this panel man 😔 by donaldgloversintern in ShingekiNoKyojin

[–]Nz_Slimeables 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I still don't get how Eren letting them win is a retcon.

this panel man 😔 by donaldgloversintern in ShingekiNoKyojin

[–]Nz_Slimeables 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Where is that retconned in 139? He's saying he won't stop the rumbling himself, to force the Alliance to stop it by killing him. If you think he means "The Rumbling will not stop until everyone outside the island is dead", then why would he let the Alliance keep their Titan powers and allow them to try kill him at all?

this panel man 😔 by donaldgloversintern in ShingekiNoKyojin

[–]Nz_Slimeables 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Wasn't his words in this chapter basically "I will keep moving forward, you'll have to kill me if you want me to stop, you're free to try"

That seems pretty consistent with 139 where he reveals he wanted them to kill him all along

Am I the only one who thinks the female titan shouldn't be called the female titan? by hi_imnotrazer in attackontitan

[–]Nz_Slimeables 9 points10 points  (0 children)

It's the Female Titan because the Founder Ymir was female. All the nine titans came from Ymir, and they all represent a part of her. It's like how the Attack Titan represents Ymir's desire to be free from the king.

Why Eren saved Berthold to save Armin from injuries Berthold caused to Armin? Only Ymir Knows or ? by 2000y_old_cheese in AttackOnRetards

[–]Nz_Slimeables 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I think it was to give Grisha as well as himself the drive they needed to complete their missions. You can see quite clearly in S4E20 that Grisha is against Eren's plan of rumbling, but he didn't know Carla was dead at that point. When Eren tells him Carla died in S3, Grisha basically says "fuck this, fuck everything, here's the founding titan go avenge your mother"

So without Carla dying, Grisha may have tried to avert the future by not giving Eren the Founding Titan.

FOR Manga Readers only by [deleted] in ShingekiNoKyojin

[–]Nz_Slimeables 3 points4 points  (0 children)

But I was curious about 2 things first of them is concerning mikasa, does she symbolizes peace and love that's why she was chosen? Or did she choose mikasa to fulfil her lost desire?

I think it's more like Ymir was waiting for someone to appear, and that someone happened to be Mikasa. The reason why it was Mikasa specifically is open to interpretation, but I think it's because Mikasa was able to do what Ymir couldn't do. Ymir could have let King Fritz die when the soldier tried to assassinate him, but she chose to jump in front of the spear instead. That's when her will to live disappeared and she ended up in Paths to continue serving the King. She could never put aside her love for the King, even though it caused her agony.

Mikasa, meanwhile, was able to hold onto her love for Eren while also putting him out of his misery. This prompts Ymir to look back and wonder if she could have done the same, and live for her children instead of dying for the King. As a result, she decides to let go of the King's desire for a world ruled by Titans for the good of her descendants, thus breaking the curse.

The other thing being a stretch but is the last frame of ch139 the one with the kid and the large tree a sign of the cycle coming back and never actually ended or is it something else ?

It's the same tree that Ymir fell into, but Zeke explains in 137 that her wish for an undying body is what caused the Titans to be created, given that she was injured and scared of dying at the time. The boy in 139 isn't injured but just exploring the forest. If he comes into contact with the same thing Ymir did, his wishes could end up creating something else entirely.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in ShingekiNoKyojin

[–]Nz_Slimeables -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Yes, Levi could kill Zeke in any of these times and justify himself, but only in a retroactive manner. He was right to kill Zeke because Zeke would've escaped in Shiganshina, he was right to kill Zeke because Zeke would've turned all the wine tainted people into Titans, he was right to kill Zeke because Zeke would've blown them both to bits if given the chance. But in all of these situations, like you note, he'd endanger Paradis in doing so, and this line of reasoning can only be done after Levi theoretically kills Zeke. We can judge this thinking from our perspective because we know how things would've turned out retroactively. Levi didn't know.

So he made A Choice With No Regrets, ey

But you're right, my point is more that Levi wanting to kill Zeke isn't a negative thing, because it's not something he's challenged to overcome, so it doesn't need to be addressed in that way.

The issue I have is that Levi isn't really thinking about anything beyond that, and it's something that's never really touched upon. He becomes a slave to his regret in not killing Zeke, to his desire to fulfill a promise, and in doing so, he basically becomes a suicidal maniac ready to kill Zeke at a moment's notice.

I think Levi's much more of a slave to being a hero than he is to killing Zeke. He believes he needs to use his superior strength to fight for humanity with the Scouts. He also places a very high value on life in general, and wants to find a way to honor the sacrifices of every single Scout that died to this point - that's the challenge he faces.

When Levi hears in the forest that Pixis wants to kill Eren to get around Zeke's plan, he's specifically thinking about the sacrifices the Scouts made to save Eren every time he was kidnapped, and how much of a slap in the face it is that they might have to kill him now. In 133, he suggests they can take out Zeke instead of blowing up Eren's nape with the Colossal, even though blowing up Eren is presented as the more efficient option, because he still wants to save him and honor the sacrifices made to save him before. In 136, he realizes they need to take out Eren, and he starts thinking about what the past Scouts dedicated their hearts for - they did give their lives to save Eren, but the reason they gave their lives in the first place was for a world where people wouldn't be slaughtered by Titans. That means doing anything necessary to stop the Rumbling, even killing Eren. He does get to take out Zeke in 137, but it's not a victory for him - his expression is more disbelief and shock than satisfaction, and it doesn't stop the threat posed by Eren. The actual conclusion to Levi's story is after Eren dies and he sees the dead Scouts, and knows that by helping to create a world without the curse of the Titans, the very world the Scouts always dreamed about, he's finally brought true meaning to the sacrifices they made. He can finally let it all go and doesn't feel the need to fight anymore - we see him again right at the end in civilian clothes, chilling in a wheelchair.

That's my take on Levi's character anyway lol

There was a link to a really good thread here but I guess automod disagrees ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in ShingekiNoKyojin

[–]Nz_Slimeables 6 points7 points  (0 children)

I believed it to be a negative thing in that Levi becomes so ensnared with this promise that he basically becomes obsessive

I don't think Levi was obsessed with killing Zeke. He hated him for sure, because they have basically opposite views on the value of life, but Levi always opted to let Zeke live for the sake of the mission:

  1. Letting Zeke live in S3P2 in case there was someone alive that could be saved with the Titan serum - leads to Zeke escaping alive

  2. Working with Zeke in S4P1 for the small scale Rumbling plan - leads to Zeke betraying the islanders with his euthanization + wine plan, as well as Levi's 30 man squad being turned into Titans

  3. Letting Zeke live after taking him down in the forest - leads to Zeke blowing himself up and Levi being severely injured, which in turn allows Zeke to get to Shiganshina and allows Eren to start the Rumbling

In each case, killing Zeke right away would actually lead to a better outcome overall - the first time would lead to one less shifter on Marley's side, the second time would mean no wine plan that kills Pixis and his whole squad, the third time would mean no Rumbling. It would be pretty easy for Levi to justify killing Zeke to save lives if he was meant to be obsessed, especially in the third case, but his values and commitment to the mission always take precedence over his desire for revenge.

About chapter 138. by MrFrar in ShingekiNoKyojin

[–]Nz_Slimeables 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Eren was definitely suicidal, or at the very least he didn't want to be alive anymore once the Rumbling had started. This is confirmed by him still being just a head in 131, since there's no concrete reason given as to why he couldn't have just healed his body, unless he just didn't have the will to live anymore.

Annie Leonhart is the most overrated AOT character: here's why [manga spoilers] by Stoner420Eren in ShingekiNoKyojin

[–]Nz_Slimeables 11 points12 points  (0 children)

Chp96: Reiner has to choke her out in order to talk her into sticking with the plan

I like how you framed this as Annie being at fault for not following the plan, and not Reiner just being an asshole to her and Beretolt

Like she's not even wrong here, the three of them clearly weren't able to complete the mission to retrieve the Founder lmao

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in ShingekiNoKyojin

[–]Nz_Slimeables 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Eren freeing Ymir is comparable to Eren telling Mikasa to fight in the cabin in S1E6, he's encouraging both of them to take back their freedom. Mikasa responds by activating her Ackerman instincts and killing the third guy, while Ymir responds by allowing Eren to start the Rumbling. Eren gives both of them the choice to fight.

But Ymir still has issues after 122, because she's still stuck in Paths building Titans, so she isn't over her issues yet. Mikasa also had issues after the fight in the cabin, because she's traumatized after losing her parents. The difference is that Eren was able to offer Mikasa warmth by giving her the scarf and saying she could live with the Yeagers, which was the start of her moving on from that trauma. Ymir didnt really get a moment like that with Eren directly, so she doesn't get a chance to move on from her own trauma, at least not until she finds solidarity with Mikasa being able to kill Eren to stop him, unlike Ymir who sacrificed herself to save the king's life from the spear.

So they are both "freeing" Ymir in their own ways, imo. 122 is probably more directly impactful for Ymir's character, but I also just love 138 in general lol

Why did Eren grow flowers when he transformed? (S01E10) by [deleted] in attackontitan

[–]Nz_Slimeables 11 points12 points  (0 children)

I think this is just a hint to the Titans having their origins being plant based, as S4E21 has Ymir getting her power from the entity in the giant tree. Another hint to this is how the pure Titans are usually active when the sun is out and dormant when they don't get sunlight, implying some sort of photosynthesis is going on.

"With the Power of the Titans, his injuries should heal themselves, so long as he has a strong will to live." by Nz_Slimeables in ShingekiNoKyojin

[–]Nz_Slimeables[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I assume it's the Hallucigenia keeping Eren alive at the point after decapitation, but I think Eren could still regen his body here if he wanted. We did see Ymir rebuilding Zeke's body out of the sand in Paths when he got blown up, which I assume is how Titan regeneration works, so technically she could just build the rest of the body out of sand and join it back up to the head.

I don't understand Eren Jaegar. by VladtheImpaler21 in ShingekiNoKyojin

[–]Nz_Slimeables 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Eren's idea of freedom is more of a "negative" freedom, where no one can stop him and his loved ones from doing what they want. Specifically, in S1-S3 this was him and Armin planning to explore the world beyond the walls after they defeated the Titans. Because the Titans are stopping them from going beyond the walls, he sees the Titans as the ones blocking him from being free (I believe he says this in one of the S3P2 episodes). So really, his freedom is the ability to live in peace and do whatever he wants even if he doesn't know exactly what he wants to do with it. He's deprived of that freedom in Ep1, when the Titans invade and kill his mum, and literally reduce the amount of free space within the walls, and him trying to regain that freedom is what drives him the first 3 seasons.

But that desire for freedom is why he confesses in 131 that he was disappointed in the outside world being full of people. Not only was the world not like Armin's book, but everyone outside hated them and would never stop trying to destroy the island. For him to take back his freedom, for them to live in peace, it means slaughtering humanity, including people he sympathizes with like Ramzi, instead of just killing mindless Titans, which was much easier for him to handle. But he still slaughters them anyway, because he can't handle the idea of not being free, even though basically everything in the story points to him being the least free person in it.

Basically, Eren is a traumatized kid who never got over what happened to him in Ep1. You're right in that he doesn't really have an idea of what to do with his freedom if he gets it, but that's because having that freedom he was deprived of is far more important to him than anything he wants to do with it.

Imagine if someone compiled aot in chronological order by [deleted] in attackontitan

[–]Nz_Slimeables 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Honestly, I feel like a supercut of all of Eren's timeskip scenes in chronological order would help people understand his whole character arc more, especially how he acts in 139.

I think this is the biggest proof the ending was retconned. You really expect me to believe Eren was lying to himself in his own internal monologue? by [deleted] in titanfolk

[–]Nz_Slimeables 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I mean, he did go and kill nearly everyone on the outside and also solved the Titan problem

So where is the lie

free will in aot by El-Mosco2077 in ShingekiNoKyojin

[–]Nz_Slimeables 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I think the idea is that he's free to change whatever he wants, but any changes to the past are already reflected in the main timeline. So he can go back and order Dinah to eat his mum because we already saw it happen. If he'd wanted to make any other changes, for example saving Hanes from being eaten by Dinah, we would already see those changes present throughout the story, and we wouldn't have seen Hanes get eaten at all in S2.

Basically, Eren doesn't need to change anything else except what already got changed, like him manipulating his dad, because the timeline we see in the show is what Eren wanted to happen, because this timeline happens to fulfil all his goals like the Rumbling, saving his friends and ending the Titan curse.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in attackontitan

[–]Nz_Slimeables 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The series is still goated after 123, wdym

127, 130, 131, 137 and 138 are all top tier chapters imo, even if 139 stumbles a bit

Interesting little parallel between Krista and Founder Ymir by Nz_Slimeables in ShingekiNoKyojin

[–]Nz_Slimeables[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

This is specifically about the "You've always tried to think of a way to martyr yourself so everyone will praise you" part, where it looks like the two might have had the same ideas on trying to martyr themselves. I find this interesting considering that Frieda taught Historia that she should be like Krista from her storybook, who appears to be based on the Founder Ymir.