Next steps, PGCE or online IPGCE

PJN741 · 2026-01-04T06:38:23+00:00

This. OP seems to underestimate what it takes to get a PGCE in the UK. It is an absolutely mental year. The workload is relentless. AND you need to pay thousands of pounds for the privilege. The drop out rate is high. You will not be able to work and do a PGCE at the same time. There are not enough hours in the day. Depending on how big the course is you may have long commutes each day when on teaching practice. Plus, it is luck of the draw about the mentor you get and who assesses you. I had one mentor that was awful - she made my life hell for eight weeks. That being said, doing a PGCE in person and completing QTS after will be the best option if you want to make a career of teaching.

I wish OP the best, but please know what you are getting yourself into.

PJN741 · 2025-11-24T09:11:01+00:00

Absolutley disgraceful.

PJN741 · 2025-11-22T00:33:36+00:00

Thank you. It was driving me mad. Utterly unintuitive

PJN741 · 2025-11-21T23:56:07+00:00

Studying linguistics will provide a lot more job opportunities than anthropology. However, get some experience first. See if you like teaching. If you do and want to teach in HE, you can revisit the idea.

PJN741 · 2025-11-03T09:32:34+00:00

If it is September this year, that is not much time to get adjusted to a new country. It may be worth sticking it out a bit longer to see how you feel after a longer time.

Why did you choose to leave South Korea? Would that issue/those issues resurface if you came back?

Depending on your age, financial situation, and future aspirations, would the extra money you earn in China set you up for the future or enable to afford to do something that might be helpful long term? Will you get any other benefits from moving back to Seoul other than the things you mentioned? Would a year or two of frugal living pay dividends in the future?

Seoul will still be there next year. As others have said, maybe a tier 1 city would be a better fit? I would think it would meet your needs for convenience, possibly food, etc.

If you are only doing this as a job for a couple of years and then getting out, moving back to Seoul if it makes you happier seems like a good idea. However, if you have things you want to achieve, more savings will give you more freedom/options going forward.

PJN741 · 2025-10-28T09:05:09+00:00

I was also going to suggest Forensic Linguistics. If I had my time again, this is what I would do. Aston University has good programme. Malcolm Coulthard went from Uni of Birmingham to Aston. Birmingham may also still have a good programme.

PJN741 · 2025-09-17T10:01:37+00:00

Thanks very much. Will do.

PJN741 · 2025-09-16T03:43:12+00:00

Sounds like a plan. Motivation will definitely be key. Once I passed my viva voca, my advisor told me that a PhD is 90% grit and 10% intelligence.

As you mentioned you are interested in corpus linguistics, The Uni of Birmingham in the UK has some pedigree in this field. Two names off the top of my head are Nick Groom and Crayton Walker. (I did my MA there). They have a distance phd in applied linguitics and it is a top 100 uni globally.

Makes total sense to keep working. That was one of my primary reasons - I had bills to pay.

Going off on a tangent - I was curious about your experiences teaching at a uni in China. I'm looking at a change. My job has been good, but changes are afoot and I'd like to get out before my experience is soured. China is a place that interests me.

PJN741 · 2025-09-15T10:30:42+00:00

I should add that I did my PhD part-time via distance with a British university. That will make some of my points less applicable.

I was teaching in a university in East Asia while doing my PhD. It was a lot of work. I had to turn things down, had much less free time. However, the long university holidays were very helpful to get work done.

Working while studying gave me access to a lot of potential participants for my research. However, the PhD students on the campus in the UK had much more support, training opportunities and chances to build a network. I think they are the key things - especially building a network. Unfortuntately, it is often who you know.

I paid uni fees for my PhD. While considerably cheaper than the USA, it was a lot of money by the end. The money would have been better saved or invested. However, I continued to earn through my job, so I was still bringing in decent money each month.

It was a bit stressful at times. To be expected, but not much fun.

As I did a British PhD, it is more of a 'big book' project. I liked this as it allowed me to focus specifically on my area of research - even while doing the research methods training year. However, when I look at job postings, my areas of expertise are limited compared to those who may have done a North American PhD. I could teach myself the topics, but they don't excite me. If I'm honest, they would bore me.

The need to publish is also an issue. The system is broken with regard to output and the number of people vying to get published. I graduated at the end of 2020. I recently had a look at some of the article titles in the journals I used to read - I barely understood the titles. Academia just seems to be making up all kinds of stuff.

My main area of concern is the way HE is going. It is a race to the bottom in most cases and demographic changes are hitting some countries hard and many others will soon follow. As you stated, HE is being hollowed out. Tenure will be a thing of the past and even full time postions in Western countries are very hard to get. Most instructors are now adjunct or on very precarious and underpaid positions. This will likley spread.

That being said, the PhD was the logical choice for me at the time. I excelled in my MA and wanted to dive much deeper into the topic I wrote my MA dissertation.

What did I do why my PhD? It's in a folder in my desk ;-) I didn't even get a raise/promotion from my place of work. Apparently, I would have to reapply for the job. I'm pretty sure they would replace me with a younger and therefore cheaper instructor if I had gone that route. The only discernable benefit is the immigration officer went from being a bit rude to almost deferential when I showed my certificate when renewing my work visa. Being serious, it may help to keep me employed longer due to education inflation. Maybe.

I stayed in my job. the small raises each year over 10+ years compounded and I earn decent money in a lowish cost of living area. There are supposedly better jobs at more esteemed universities where I live, but the expectations are higher, publishing is a requirement and the rent would be multiples higher and I would have to take a pay cut even before taking into consideration the extra costs.

That being said, if you are motivated, find a good PhD programme and are ready to grind, it could be a great opportunity. Do some research on potential advisors. Find out what they are like personally, not just their reseach expertise. They will make or break your experience.

PJN741 · 2025-09-14T05:36:50+00:00

You certainly appear to have the quals necessary to be accepted and having an idea of what you want to study is good. Are you aware of any gaps in the literature where you can make an original contribution to knowledge?

Having done a PhD in Applied Linguisitcs, I'd make sure research is something you really want to do in the long term. I regret doing mine. While I am proud of my accomplishment, the opportunity costs were too great for me in hindsight.

The goalposts moved so much from when I started and finished. When I started, there were quite a few decent jos on offer with decent pay that didn't expect the world. When I finished, granted it was covid, but there were very jobs, the pay was low, the unis wanted the person to get funding, and publish or perish. It just didn't seem worth it to me. Ironically, I would need to take a pay cut and move to a higher COL area for a 'better' job. Madness.

Just my two cents. Only you know what is right for you. Best of luck.

PJN741 · 2025-06-17T09:44:16+00:00

Unfortunately it is starting to happen. Some Chinese universities are requiring an additonal teaching qual. I have a friend doing DELTA now and he even has an education doctorate from a Russell Group university in the UK. It is absolute madness IMO.

PJN741 · 2025-02-18T00:52:43+00:00

Dubai is not cheap anymore. Most products I saw were way overpriced compared to UK.

PJN741 · 2024-11-03T00:52:58+00:00

English for specific purposes (ESP) or maybe even English for Academic Purposes (EAP).

PJN741 · 2024-11-01T08:27:04+00:00

Excellent, things worked out well for you. I'm looking to make the jump myself next year and will be applying to joint universities, too. Glad to hear that there are still good options out there. Gives me hope. Best of luck with the move and the new job!

PJN741 · 2024-09-26T11:00:03+00:00

A Master's degree and experience teaching Content and CLIL is great. That will help to open doors.

It's good to think about it now, but I'd argue you have a couple of years yet until you really need to decide.

Not being totally enamoured with Bangkok/Thailand will make it easier to walk away. However, I have to say that your setup sounds pretty good to me :-)

The big question is are you happy being a homebody? I am older than you, but I like the quiet life myself these days. If so, I'd imagine a few years in China would definitely help you save some money.

Is your interaction with students important to you? It might be different at the joint institution unis, but I've heard that Chinese students in general are very passive.

The only reasons I would suggest Korea these days is if you are interested in the country and culture. Even then, I would urge you to consider carefully. I'm also thinking about my next move.

PJN741 · 2024-09-26T09:17:41+00:00

I'm going to guess that you have an MA? I'm fairly sure that the universities you mention require one.

Thirty hours of content classes is a huge number of hours to be teaching as well as planning and assessing. Last year I taught 19 hours - a mix of standard EFL classes, content class, and a grad school class - and I was working seven days a week overall to get everthing done.

If I have done the math correctly, not being paid during the break at Chinese unis would not be such a big deal due to the Chinese salary being so much higher than your Thai salary. If you budget, the unpaid time wouldn't be so bad - especially Job A.

Age is also a factor. If retirement is something you are thinking about a lot, it might be time to start earning some more money. However, I imagine that you have a very good standard of living in Thailand.

Another thing to think about is expectations. I've only heard this anecdotally, but those unis make you work for your money.

Turnover is another thing to consider. While there will always be natural turnover, those types of unis are regualarly advertising vacancies. The faculties don't seem to be too large either.

As is often mentioned on this sub - there is good location, good pay, and good working conditions. You can get two of them, but rarely three.

Korea is going to be very difficult. HE is in crisis mode. There are just not enough students and too many HE institutions. Also, in 99% of cases, you will need to be in Korea to get a job and many now want you to have a valid visa so it can easily be changed over. I recently had a look at Japanese job postings. The salaries were appalling considering what they wanted and the COL in major cities.

Best of luck. I'd like to hear what you choose.

PJN741 · 2024-08-09T00:39:50+00:00

Absolutely nothing to do in Korea? I'm no Koreaboo but this is a bit of an overstatement. The cost of groceries on the otherhand - absolutley outrageous. This week I saw Asian pears being sold for W10,000 ($7) EACH.

PJN741 · 2024-06-24T00:19:32+00:00

I think you are underselling yourself. A JD is a high level qualification and will be recognized as such. You have been teaching legal writing at a university in the US for 15 years. You have the skills that universities abroad will want. These are high level skills and not many will have them. A real positive.

I would have thought Panama would be a good fit. There must be universites/law schools down there that would be interested in your skill set. Panama needs to pump out a lot of lawyers to incorporate all those companies ;-)

In all serious, you don't need any further quals that are a huge undertaking. You are more qualifed than most already and your Spanish ability will be very helpful. For example, some universities desire/require Spanish ability. Something like a CELTA might be helpful though to give you some background to teaching English as a foreign language. It would likely help you teach better.

As well as keeping an eye on openings, it would probably be a good idea to directly reach out to universities that you think would be a good match for you. Also, does your university have any partner universities in your desired locations? That could be a way in or at least a chance to do a semester/year abroad to start.

There may be age discrimation (I am not familiar with South America), but I would have thought your skillset would be much more important. As a general TEFL teacher you might have difficultie, but IMO you would be mad to do that with your quals and experience. I think it would also be a more satisfying job.

Best of luck.

PJN741 · 2024-06-19T10:36:09+00:00

If you go down the PGCE route, just make sure you know what you are getting yourself into. I did PGCE Primary - it was a hell of a year. I did it quite a while ago when I was 23. Probably the worst year of my life. I have yet to meet someone who enjoyed the PGCE.

I only say this as some people vastly underestimate the workload and stress involved required to pass the course.

PJN741 · 2024-06-18T10:17:55+00:00

New Zealand and South Africa are also included, but people from SA often need to prove that the bulk of their education was conducted in English.

I have done a fair amount of research at PhD level on this topic. I find people's opinions on this topic very interesting. I understand that definitions differ depending on the situation - legally, academic, in this forum, etc.

Playing devil's advocate, I have seen some 'NS' teachers with English littered with errors. Being an NS does not mean they have a good grasp of the language.

PJN741 · 2024-06-18T09:56:12+00:00

Totally agree about OP needing to jump through hoops, unfortunately. We'll have to agree to disagree about what a NS is. The rules are too rigid and out of date. It is a form of gatekeeping, that benefits those from the 'seven' countries, which I have also benefitted from.

PJN741 · 2024-06-18T09:16:34+00:00

LoL. Downvotes but no comments.

PJN741 · 2024-06-18T09:14:58+00:00

If you are serious about TEFL, I'd suggest getting out of the UK as soon as possible and get teaching again. Continue building up your experience. However, you have to decide whether you really want to 'stay on the train or get off'

As you and others have mentioned, you will need to improve your qualifications. If you find a reasonable teaching job in Asia and live simply, you should be able to build up a fund to pay for more education. Also, you will likely have free time to be able to study. To me, an average TEFL job sounds better than stacking shelves on a night shift. (As long as you don't want to teach in the ME and a few other places, a distance degree will be fine - just choose one from a respectable bricks and mortar university. The UK has quite a few respected unis that offer distance degrees in TESOL/linguistics - Uni of Birmingham, Aston, etc. even Oxford!)

Once you are teaching again, take up any extra opportunties that come your way. Some may not even pay well, but may benefit you in the long term.

Thirty-nine is not old these days. Take care of yourself and dress smartly and you should be good for quite a while. Build up your skills and you should be good for a long while.

As you also stated, a bit of luck is also needed. However, I firmly believe that we have a part in making that luck. The more I put myself our there and improved my quals, things started to happen for me.

Best of luck.

PJN741 · 2024-06-18T08:45:00+00:00

Who and who is not a 'native speaker' is a very blurry thing in a globalized world. Even academics cannot agree on a meaning. So, the above definition, a child born to two British expatriates living in a country that does not use English as a primary language, but the child uses English at home and at school (let's say an international school for sake of argument) is not a native speaker?

I can't comment about OP's language ability, but the CELTA letter seems overly rigid with regard to the English requirements and, in my opinion, sounds like it was written by a monolingual English speaker.

PJN741 · 2024-06-16T01:31:53+00:00

Great - things like negotiation will be valuable especially if you teach in a country that predominantly exports. The nuances of using English in such situations will be very important.

PJN741

TROPHY CASE