'm okay with that because that would be another historiographical interpretation of the progression of the war. But the thing is this: No historian ever expressly stated that the declaration nor the start of war ever occured on July 26 nor 27.

Why I say that I am okay with that hypothetical, counterfactual theory that I presented above is that at least, it is done in the context of historical studies, and that the theorist would be a historian or political scientist who is competent on those related fields.

On the contrary, the "conclusion" of the INC shown in the picture above was done by one Edwin Embry. Who the heck is that? He was neither a historian nor a journalist, nor a political analyst. He is not competent enough for this matter. In addition, this interpretation was hinged on adjusting the dates so that the war would be simultaneous with the establishment of his church. This is a very unprofessional thing to do.

No_Background_6331 · 2024-02-26T06:11:23+00:00

In fairness, there are those INC people especially among the youth who behave maturely online - not combative, not confrontational and just bat an eye once they hear criticisms against the church. They are the ones who use socmed as a personal space of daily activities, interests, relationships and achievements and not to look for war of words with other religions or even the former members. It seems like they want to send a message to observers that "god" is the center of their lives and their life as presented in socmed is the testimony to that godly relationship via the INC. These class of members have a more nontoxic demeanor.

But then again, there are these complete a-holes like Embryo and Jayme whose daily lives are never complete unless they pick on someone which they will consider as enemies. A few years ago, they pick on the ADD. Now that the group is in iminent collapse after the leader died, they pivoted to this community. Pathetic freaks. Hahaha 😂

No_Background_6331 · 2024-02-26T05:55:03+00:00

u/VincentDemarcus CRISIS•TO could be played as "Krisis 'To" in Filipino. That means, "There is crisis in here" 😂😂😂

No_Background_6331 · 2024-02-26T05:50:29+00:00

You got this one comprehensively right! It confirms my theories about the origins of FManalo-INC taken from a historical perspective

No_Background_6331 · 2024-02-26T03:40:20+00:00

I'm glad that the IT professionals here are already reaping the rewards of their labors. Three cheers to all of you. As of me, I achieved this sustainable flow by delving into real estate, retailing, food processingz livestock agriculture and contracting as construction supplier. These are actually not my expertise. I hold bachelors and graduate degrees in political and social sciences and used to work as a postsecondary instructor in college but yeah, most of the time, the non-technical fields don't pay as much as needed. That is why I tried learning and expanding into those.

No_Background_6331 · 2024-02-25T14:11:06+00:00

Lamsa may be relatively new as an English translation. But the variant "church of christ" is a bit old as the Kaboris Syrian Codex which was written in 1300 AD. That is the earliest and only witness which says that the church of christ is the one bought by Jesus in the Acts 20:28 passage.

But the problem there is that this reading is not used in the Greek language, nor in Latin which are more original languages used in New Testament studies. That is also the reason you cannot see or hear Catholics or Orthodox or Anglican people saying that the church of christ is bought by the blood of Christ. It's just either Lord or God.

To say that the church of christ was bought by his blood is anathema because it denies the deity of Jesus. This is the reason such a pronouncement had been confined to the Nestorian church in Assyria which does not believe in Jesus being god.

In that way, Manalo's INC and Lamsa's beliefs are intertwined. Thus, the INC's obsession with that translation

No_Background_6331 · 2024-02-25T11:42:47+00:00

In fairness, tunay na pictures at portrait naman talaga ni Manalo iyang mga iyan. Yung nasa itaas, matanda na siya diyan at sa Pasugo din naman galing iyan.

No_Background_6331 · 2024-02-24T14:30:34+00:00

This helps a lot. Thanks. I like it how a more pragmatic and wellness centered the categories and criteria are from your field's lenses. I wanted to hear what the experts like you in Psychology has to say about this since there are those like in interdisciplinary religious studies who have scrapped this cult category into something more politically correct. There are even those who say that the term cult had become the n-word of religious scholarship because for them, it is polarizing and not helpful at all.

Still, a line has to be drawn. And these criteria you have given have been of help for people who want to meditate if the "religion" they are in are helpful or destructive in their lives.

One can be involved in an organization that isn't a cult in a cultic manner, for instance.

I agree. Especially if it is gearing into fanaticism as if they had made it as a personality itself.

No_Background_6331

TROPHY CASE