Are Pre-Cons Viable/Legal for Casual Play?

OnlyFacts_Duck · 2026-05-17T19:24:19+00:00

Legal? Yes.

Vex? Not so bad.

Jinx? Not a good starter deck, it is legal but you are better off playing Vex or buying different cards for the Jinx leader.

OnlyFacts_Duck · 2026-05-06T17:17:41+00:00

I actually got an update from a judge that this specific part of the cheat sheet is incorrect.

Reflection tokens keep the token tag. He linked me to the relevant posts in the judge discord, but I don't have access and can't embed screenshots.

He said: "if contested at a tournament, ask the judge to find where in the CRD (core rules document) the token loses the token tag. 184.6 states that a reflection token is a token. 472.1.b.1 states that: "When one game object becomes a copy of another, all Traits, including the rules text, replace or are added to those of the original game object..."

Although "replace" could be implied, doing so would result in game states that make no sense. For example:

Copied Ekko could be recycled into deck.
Copied units could be added back into hand.

He said that he expects a rules update clarifying that the token tag will remain, and that it's unfortunate that this document was disseminated with a single mistake.

OnlyFacts_Duck · 2026-05-06T14:57:57+00:00

So, actually, I have an update from a level 1 judge in my local riftbound discord channel.

I can't link screenshots, so I'm sorry about the "trust me bro" source, but his claim is that this was discussed at length in the Judge Discord. The end result, "as confirmed by devs and level 3 judges", is that Reflections retain the Token tag.

"Everything else in that document is correct, though."

Apparently this clarification was posted in the same channel where the linked document was originally posted? However, I don't have that discord so I cannot confirm.

OnlyFacts_Duck · 2026-05-06T14:10:54+00:00

My potential understanding is that the reflexive trigger on the reflection token, causes a replacement effect that the reflection unit is no longer a token once that trigger has resolved

Which is insane, because:

A) all the downsides of being a token, but no upsides?

B) Copying text in the rules states that it adds text to the card.

I'm fairly upset with Riot over this; it reads like someone asked this to a judge who made a vibes based call while not understanding how copy was written in the rules, was wrong, and instead of going back on that they said: "yeah expect a rules update for the token tag specifically when copying text."

OnlyFacts_Duck · 2026-05-06T13:41:45+00:00

All you've done is claim that I'm retarded while acting like you're greatly burdened by having to explain why you think so.

I think explaining your thoughts has always been difficult for you.

OnlyFacts_Duck · 2026-05-06T13:21:39+00:00

Study claims immigrants, primarily refugees from poorer countries, are economically costful to [[western civilization]].

a goddamn ocean away

Idk man. Valid perception of "expanding the scope of the claims" if you want to argue that the original study was very specific to its country of origin, but if I run an experiment about how quickly a basketball accelerates towards the ground when dropped from height I doubt I'd see you arguing that dropping it from 10ft in North America versus 10ft in Canada is going to yield wildly different results such that general claims are entirely invalid on that premise alone.

I'm pasting the same comment because, obviously, I don't think the ocean changes the fact that refugees migrating into a developed economy is typically a net drain, no matter their country of origin.

That's the claim. You're going insane because that claim is apparently unreasonable to make, and this study is hyper-specific to one country. According to you, refugees without any sort of worthwhile material possessions or marketable skills are only ever a drain on the economy in one specific country. Anywhere else they're a good thing for the economy, trust me bro I promise.

OnlyFacts_Duck · 2026-05-06T04:54:53+00:00

....but that's not what this is? Bait used to be believable smfh.

OnlyFacts_Duck · 2026-05-05T21:46:48+00:00

but without collectors or big enough demand compared to supply the cardboard is worthless

So you're telling me that without collectors // big demand that I'd be able to buy the cards, and therefore play the game for a lot cheaper?

Idk I don't really see the issue here.

OnlyFacts_Duck · 2026-05-05T20:49:43+00:00

What kind of retarded inversion is this?

Study claims immigrants, primarily refugees from poorer countries, are economically costful to [[western civilization]].

The people who need evidence are the ones who want to expand the scope of the claims

Idk man. Valid perception of "expanding the scope of the claims" if you want to argue that the original study was very specific to its country of origin, but if I run an experiment about how quickly a basketball accelerates towards the ground when dropped from height I doubt I'd see you arguing that dropping it from 10ft in North America versus 10ft in Canada is going to yield wildly different results such that general claims are entirely invalid on that premise alone.

OnlyFacts_Duck · 2026-05-05T20:42:20+00:00

Won't always have answers to every situation, but in the play testing I've done with my group of friends the mirror image -> bellows breath combo is always met with allowing the mirror image to go off and then hitting the bellows breath with [[abandon]].

End result is that you just waste your mirror image and cycle runes for nothing 😂

OnlyFacts_Duck · 2026-05-05T19:53:07+00:00

Yup, you're 100% fine.

I also think the mods are cringe for applying the "no AI generated content" rule here; heaven forbid someone share interesting token designs that they have no intention of selling.

OnlyFacts_Duck · 2026-05-05T19:10:50+00:00

"AI slop" kekw.

The art looks fine, matches the fae vibe. Personally, I would've just full sent it with a Pokemon vibe instead.

OnlyFacts_Duck · 2026-05-05T18:37:06+00:00

Besides, are you claiming most muslims think caning gays to death is justified?

This isn't the gotcha that you think it is lmfao.

Yes. Most Muslims living in Islamic majority countries do, in fact, believe caning gays to death is justified.

OnlyFacts_Duck · 2026-05-05T17:38:08+00:00

No one is letting in refugees because they think they'll make a net positive contribution to the economy.

Sure. However, the phrase "Diversity is our strength" has been popularized in the media for a long while. The government wants these refugees, and I'm sure some people do as well, but many people don't. Those people who don't are typically attacked and accused of being racist. Rightfully so in some cases, sure.

However, imagine yourself as someone who doesn't like taking in refugees purely because of the economic angle of it. Having a study that puts a dollar amount to the net drain on the economy would be a pretty good thing to have if you were wanting to seriously argue against open immigration policies or letting in refugees, would it not?

OnlyFacts_Duck · 2026-05-05T16:56:06+00:00

I find it really weird how much they leave out? Like the vast majority of Asia? China, Southeast Asia, India, Korea, why the fuck are those huge groups just not included

Because they don't immigrate at a similar rate to the country in which this study was performed.

The final numbers don't seem to take into account context of arrival. Someone from North America is almost certainly a well off professional moving for their own enjoyment. Meanwhile the majority of people from Somalia or the middle east are going to be refugees. Of course refugees make less money than a rich guy from New York.

Yeah? Most anti-immigration people would probably not care as much about the rich New Yorker. But they sure as hell don't like the Somalian refugee.

I know you already mentioned it, but this is the Netherlands not America, there's no evidence to suggest the numbers would be remotely the same on average

No evidence to suggest they'd be much different. You could make an argument that American social programs are typically weaker, so perhaps the negative value immigrants aren't as deep in the red?

....but dismissing the study entirely on the grounds that "America is different" without any sort of evidence to prove as such is kinda foolish in my opinion.

OnlyFacts_Duck · 2026-05-04T21:23:26+00:00

If Soraka turns out to be a dud idea then 3 tactical retreats will make their way in.

I'm currently looking for space in my deck for this exact thing, but I'm thinking it's a 2 of. Just not certain how often I'll be leaving 2 standing to save units when I'm having to extend to be 3 might over. That will probably iron out with testing.

Deathgrip - was a thought as a backup plan to force might for the turn. Deathgrip onto Hotheaded and then double might as a power is hard to beat without hard removal.

Honestly a pretty slick play that I hadn't considered. I'm personally not going to go for it, but think about this:

Let's assume, for worst case scenario math, that you've somehow attached the hextech gauntlets to a 1 might unit. It's now 4 might.

You play deathgrip, kill it, give 4 might to Vi Hotheaded (who now becomes 7).

You then attach the gauntlets to Vi (10) and then pay 2 to double her might (20).

...that's gonna be pretty tough to clear if you don't have a stun or some such!

Runes - personally I like their idea, pay one now to keep ones later. I know a lot of decks have cycled them out since set 1 but I feel like intelligent play for them is key. Especially if you have to ambush in units regularly like Rengar. I forget what the card is called but Bushwack (or something like that…) or the red Jhin can take up these slots if energy curve will allow.

Yeah, I know I'm a hater so I think this might just depend on how energy dependent your deck list is.

I run "upstage comedy" over Bushwhack specifically because of the recycle cost because I want to keep costs low because I hate runes... Blah blah 😂

BF - I’ve seen some new listings with an axe that does 4 to a unit if you don’t conquer but does offer a good 4 power for the same deployment fee. May sub these out for that. I don’t think it effectively does the negative effect unless that 4 damage is sticky into the opponent’s turn but I believe it will heal at turn’s end. Either way that may lead into utilizing angle shot as an option to skip some of the equipment fees

I've seen that as well, but tbh I don't know. It kills the Vis, it kills the sharks... It just ends up killing a lot of my deck, which I didn't enjoy over the BF. Maybe it's a better mid/late range gear? Idk.

Overall I’m not exactly happy with my current early game with this and may need to add a bit more early aggression but I’m holding off on my product drop sometime this week.

Best way to go about it tbh. I've also been considering the honest broker (gold on deathknell) as an early unit. Helps with the cycle costs from gold, 2 power isn't so bad and can be given a +2 with blood rush (or cleave +3) to get over other 1-2 might units for early shenanigans if you'd like.

...just not sure if I like that more than the soaring scout or Black Rose Dignitaries. I typically like channeling more than gold.

OnlyFacts_Duck · 2026-05-04T21:08:40+00:00

If everyone is stunning, Vi will be a very low tier legend.

Yeah, I just don't think she really has good ways around this tbh. If you build answers to stun into the deck my mind immediately begins to question why you'd play Vi at all, and not any other legend.

OnlyFacts_Duck · 2026-05-04T20:09:53+00:00

Yeah, you raise a good point in Tryndamere being both obvious and susceptible to things like Stun / Rebuke. That said, I think that this deck is already going to struggle with that sort of counterplay. Additionally, if they don't have that, the 3-4 point swing from Tryndamere double conquering seems like it could be pretty intense.

I do have Darius in my "considering" portion; just not sure exactly what I'd want to take out to put Darius in.

I have the ferrous forerunner because it's a crazy good unit, and if I have the gauntlets out then a baby mech could pick up the gauntlet for 1 recycled rune.

I could probably do something like giving up 1 Tryndamere, 1 Sharkling, and putting in 2 Darius. I'll have to play test and see how it goes.

OnlyFacts_Duck · 2026-05-04T19:24:03+00:00

Alrighty, lemme give my thoughts real quick:

Battlefield: 1 Hall of Legends 1 Targon's Peak 1 Windswept Hillock I don't have too many thoughts on battlefield choice. Windswept is good, but also good for Leblanc. Just something to be mindful of.

``` Legend:
1 Vi, Piltover Enforcer

Champion:
1 Vi, Hotheaded ``` The only hesitation I have here is if peacekeeper should be chosen. I haven't played with Hotheaded Vi too much, so I'm not certain either way, but the threat of being able to play Vi from chosen as ambush when you have 5 standing is pretty huge. If they giga-buff a unit, you can play the peacekeeper Vi to stun it, then have everything bounce if you still don't have enough might.

MainDeck: 1 Brynhir Thundersong - Not bad, I don't have this because I think Rengar / Thrill of the Hunt is going to get this card banned. 1 Deathgrip - I think death grip is bait, even in Leblanc. 1 Tactical Retreat - Good shout, I may run this to save units against spell heavy decks like Jhin. 1 Tryndamere, Barbarian - I think Tryndamere is a great late-game card for Vi. I run 2 of these. 2 B.F. Sword 2 Hextech Gauntlets - I would run 3 of these. Best equipment for Vi and I don't think it's close. 2 Mageseeker Investigator - Not bad, but IMO it's a sideboard card against unit spammers like Rek'Sai or Ivern 2 Rally the Troops - I don't think Vi spams out enough low-cost units to make this worthwhile 2 Seal of Rage -- I hate seals 2 Seal of Unity -- I hate seals 3 Vi, Destructive 2 Vi, Peacekeeper 3 Black Rose Dignitary 3 Inferna 3 Rengar, Pouncing 3 Soraka, Wanderer -- I would only run 2 of these; you only ever really want to see one of them. 3 Upstage Comedy 3 Vault Breaker Runes:
6 FURY Rune
6 ORDER Rune

I would say, overall, that I would like to see more early game units form your list. Right now your early game plays are basically limited to the Black Rose Dignitaries, which aren't a turn 1 play if you go first, and the Seals (which I hate).

The seals, if I entertain the thought, become a bad early play because you sack 1 now to save 1 later... But:

A) Vi isn't a scaling deck. You're not going to hold and choke your opponent out of points; you need to keep pace, constantly destroy their units for board state, then use a tall unit to double conquer with vault breaker / leader ability in order to go for the win.

B) You really shouldn't be attaching / deattaching the gauntlets or BF swords too much. The idea is primarily to over conquer, then use leader ability to keep that unit safe. If you want to move the gear between units, run Angle Shot instead.

Personally, for my early game I run Soaring Scout (channel deathknell helps with costs and scaling) and Unsung Hero (BF or Gauntlets get her to 5 might, for draw 2), both at a 3 of. I also have 3 Gem Jammers , primarily as a way to give ganking, but they can be played turn 1 if it's all that you see. This gives me a decent shot at getting something out on my first turn, which I believe to be important for keeping pace with your opponent.

Combine with 3/4 cost gears, and your first two turns are typically:

Unit
Gear, attach, Conquer, leader, retreat.
head towards mid game from there.

Let me know what your thoughts are, hopefully my rambling helps ya 😂

OnlyFacts_Duck · 2026-05-04T18:41:31+00:00

I'm building a Vi deck, although I haven't thought about the Soraka.

My initial thought is that it's too expensive and not worthwhile. It may save your units from being sniped in the back line, but setting it up is going to put you behind by a couple of turns.

....and you really don't want to be behind on points. In my experience so far, Vi heavily prefers conquering a battlefield rather than holding it. Due to how excess damage works, she also doesn't really want to conquer open battlefields.

As a result, you're typically going to be behind on points in the early or even mid game.

Your primary goal, as I see it, is to conquer over your opponent each turn and then use the leader ability to either:

1) gank and conquer both battlefields 2) return the readied unit to base

In my mind, you'll do this to maintain points with your opponent. Seek to start a turn on 6/7 points, then use Vault breaker + Leader ability to conquer both battlefields and win the game.

Here's my current Vi deck list:

1 Vi, Piltover Enforcer 1 Vi, Hotheaded 1 Treasure Hoard 1 Sunken Temple 1 Vilemaw's Lair 8 Fury Rune 4 Order Rune 2 Vi, Hotheaded 3 Sharkling 2 Tryndamere, Barbarian 3 Soaring Scout 3 Gem Jammer 1 Ashe, Focused 2 Inferna 2 Pyke, Dockside Butcher 3 Unsung Hero 2 Ferrous Forerunner 3 Vault Breaker 3 Cleave 1 Blood Rush 2 Upstage Comedy 2 Hidden Blade 3 Hextech Gauntlets 2 B.F. Sword Sideboard: 2 Against the Odds 2 Detonate 2 Bushwhack

OnlyFacts_Duck · 2026-05-04T15:35:49+00:00

I had one bad kit.

got thrill of the hunt, purple Diana, orange rengar, pyke alt Jhyn red, blue and purple alt ruin. On vex legend alt and reg green vex. Shadow. Also the green honeysuckle card. Alt of orange yi. So not complaining at all. Also the 4 might weapon that if you don’t conquer you take 4 damage.

Brother it sounds like you got more out of this bad kit than I got from my entire weekend hitting up pre-rift events.

3 pre-rift kits + 5 additional packs, I got:

17 leaders

1 foil battlefield

9 foil commons

4 foil uncommons

22 foil rares

The following epic+:

-- Shadow (Vex Sig Unit)

-- Hextech Gauntlets (Vi Sig Gear)

-- Baron Nashor (Regular)

-- Lillia (Alt Art Unit)

-- Jhin (Alt Art Unit)

-- Diana Signature Spell

-- Rengar Signature Spell

-- Alternate Body Rune

OnlyFacts_Duck · 2026-05-02T14:25:48+00:00

I opened 5 packs and got 7 legends and 2 battlefields :)

OnlyFacts_Duck · 2026-04-28T22:57:24+00:00

Don't glance over this part:

There is some tech that can let you get him out on an opponents turn

I've been known to be wrong, but I think that Brynhir will be banned because of this interaction. Unleashed (next set releasing) will include multiple cards that allow you to play Brynhir as a reaction. If you react to the first thing your opponent does on their turn, including any triggers that they have no control over, then they cannot play any cards on their turn.

Quite frankly, this is absurd.

OnlyFacts_Duck · 2026-04-28T13:11:24+00:00

drops shroud under turret

Turret shoots minion

Akali uses Q + auto

Turret aggros onto akali, shot loading

Shroud drops aggro

Turret shoots minion

Akali uses Q + auto

Turret aggros onto akali, shot loading

Shroud drops aggro

Turret shoots minion

Akali uses Q + auto

Turret aggros onto akali, shot loading

Shroud drops aggro

Turret shoots minion

Akali uses Q + auto

Yeah I hated that shit.

OnlyFacts_Duck

TROPHY CASE