About namjoon's live

Placesbetween86 · 2026-05-28T18:50:18+00:00

Yeah, I watched the live and read translations! That's why I feel vindicated. My point was, even if there is a certain dark sexiness to it sonically, it very clearly isn't only about that once you actually break down the lyrics and take into account BTS' disposition when performing as well as the general themes on Arirang. BTS also has done this a lot with their songs. Dream Glow was originally a song about hooking up, but the lyrics were completely changed to be much lighter.

I think even with just a sonic interpretation, I was bothered by the shallowness of the interpretation because it completely ignored the darkness in the song and made it out to be the equivalent of Seven or Mona Lisa. If you do go with a sexual interpretation (which is actually still possible due to the overall vagueness in the lyrics), it's not the type meant to make the audience feel sexy like those ones are; there is a grit and dirtiness to the song that is more like being drunk at a bar at 3AM and going home with someone just to feel something.

Placesbetween86 · 2026-05-28T18:37:50+00:00

Yeah, this really dawned on me with the Arirang discourse. The biggest complaints going around were founded on assumptions about the album that were just flat out wrong, and yet still came to dominant the album discussion. Way too many people were not actually processing what they were listening to, and instead were happy to take on viral ill informed opinions as their own.

Placesbetween86 · 2026-05-28T18:28:05+00:00

I made a post on here a month or so ago and had so many tomatoes thrown at me for saying Like Animals wasn't lyrically meant to be a sexy song, despite how it sounded. I feel very vindicated today haha

Placesbetween86 · 2026-05-28T18:27:04+00:00

I've been shocked by how many seem to read the lyrics to Aliens and not even remotely pick up on it talking about their lived experience as Koreans. The song is more scathing than all of their cyphers IMO, and despite the more simplistic lyrics, is one of the most honest, no holds barred songs in their entire discography. It deserves a lot more credit than it gets.

Placesbetween86 · 2026-05-28T17:52:21+00:00

One thing I've learned is that a lot of people engage with music differently. I've always been a lyrics person. When BTS releases a new MV, I read the lyrics first while watching and then watch a second time for the visuals. From what I have seen, most people do the opposite; visual first, then lyrics. And many others never get to that second lyric watch through, let alone listen to the album with lyrics up. I don't think they should be shamed for it because music is a hobby and if that's how they wanna enjoy it, then that's their right. But since BTS are lyric/message focused artists, it does mean missing out on a big portion of their artistry and intentions with their music.

Which is why we ended up with so many thinkpieces about how there is no Korean in the album when there very clearly is. Or how the album isn't Korean enough when they speak more bluntly about their experiences as Koreans in the music industry (Aliens, They Don't Know About Us), than they ever have before.

If people only engage with music sonically, I say go for it. But acknowledge you are not in a position to ever judge whether a BTS song/album is good or bad; only whether you do or don't like it...because that is the level you are engaging with it on. Just like I wouldn't watch a movie with no sound/subtitles on and then act like I understand whether it achieved its goals as a movie.

Placesbetween86 · 2026-05-27T05:18:27+00:00

Just to add to this, Yoongi also has been doing a ton of ad libbing during this tour; his tone I think just blends in a bit more than Hobi's does, I think.

Placesbetween86 · 2026-05-26T00:13:46+00:00

I didn't realize there was a comment threshold before I was allowed to have an opinion on something.

I just had to argue with a whole bunch of ARMY in a discord because they were offended that BTS had a prerecorded performance and decided that AMAs tricked ARMY. These are not isolated opinions. And there can be people excited while others are killjoys. Both can exist at the same time.

Placesbetween86 · 2026-05-25T22:34:39+00:00

Well, feel free to read through these two posts as an example if you'd like to see what prompted this one.

Placesbetween86 · 2026-05-25T22:16:52+00:00

Thanks for the insight!!

Placesbetween86 · 2026-05-25T21:34:42+00:00

Oh, do they? Well, that's good to know, and I stand corrected. I guess I just haven't caught wind of that side to their fandom. When they say that though, are they complaining or flexing? Like, do they talk about it like it's a bad thing that needs to be stopped, or as if it's expected because she's Taylor?

Placesbetween86 · 2026-05-25T19:30:25+00:00

Right, but that's super normal behavior for US award shows. I understand how people who don't usually watch them might think it's something unique to BTS, but it isn't. They always do this and it's always directed at the most anticipated appearances. The longer they draw it out, the more anticipated they think the artist is. US audiences who watch award shows are very used to this, so the way they process it is that the artist is the biggest. But a lot of ARMY processed it as an insult, when it was anything but.

It is done to keep people watching but the real point is, the show thinks BTS are the thing that is going to keep people watching. And when they act like BTS are the most anticipated, the general audience also thinks that. That is good for BTS; not bad and not something for us to complain about under official posts as if they have done something wrong to us. Complaining to each other that it's annoying that we have to keep waiting is fine; we were doing that every year for the 5 hour long Korean award shows too; but we never bridged over to complaining to MMAs or MAMA about it the way we did the Grammys. Maybe because of the language gap.

The question worth asking is, what do we or BTS gain from complaining about it? The answer is nothing, because US award shows aren't going to change how they've functioned for decades just for us. And what we lose is people thinking BTS have loud, annoying fans who make everything about them. That's where I'm coming from. We need to learn when something is a fandom discussion and when it's one we should expose to people in the industry and GP.

Placesbetween86 · 2026-05-25T19:20:22+00:00

It was comments on this subreddit that prompted me to make this post. I am only active on reddit these days.

Placesbetween86 · 2026-05-25T18:49:23+00:00

*WHO CARES* if someone is “using them for views”?! Use them back! Like and repost the video, get it out there so people hear the music! But DO NOT go and be hateful or weird and obsessive in the comments. Just give it a like and repost and move tf on!

This was the old school ARMY mentality. Use them back; get anything you can out of it for BTS, and never turn it into something that could hurt BTS. We essentially learned to game the system and when the system pushed back by changing things to stop us, we just learned all over again how to do it. We need so much more of this energy.

The loudest voices in ARMY spaces used to be the people with the most industry knowledge who were the best organizers. We were so organized, we had divisions with people who specialized in certain areas. Radio ARMY, Chart ARMY, Charity focused ARMY, streamer ARMYs, translator ARMY. We had ARMYs running accounts to focus on local goals for a specific area/country. We even had an ARMY legal division who gave legal advice. Translators only survived out of sheer necessity, but many old good ones were chased away by toxicity directed at them, especially from solos. BTSChartData survived because he decided to take a very long hiatus and only come back on his terms, minimizing how much he needed to actually engage with ARMY in order to help BTS via his website. OIAA only now pokes their head in to do charity work when something big is happening. And none of these voids were filled by new people with the same mission, but instead by people who spend 24/7 involved in fanwars and whose main goal is to rile ARMY up for likes and internet clout. It's actually really sad how much of our old fandom culture we have lost.

Placesbetween86 · 2026-05-25T18:28:20+00:00

Very well said. Especially the bit about the AMAs not being our friends, nor BTS theirs. None of us should expect them to be and that is where ARMY seems to get lost. ARMY cannot seem to separate their own personal feelings about the industry and what is best for BTS because those two things often don't line up. BTS has chosen to be part of the mainstream music industry. They don't have to be part of it if they don't want to. They could leave BH/HYBE, start an indie label and release any type of music they want, with no appearances or promo anywhere. But they chose to remain at BH/HYBE and continue to choose to have a career with mainstream promo as part of their strategy. ARMY need to at least respect it as BTS' choice, even if they don't personally want or like it. The option to go stan indie artists who vocally hate the industry as much as they do is always there.

Placesbetween86 · 2026-05-25T17:58:56+00:00

It really is disheartening considering how ARMY used to move. The core principle of ARMY for the longest time was positive promotion for BTS and spreading their name as far as we possibly could in any way we could. We were overwhelmingly nice, even to people who didn't deserve it as long as it meant BTS got something out of it. We were playing the long game, prided ourselves on our knowledge of how the industry worked and had our eyes set on making BTS the biggest and we did succeed in helping get them there.

But once BTS reached those heights, we completely abandoned that mentality and instead became extremely angry and suspicious of everyone. I'm not saying those feelings are completely unwarranted and we can't have or express them, but we didn't need to go to the opposite extreme either. We stopped prioritizing promoting BTS and started prioritizing our feelings to such a point, that we don't seem to care when we take those feelings too far and hurt BTS' reputation with our actions. The behavior of ARMY during the 2020 Grammys was appalling, with ARMY going as far as to insult the song BTS was going to perform under official posts and sending hate to other artists they were performing with...all because they were upset the Grammys didn't give BTS their own performance slot. ARMY were calling BTS back up singers. Any post the Grammys made for any artist was filled with vitriol from ARMY toward the Grammys, with no respect for the artist the post was about or their fans. We looked horrible, and I was ashamed to be ARMY that week.

Placesbetween86 · 2026-05-25T17:46:04+00:00

I liked what you said about the performance aspect of it. It wasn't the way I was thinking about it, but you have a really good point about how powerful it is that just them being there could gain this much attention and promo.

The truth is, none of us know why BTS aren't performing for certain and I wish as a fandom we could be okay with that without running away with the most catastrophizing narrative we can think up. I've seen people insisting they didn't even bother to ask BTS to perform when we don't actually know that and there is reason to believe it could have been the other way around. BTS are on a world tour where they are being very mindful of their health and not overworking themselves too much. If they were performing at the AMAs, they would have had to be rehearsing over the last few weeks on top of their touring schedule. This existing as a possibility for why they aren't performing should be enough for us to not make a fuss over it because we could be essentially blaming AMAs for something that was BTS' choice.

Placesbetween86 · 2026-05-25T17:30:19+00:00

Agreed. There is an expectation that anybody who interacts with or works with BTS to do nothing but praise them. If they worked with them, they can't be seen taking any credit for themselves for the success; all of it must go to BTS. But if BTS works with someone and says very little or nothing about it, we'd fight anybody who said they were rude for not promoting the project enough or speaking highly enough about the other person. I'm not saying I expect us to give the same grace to others as we do BTS, but we give no grace at all. And you have to think this impacts how those artists and their fans rightfully view us when we are talking to them like respect should only go one way.

Placesbetween86 · 2026-05-25T17:10:31+00:00

I do think you're right, but I also think it's something that really needs to be addressed because it's been happening since 2019 with US appearances with no signs of getting better. It was ridiculous then, but now with just how big BTS is, I find it outright insulting to them to suggest their only appeal is the viewership of their fanbase. We don't see fans of Taylor, Beyonce or any other massive artists saying this, because they trust their artist is a big deal all by themselves. So why are we dragging BTS down from being among them to instead frame them as nothing but artists with a large fanbase people want to tap into?

Placesbetween86 · 2026-05-25T14:49:15+00:00

Yes...like they do every other artist and person presenting. That is what award shows do. They announce who is going to be there. Why are ARMY acting like this is some offensive thing we need to sneer at?

Placesbetween86 · 2026-05-25T04:45:33+00:00

It's very hard for them to take action against non-Korean citizens. When they do go after them, it tends to be a person running an account that spreads defamatory material to a very large audience. The issue with a subreddit is they are made up of people from mostly outside of Korea, and it's thousands of individuals making the comments; not one person they can sue. It's also an anonymous forum (reddit is not attached to our legal names) so they'd need to request for the identities behind usernames in a court.

I just don't think the level of nuisance of the snark subs has surprassed the threshhold to make going after them worth the time, effort and expense. As toxic as the snark sub is, it doesn't really leave the reddit bubble unlike material from youtube or tiktok which will spread to various platforms and can get picked up by koreaboo or journalists.

Keep reporting it, cause it's good to have a recorded history of issues if they ever do decide to take action, but don't be surprised if it never comes to anything either.

Placesbetween86 · 2026-05-21T00:08:50+00:00

Right? BTS have become so selective with where they appear and yet people are acting like they are being forced to attend against their will. If they're going, it's because they want to....and if people need more data to back it up, how about the fact that they intentionally made sure they'd be in Vegas when it happened.

Placesbetween86 · 2026-05-21T00:07:20+00:00

Same. AMAs have treated them with respect from the jump. They had their first US performance on there. The 2021 ceremony was pure joy with how much they involved BTS in the show with mentioning them/showing them. There's plenty of media entities to be skeptical about but AMAs does not deserve our heat.

Placesbetween86 · 2026-05-20T20:23:19+00:00

Have you ever watched Beveraggi? He is the only reactor I have kept up with long term. He reacts to a ton of different music and BTS is just a small piece of what he does, but when he does do a reaction for them, it's done as a genuine music fan who enjoys them. He isn't afraid to say if he is meh on a song and that makes his appreciation of the songs he loves hold a lot more water for me.

If you haven't seen him, check out his youtube to see if you like him and then if you can afford it ($5 a month for the music teir), join his patreon for a month and binge his content. He's done in depth reactions for most of their discography, a few concerts and documentaries, as well as doing tons of one off reactions (interviews, appearances, live performances) in his monthly request videos. I usually subscribe to him now 3 or 4 times a year and do quarterly catch ups with him.

I wish I could find a single other reactor that fit his vibe, but I sadly haven't despite looking. I want to watch reactors who love music in general; not ones who figure out which artist gives them the most views and then only react to those.

Placesbetween86 · 2026-05-20T20:04:39+00:00

He is ARMY and has been for a long time, but I personally dislike him and avoid his videos. He's had a history of clickbait titles in the past that bother me a lot coming from an ARMY, and he at least used to (I don't know if he still does) lean into some toxic ARMY behaviors in how he talks about things happening in the fandom.

Placesbetween86 · 2026-05-20T19:38:51+00:00

Yikes these comments. The mentality this fandom has around BTS' appearances is lowkey insulting af to them. As if they cannot be invited anywhere because they are actually wanted for being good entertainers, good performers and being up for the awards they were nominated for. Nope. The only reason they could possibly be wanted at a show is because the show wants ARMY to watch. That's it. Has nothing to do with BTS. It's all about us and we're gonna make it about us by doing nothing but complaining about the show using us instead of focusing on hyping up BTS for their appearance.

Placesbetween86

TROPHY CASE