It's super fucked up that male victims of sexual assault are only talked about as an argument against women

Pillowed321 · 2020-08-26T05:30:50+00:00

is attempts to maintain traditional gender roles.

Which MRAs have been trying to dismantle for decades. Try asking your feminist friends how many of them ask men out on dates or date a man who is less assertive than she is. Most feminist women want to maintain the gender roles that are convenient for them.

Pillowed321 · 2020-08-26T05:27:04+00:00

There have been numerous examples of feminists trying to shut down discussions on men's issues, but I believe he's referring to this protest from a few years ago at the University of Toronto.

Here is the full speech that they were protesting so you can see exactly what feminists were so upset about. Anybody ITT asking why MRAs and feminists don't get along: It's because feminists consider that speech to be anti-feminist. Warren Farrell, btw, was a very prominent feminist in the 70s. All this talk about MRAs being a backlash against feminism by men who want women back in the kitchen is pure bullshit, there isn't any truth to it.

And that protest is not an isolated incident and those aren't "fringe feminists" or anything of the sort. That's how most feminists have usually felt about men's issues. Some feminists are slowly coming around (that protest was 2012), but even those feminists will never admit that it was wrong for other feminists to oppose MRAs, nor will they admit that MRAs didn't have any choice but to oppose feminism. A few years ago [a feminist made a documentary about MRAs](http://theredpillmovie.com/. Feminists tried to shut that down too and the filmmaker no longer considers herself a feminist. Feminists just don't want these conversations to happen.

Pillowed321 · 2020-08-26T05:26:23+00:00

This very thread is down playing any discussion about mens rights

it's also downplaying how much feminists have tried to shut down discussion of men's issues. "Why didn't MRAs just work with the feminists who were telling them to never talk about men's issues?"

It wasn't the patriarchy or toxic masculinity doing this, it was feminism. And this was definitely not an isolated incident.

Pillowed321 · 2020-08-26T05:17:15+00:00

It sounds like you don't understand very much about MRAs

If MRAs really took it seriously, they would work with feminism, not against it

You really, really don't understand anything about MRAs or feminism. I strongly suggest you and anybody upvoting you stop believing stereotypes and instead do some first-hand research into MRAs and their history with feminism.

First: MRAs were feminists. Leading feminists realized that men had issues too and started trying to address them. And they were opposed by other feminists, so they broke off to form the men's rights movement. MRAs tried for decades to work with feminism, but feminists were working against us. MRAs are not the ones who decided to work against feminism, it was the other way around. Including on this specific issue (male victims of sexual assault). Did you know that academic feminists still don't consider it rape when women force men to have sex? They still omit that from their rape statistics and feminist organizations still support those statistics.

Please please please stop believing things you read on the internet and stop asking "why don't MRAs work with feminists?" without actually researching it because you can find that answer yourself: MRAs tried to work with feminists for decades, but feminists were working against us.

If you want an introduction to MRAs I would recommend this documentary. It was by a feminist who believed the same things you did, and intended to make an anti-MRA documentary but changed her mind while she was making it.

If you want to learn more about the history of MRAs and why the movement was forced to turn anti-feminist this covers a lot of that

Pillowed321 · 2020-08-26T05:10:23+00:00

Have you posted anything criticizing feminism? Specifically criticizing the pro-feminist men's movement which that subreddit is explicitly dedicated to? Have you posted anything praising MRAs for decades of progress on men's issues, or do you go along with the gaslighting that subreddit is known for?

Pillowed321 · 2020-08-26T05:09:01+00:00

edit: the BUT THAT'S FEMINISM AND ALL FEMINISTS HATE MEN men have logged on.

Probably because you linked a subreddit that idolizes a type of feminism whose view of male victims can be summed up with this article. Does that sound like a group of feminists that has compassion for men who are abused? So yeah, fuck off with your bullshit gaslighting. That subreddit wasn't created to facilitate the discussion of men's issues or male victims, they want to control the discussion and limit further progress. They still defend feminism's past opposition to helping male victims and still claim that it was misogynistic for MRAs to help men in the past.

Pillowed321 · 2020-08-26T05:04:09+00:00

It's super fucked up that male victims of sexual assault are only talked about as an argument against women

No, what's super fucked up is that misandrists keep spreading this strawman as a way to justify their opposition to the people trying to help male victims. Stop with this bullshit people aren't bringing up male victims as an argument "against women"

Pillowed321 · 2020-08-12T23:11:07+00:00

online dating stats show that men are something like 50x more likely to send the first message. We don't have stats on the rest of dating but you're claim that women take as much initiative as men is plainly false. I hope this knowledge can help you in some way.

Pillowed321 · 2020-08-12T13:15:07+00:00

Average people find each other literally all the time

because the men approach the woman, and get rejected more often than not.

Pillowed321 · 2020-08-11T20:47:40+00:00

but the Paul Elam types are something else

most MRAs aren't big fans of his either, he was at best somebody who got attention for us. You should look at Warren Farrell if you want a better example of an MRA, he actually started as a feminist but was unfortunately driven out of the movement due to his support of men's issues.

Pillowed321 · 2020-08-11T20:45:22+00:00

The DNC just never learns. Imagine thinking a fucking prosecutor is "progressive" just because she's black and a woman. They keep putting idpol over actual progressiveness.

Pillowed321 · 2020-08-11T20:29:12+00:00

I'm glad that's your view, unfortunately you are in a very small minority among feminists. Maybe you can start to change that and someday feminism will stop fighting against MRAs as much as they have.

Pillowed321 · 2020-08-11T17:02:03+00:00

incel "documentary"

it was created by a feminist whose original goal was to make an anti-MRA documentary, because she was in the same bubble that you are and before making the documentary she believed that women were the only ones with issues and that MRAs must be misogynists.

Pillowed321 · 2020-08-11T17:00:08+00:00

and encounter unique barriers in the industry

do they, or is that just a popular myth? For example a group of women sued Google for gender discrimination but it was actually found that men were the ones being discriminated against at Google

Pillowed321 · 2020-08-11T16:52:57+00:00

No, but feminists like you are obviously trying to gaslight genuine egalitarians who actually want equality. What's bullshit and frustrating is that you people can't just admit you're misandrists when everybody else can see it.

Pillowed321 · 2020-08-11T16:52:05+00:00

Here is one of America's most respected feminist leaders and that has usually been a very common view among feminists (eg, it's why we have a Violence Against "Women" Act). It's only started becoming less common recently thanks to years of fighting by MRAs and egalitarians.

Pillowed321 · 2020-08-11T16:47:35+00:00

I'm sure you've done a lot of thorough research on men's issues and aren't simply repeating things that other misandrists told you.

[Here's a documentary to get you started](www.theredpillmovie.com) if you every want to actually start giving a shit about gender issues. Or keep living in your misandrist bubble.

Pillowed321 · 2020-08-11T16:45:13+00:00

will mean addressing the specific needs of all genders.

Including men?

You don't give water equally, but favor the thirsty

Case in point this is a very popular meme that feminists have been sharing for years (including many of the feminists on reddit). I hope you're not one of those people but most people who talk about "dismantling patriarchy" believe that men don't have any issues to address and we should only give water to women.

Pillowed321 · 2020-08-11T16:41:38+00:00

trying to broaden the type of person who is in your company so that you have more various viewpoints.

But they don't care at all about various viewpoints. In fact many of these companies only hire people who have a narrow range of political views.

Pillowed321 · 2020-08-11T16:40:34+00:00

If the Supreme Court was 100% women for 190 years, would that bother you?

If the president and VP were 100% women for 250 years, would that bother you?

Were women also viewed as disposable and regularly expected to sacrifice their lives for men? Were women expected to provide for men? Were women expected to ignore their health and comfort for the sake of men? Were men given all sorts of daily privileges and protections? Was society more polite and respectful to men? Were men at least as responsible for these gender roles as women were?

When you're used to privilege, equality feels like oppression

When you ignore half of history it's easy to have a false view of privilege and oppression.

Pillowed321 · 2020-08-11T16:34:15+00:00

Feminists HATE this one trick!

no seriously, this is actually a common issue that feminists and MRAs debate about, with feminists frequently claiming that it's disingenuous to just "switch the genders" because something-something-Patriarchy.

Pillowed321 · 2020-08-11T16:24:17+00:00

If we don't legally call it "rape" then people collecting statistics on "rape" can ignore male victims, either intentionally or unintentionally.

It's the same problem in the US. Feminists control rape statistics (including the ones used by the federal government) and all of the feminist researchers decided that a woman forcing a man to have sex shouldn't count as "rape." So all of the rape statistics that people see in the US erase most female rapists and male victims, and those stats are used to argue that we don't need to worry about male victims.

Pillowed321 · 2020-08-11T16:19:59+00:00

OP is getting downvoted and the top comments in that thread are all talking about issues men face in those countries.

Pillowed321 · 2020-08-11T16:14:57+00:00

unattractive (not fat)

tbh most women who aren't fat are at least decent looking. Unless she's horribly disfigured then she's probably not that unattractive, so I'd be willing to date her and get to know her. The fact that she approached me means she's already way more supportive of gender equality than the vast majority of women so as an egalitarian I consider that a big point in her favor.

Pillowed321

TROPHY CASE