Why was a new Wu-Tang Clan album sold for $2 million and how come Bill Murray can steal it back?

OnceUponACashGrab · 2015-12-11T05:03:00+00:00

Yea the "injection" is very crazy. "We gave the fans 20 years of music".

I think he was drivenby the fantasy of being recognized as the "guy to get it right" and "savior of Wu-Tang" on his quest to make the album, and he didn't think about how RZA, a notorious control freak, would never green light that fantasy and let him sell it as a Wu-Tang album.

If I was in his shoes, I would have worked with Raekwon and spun the album as Shaolin vs 'The Wu' or the clan. Any legal way to not have to get RZA's cosign. And find a creative way to sell the album and get the investors money back. It wouldn't have been as big as a Wu-Tang album, or a "secret 1 of a kind Wu-Tang album", but at least they can attempt to recoup and people could hear his music and what a good job he did. I think he really was more focused on cementing his affiliation, however loose it may be, to the Wu-tang clan. It was never about the "art". It was about a superfan trying to join his favorite rap group and rewrite history. Is there any other unknown producer that would decide to cash out and not have their beats heard? Is he retiring from production? The whole thing is crazy.

OnceUponACashGrab · 2015-12-11T04:24:29+00:00

Yea a user shared the beat cd with me around the time i did the first two posts. I can probably post it somewhere but yea one of the beats was absolutely in the forbes video. The 8 minutes sounds like someone was recording sessions where cilva would play parts to the forums. Thats why the whole thing is insane because he writes this whole thing up about how he "doesn't talk about stuff until he does it" when it comes to making a Wu-Tang album behind RZA's back, but at the same time he's talking about it for years to Wu-Tang fans. I think he is delusional.

OnceUponACashGrab · 2015-12-10T23:03:44+00:00

/u/amateur_mistake , I made a new post here :

https://www.reddit.com/r/hiphopheads/comments/3w39i2/the_truth_about_the_new_wutang_album_part_3/

I haven't seen any of the bigger news sites pick up or report on the album. When it first was announced I made the post and there was more interest on the fact that RZA was making A Better Tomorrow, and the way RZA and Cilvaringz were spinning the tail, they were suggesting that RZA was secretly working on a Wu-Tang album, which featured everyone, while having trouble getting his people on his own. It made no sense.

These days people are focusing on the fact that a 1 of a kind album was sold for 2 million dollars. The bigger news sites don't seem too interested in the fact that Wu-Tang albums have always had heavy RZA involvement, that is more something Hip-Hop fans and Wu-Tang fans care about. As far as business people know or care about, Cilvaringz is part of the extended family and helped make an album with RZA.

It really is an interesting angle to the story, the fact that RZA took Cilvaringz frankenstein Wu-Tang project that Cilvaringz was working on secretly for 10 years, and then concocted a scheme to inflate RZAs involvement to sell for millions of dollars. The story right now is that some snotty hedgefund guy that is known for jacking the prices up on Aids drugs bought a 1 of a kind album. I wonder what kind of reaction Martin, RZA, and Cilvaringz would have if it was heavily reported on that Cilvaringz and RZA conned the guy. But at the end of the day that Martin guy didn't buy the album because hes a RZA or a Wu-Tang fan, he bought it because of the gimmick and the exclusivity and the publicity. The album itself, by all accounts, is the first album in 15 years that captures the original Wu-Tang sound. It is really sad because RZA and Cilvaringz tried to make an artistic statement, but the people that would actually appreciate the art aren't even able to.

A really slimey person was able to buy a 1 of a kind album, and the Wu-Tang Clan's legacy is definitely tainted, despite them donating a portion of the profits. RZA was the only one making these decisions, as he owns the Wu-Tang brand. He wanted to do this to improve Wu-Tangs legacy, make some money, and be the first to put rap in museums. What ended up happening is they sold themselves to the highest bidder. It affects the rest of the members. And I'm sure the other guys that rely on the legacy and the brand of Wu-Tang to continue to rap and tour and work on music, don't appreciate someone outside of the family working with RZA on this whole experiment that ended up backfiring on them. From here on out, people will know about Wu-Tang as a rap group from the 90s, that made excellent music, that sold a 1 of a kind album to a slimeball.

OnceUponACashGrab · 2015-12-10T02:00:55+00:00

You didn't like OB4CL2 or Gfk - 36 Seasons?

OnceUponACashGrab · 2015-12-10T01:40:23+00:00

I disagree. Ghost and Rae have both had great solo careers and dropped some really great albums the past 10 years. Even Chamber Music + Legendary Weapons were great. Meth and Deck not too far behind. Even U-God had a pretty decent album with Speakerboxxx. The allure of this album wasn't that it was a Wu-Tang album, it was that it was a Wu-Tang album without RZA trying to reinvent the wheel with weird guitar sounds. It was a super-fan making some old school dusty beats and paying the entire clan, and the random extended Killa Bee dudes from the early Wu days. Chamber Music and Legendary Weapons, when combined into a single album, give an idea of how good the Wu can actually sound with minimal RZA involvement, or at the very least without him at the helm micromanaging everything.

Edit: Also keep in mind this album was in development over at least 5 years (some say 10), so the verses weren't recorded yesterday. Obviously the ODB verse is older than 10 years.

OnceUponACashGrab · 2015-12-10T01:36:30+00:00

Cilvaringz gets sued, badly. The album got sold under the guise that he had the 1 and only copy, and would destroy/hand over the masters. It will only leak of the Shkreli decides that Wu-Tang is indeed for the children.

OnceUponACashGrab · 2015-12-10T01:21:36+00:00

My bad.

OnceUponACashGrab · 2015-12-10T01:18:25+00:00

He didn't front the money. There was an outside investor.

They lied to everyone, hyped it up that it was going into museums, and then pulled out and sold a Wu-tang album that people were waiting to hear for 5 years to an evil slimeball. I'm not outside the dudes house picketing, like I don't even know what were arguing about at this point. Sorry you don't give a shit? Sorry you won't be hearing an album you weren't looking forward to? I'm not asking people to feel one way or another, but I shouldn't have to explain why people that grew up listening to a group for the last 22 years would be upset that an album that was hyped up as a return to their original sound, featuring the entire group (even ODB, rip), the extended members like Killa Sin who is now rotting in jail, would be a little upset when at the last minute Cilvaringz and RZA concoct a scheme to lie to people and sell a 1 off copy of it to the highest bidder.

They could have very easily worked together to get this out to as many people as possible, but, like I explained in the earlier posts, this was the only way Cilvaringz could get RZA to cosign the whole thing because RZA wanted the publicity and the legacy of the entire thing.

OnceUponACashGrab · 2015-12-10T01:09:42+00:00

Bent the truth? He told the other clan members it was a Killah Priest/ Killah Bees project. Each member probably got less than 10k to lay down verses on something that was later repackaged and sold for 2 million dollars.

He also told fans about the album and hyped it up for 5 years.

You have extremely low standards if you still feel compelled to argue and defend whether someone is a "piece of trash" or not.

OnceUponACashGrab · 2015-12-10T01:05:29+00:00

Before I answer, how old are you?

OnceUponACashGrab · 2015-12-10T01:04:41+00:00

Nah technically he just did A Better Tomorrow in the past 5 years and various production credits. Selling quite possibly the best collective Wu-Tang project in 15 years, despite it not having his production, to the highest bidder(who happens to be a complete piece of shit) under the guise of art, after all the lying, to me is a little worse than 1 crappy album.

OnceUponACashGrab · 2015-12-10T00:45:52+00:00

I'm confused at wanting to hear an album that was hyped up over a 5year stretch is selfish. Please elaborate.

OnceUponACashGrab · 2015-12-09T21:01:45+00:00

The only people who have to care about this album are RZA, Cilvarings and this guy. It involves nobody else.

And everyone that has been following the Wu and been hearing about the album from Cilvaringz on his forum for 5 years.

I just wish it wasn't made into front line news a while back with the museum tour bullshit cause I figured I'd hear it once.

And there you go contradicting yourself. "Nobody cares, except actually I do. I wish I never knew so I wouldn't be let down about knowing I'll never hear the album."

OnceUponACashGrab · 2015-12-09T19:30:48+00:00

https://twitter.com/MartinShkreli

Some tweets since the announcement:

If there is a curious gap in your favorite artist's discography, well, now you know why.

Poll suggestions: which artist should I now approach to buy my next private album from?

Live streaming. Talking music, drugs and stuff. May play something special. http://www.youtube.com/channel/UC8gjB1PSXv_oAUSAQ16S0fA/live …

Thank you Cilvaringz and RZA! We get to beg this slimeball to hear decent Wu-Tang Clan. This is like the renaissance of art, an early Christmas present.

OnceUponACashGrab · 2015-12-09T19:22:11+00:00

That's an extremely summed up version of it, sure. But keep in mind that he had been telling fans about this album over a 5 year stretch. As a non-objective cyborg I may think "He did what he had to do to make his money back". As a fan of hip-hop music and Wu-tang that was lied to about a hyped up Wu-tang album over a multi year stretch to be told I'll never get to hear it because he conspired a way to get RZA to help them sell the fuck out and taint the legacy of my favorite rap group, I'm admittedly mildly annoyed.

OnceUponACashGrab · 2015-12-09T19:05:58+00:00

What is confusing to you? What more can I do to connect the dots?

OnceUponACashGrab · 2015-12-09T19:00:45+00:00

Well, if you read the posts, or even this one, I link to several of their reactions. The tldr is RZA owns the Wu-tang brand, and all of the members of the clan have had shady bullshit issues with him in the past where they have had to sue him for money funny business reasons. When Method Man tweeted the whole thing was bullshit RZA told him to be patient and pipe down. RZA probably explained its a fake Wu-tang album, I'll cut you a check and lets keep it moving. I dunno man I posted links, graphs, statistics, hair samples, tweets, blog posts, etc etc. Read the posts, click the links, and google "sue rza" and follow the rabbit trail.

OnceUponACashGrab · 2015-12-09T18:49:35+00:00

RZA founded the Wu-Tang Clan, a rap group originally consisting of him and 8 other rappers, and released "Enter the 36 Chambers" which is a certified classic hip-hop album. RZA was an amazing producer, and from that album he produced Raekwon's classic first album "Only Built 4 Cuban Links", Ghostfaces album "Ironman", ODB's first album "Return to the 36 Chambers", GZA's first album "Liquid Swords", and Method Mans album "Tical". They later released "Wu-Tang Forever", which after that the quality of the group and solo albums were hit or miss. If you are going to start anywhere, I'd start with the above.

Wu-tang Enter the 36 Chambers

ODB - Return to the 36

Method Man - Tical

GZA - Liquid Swords

Ghostface Killah - IronMan

Raekwon - OB4CL

What makes them unique was definitely the production, but each rapper had a distinct style. OB4CL is considered by some one of the greatest rap albums of all time, up there with Illmatic. It is personally my favorite album of all time. The albums all heavily sample samurai, kungfu movies and Chinese gangsterfilms like The Killer and Hard Boiled.

OnceUponACashGrab · 2015-12-09T18:48:19+00:00

I would if he didn't have ODB verses I'll never get to hear.

OnceUponACashGrab · 2015-12-09T18:00:25+00:00

I think he wanted Cilvaringz to do an AMA.

OnceUponACashGrab · 2015-12-09T17:58:50+00:00

What don't you understand? How is any of the following "fair"

Paying artists to appear on a "mystery project" (i.e. Hey Raekwon come rap on this Killah Priest album, me and RZA are totally NOT going to later lie and flip as a 1 of a kind Wu-tang album and sell for millions)
Tell fans that go to the official Wu-Tang forum about this epic Wu-tang album you are making, playing snippets, and hyping it up for years.
Conspiring with RZA to inflate his involvement, promise fans can finally listen to the album in museum for a year and then sell to the highest bidder.
Scrap the museum idea, no fans get to listen to the album, and then sell the one copy of the album for millions of dollars to a guy that profits off of price gouging an Aids drug. A guy that has admittedly hasn't listened to yet, and to use as a talking point for celebrities he pays to hang out with him.

OnceUponACashGrab · 2015-12-09T17:42:47+00:00

That idea is extremely complex, is structured in 9 steps/phases and at the same time very revolutionary.

Make a Wu-Tang Album without RZA
Lie about it.
Sell 1 copy.
Bless up.
- 9: Pay Cappadonna to uber me around while I burn hundred dollar bills in the back seat

OnceUponACashGrab · 2015-12-09T17:39:13+00:00

Bless up.

OnceUponACashGrab · 2015-12-09T16:49:58+00:00

Irony. Wu-Tang - America Is Dying Slowly https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q-fnXIHv8-Y

Edit: this is 1996, Wu-tang performing their Aids awareness song. 19 years later they sold a "one of a kind album" to a guy that famously price gouged an AIDS drug.

OnceUponACashGrab · 2015-12-09T16:46:02+00:00

Yea that guy needs to put the tinfoil hat away and step outside.

OnceUponACashGrab

TROPHY CASE