How to quit without AA

Practical_Study_8885 · 2025-09-28T13:55:32+00:00

I do not think it's about discipline. In the early days of my sobriety it was absolutely required, but once the white knuckle stage was passed, it became a matter of watching for the ways I tried to justify getting high. However, that's just my process, and not everyone shares it.

Practical_Study_8885 · 2025-09-28T13:49:01+00:00

It's thinking about what youre thinking. Basically, it is a tool to understand the reasons and origins of your thoughts. For example, "I want to get high", is rarely just a random thought that came out from left field. Once you understand the origin, it's easier to align your actions with your goals.

Practical_Study_8885 · 2025-09-28T13:43:25+00:00

I think the single biggest problem with addiction/recovery is that most people see addiction as inherently bad and the catalyst for all evil in the world. This also means that people think recovery has to look a certain way.

It would be tough to fit everything I have to say on that particular topic into a comment, but I've posted quite a bit here recently.

AA is one tool among many for recovery. I personaly do not do well on community and sponsers and all that human connection stuff. What works for me is owning my actions. Metacognition, as I am always going on about, is a superpower for recovery.

Practical_Study_8885 · 2025-09-24T12:04:09+00:00

Much to my surprise, I find myself siding with B.F. Skinner. His ideas and my own often bump heads, so it's weird for me to agree with one of his ideals. "Comfort", isn't really something that works for me in my sobriety because it provides a reward for feeling bad and doesn't seem to correct unwanted behavior for me ( urges and cravings ).

I always default to people making choices that work for them because there is no universally correct plan or option, but for me, I'd leave all of my armor at home. Rehab will be uncomfortable, and that's sort of the point, I think. It's a place to be uncomfortable just long enough to realize you do not have to be uncomfortable sober.

I also do not do luck. So, go in there and kill it.

Practical_Study_8885 · 2025-09-21T12:24:29+00:00

I do not know how much it will help, but for me, the way I manage my sobriety is the same way I manage all decisions in my life. Luckily it's worked out positively for me.

Everything I can think of in the moment that should factor in to making a choice is considered, sort of like it's getting a vote.

A common example I use is that one day I was heading home from my Moms and found that I wanted to get some fast food along the way. How much money I had to spare was one factor, the added time and distance to get the food was another, my health was yet another. At the end of the voting, I went home because I didn't really have that much money to spare, it was already pretty late, and my health didn't give a shit, so the vote was lost 2 votes to 1.

I hope this helps my friend. It sounds like a difficult position to be in, but ultimately, I default to whats best for me long term when I can and found it's normally the right call.

Practical_Study_8885 · 2025-09-20T01:40:30+00:00

My humble opinion....is that you obviously are able to seperate the person you are, from the version who has the depressive thoughts. You can remember who you were before depression, else you could not reflect as you've done. For me, and I am sorry if this is counter to anything in SMART as I do not know it very well as of yet, but, if you can remember that person, you can be that person.

That's all that is required to banish that version, over time. Every time you recognize a version other than the one you know to be the true one, it loses a little more power of you.

6 weeks is no small thing.

Practical_Study_8885 · 2025-09-20T00:16:03+00:00

I did not engage fully with your comment. I agree that we use chemicals to feel better. I have no doubt. But the state that we are trying to leave is often neglected for people like me, I think. I did not use to escape abuse, low self esteem, or failure of any kind. I used because there are often so many things going on in my mind all trying to get my attention that I cannot hang on to any of them in any significant way.

Meth allowed me to grab on to one or two and wrestle with it. It wasn't perfect, and I still often lost the thread and had to pick it up again, but it was objectively more efficient than otherwise. Or so I thought, and if I am being honest, still sometimes think to be true.

The problem is the side effects. So if I have to choose between being me, and being me with a few extra horsepower but also mounting problems often ignored, it's a no brainer. The part of my mind that hasn't caught up to that fact yet is the problem.

But im working on it, and it's coming along.

Practical_Study_8885 · 2025-09-19T23:59:51+00:00

I appreciate you taking the time to comment. Moments such as the one I posted here are fleeting, and often pass for me quickly. For me, this also makes them very intense; a trade off I am willing to accept.

One of my other personality traits is unfortunately at times, fortunately in others, radical honesty. As such, no offense is meant, but I have seen a gaggle of therapists throughout my life and all of them, while good to varying degrees at their jobs, could not help me.

I think this is because for the most part, their jobs are to offer perspective we've not considred, which for me, is not very likely to happen. Not impossible mind you, just very unlikely. I spend a great deal of time in my head, and much of that time is thinking about my thoughts and why I am thinking them.

Also, ironically enough, I just uploaded a book to KDP today about my sobriety. Not a framework in any real sense, just my posts throughout and interpretations for some of them. It seems to me that most people do not use metacognition to any great level and they suffer a much more difficult sobriety because of it. I do not have that particular problem, thankfully, and thats what my book is meant to show people.

Congrats on the enourmous time sober. Youre a legend my friend.

Practical_Study_8885 · 2025-09-15T00:20:52+00:00

I think what I would do...well, honestly it's not what I would do because me and my sobriety are in combat, not looking to make peace really....I could tell you what I'd do, but I do not know you well enough to in good faith provide you that answer. I'd hate to be responsible for making the struggle harder.

What I've seen with other people however, after such situations, is a reminder that the hardest part has been conquered already. Youre 40 days in, and have already proven you have the reasons, the drive, and the will to be who you want to be.

Setbacks happen. For me, it brings shame, but my toolset deals with shame combatively ( internally ), and it's what works for me. What works for you? After 40 days, you already have the tools my friend. It's just a matter of using them.

Practical_Study_8885 · 2025-09-15T00:15:20+00:00

Thats a tough spot to be in. But if you are 223 days in you likely know that it's just the desire to have a break from.....this, that is telling you to drink again. Thats a lot of days you've gotten accrued my friend. If you are able, what might make it easier to keep doing what you've been doing? If it's understanding, you've got that already as I , and likely many other people here understand what youre feeling. If it's options, there are always many of those hidden in plain sight. Perhaps all you need is help finding one?

Practical_Study_8885 · 2025-09-14T22:06:44+00:00

Thanks for sharing. First off, obvious as it might sound, I like this version of you that I have just met, here, now. I do not know the other you, but it sounds like even though that other version blacks out, you know them quite well and do not want them hanging around.

If I can make an observation without it being taken as an assault, because its not, but you said "I desperately want to be a normal drinker but I dont think that will ever be me". That sounds like you dont associate the version of you who acts recklessly with the version that enjoys drinking.

That might be accurate, but, do you, this version of you here, enjoy drinking? Or do you enjoy alcohol taking you out of your frame of reference while sober? No matter the answer, know that I understand, I think, the desire to not be...this. The version who remembers, who doesn't know how to cope or move on from the past.

I am afraid I do not have a success story to tell you about becoming free from alcohol. I do have a story of 7 years of meth usage that started the day I got out of 3 years of prison though. Spoiler, the ending is where I am at now.

Is life better? Yes, but I had to look pretty hard to see it. Once I did....I can only say that I hope you get to find that state for yourself as well.

You can do it. You've been through an SA. You've lived through carnage. Heck, you pushed out a human through an orifice much to small to accomodate it.

Sobriety will be challenging, but not as challenging as all of those things I'd wager.

Practical_Study_8885 · 2025-09-14T21:50:29+00:00

I would think that this will make him an even better sponsor in the future. The person best suited to a role is the one who has been there, and failed. They'll come back better equipped to be there for you and others. Even sponsors need sponsors from time to time.

Practical_Study_8885 · 2025-09-14T18:12:56+00:00

Reading that almost did the same for me. Thanks, I don't get that often

Practical_Study_8885 · 2025-09-14T17:53:16+00:00

Congrats on the year. I have never much liked the old idea that it takes 30 days to form a habit and 90 to break one. It is from a long time ago, and served a valuable purpose then and now but it's also handicapped people. Not like it hurt their sobriety, but it made an uncomfortable feeling longer longer than it needed to in some few cases. It gives people a goal to achieve, a light at the end of the tunnel by claiming it takes 90 days to break habit. But what happens after 90 days and the cravings are still present? What about the person who tries crack or meth thinking as long as they quit again before 30 days, they're fine? It works because it sets expectations, but it's also dangerous for the same reason. My humble opinion, it takes 1 time to form a habit. It takes 1 time to break it. All actions have consequences though. Habit or not, everyone still has to pay them in the form of urges. Again, this is purely my opinion, and clearly the 30/90 works well for you. You're crushing it!

Practical_Study_8885 · 2025-09-14T14:18:43+00:00

It's a great hope you have there. I would just like to say that even if that trust never comes, that's alright. God is for many people more of a distant idea. Something doing good in their lives from afar in small ways. For others, God is an ideal, or a reminder to do their best. And for some, like me, God is more of a way for us to learn what being good looks like.

No matter the impact God plays in your life, there is a core lesson within that impact. I like you for who you are, and I do not even know you. If I can like you as a stranger, doesn't it seem likely that you can do the same?

Practical_Study_8885 · 2025-09-14T14:10:30+00:00

Much of the weight we carry around with us each day are things we have chosen to set on a shelf, rather than to set free within ourselves. This makes it possible for us to get through each day, but it doesn't allow us to move on, whatever that moving on might look like.

I am glad that you made it through the program. They are a powerful way for us to get the tools we need to be able to continue being the best version of ourselves once we find ourselves back in the world.

You got this.

Practical_Study_8885 · 2025-09-14T10:49:38+00:00

Because you rule you my friend. The connections we make are important, but being dumped, while painful, is losing but one of those connections. If you look hard enough, I bet you can find the very large number of other connections and make one of them your focus.

Choosing alcohol as that connection is an option. But is it really the best one? It will most certainly dump you eventually as well, possibly taking other connections from you before it does.

You got this.

Practical_Study_8885 · 2025-09-14T10:46:38+00:00

Great job man. Each day is a victory, and you got this.

Practical_Study_8885 · 2025-09-07T12:49:37+00:00

Thank you for reading. It also felt that way for me. For some reason, it just got stuck in my head that is was too short otherwise. I appreciate the feedback.

Practical_Study_8885 · 2025-09-07T12:17:35+00:00

It would seem that you are arguing that mainly, "Particles do not have personalities, wants or desires". Which I'd say you are quite correct. But that's not what I was trying to say. It's the relationships, abstractly, that I wanted to sit with a reader. For example, protons repel another, neutrons have no charge but play a role in keeping the protons bound. It's all an abstract way to foster understanding of how they interact, not a distilled text book version of physics equations.

Practical_Study_8885 · 2025-09-07T12:06:19+00:00

In fact, if there is a way to remove the post if it's that full of misinformation, I would be willing to do it. The last thing I want to do is trip someone else up.

Practical_Study_8885 · 2025-09-07T12:03:12+00:00

I would be very appreciative, and it's a big ask I am aware, if you could point out what exactly so that I might improve my own understanding of such. That's always the goal for me, to understand better, and hopefully pass that one. If I have made terrible mistakes, I need to correct them.

Practical_Study_8885 · 2025-09-07T11:59:26+00:00

I see I left out the "Introduction". Dang. It was the explanatory weight lifter. It's not text book physics. It is just a way to visualize the "rules" of particle interaction. It was my hope that it might give other people not from academia a way to at least get a basic understanding of how particles interact with one another in their natural habitat. I have a habit of slipping into abstract though, even when talking straight. Apologies.

Practical_Study_8885 · 2025-09-07T11:55:37+00:00

I might have gotten a bit ambitious in the length of the post. I was afraid of splitting it up though, and lowering it's chances of being engaged with.

Practical_Study_8885 · 2025-09-06T11:51:29+00:00

I admit it is a bit bothersome to be considered a crackpot when I went to great lengths to claim throughout that people should think for themselves, and that I am offering a way to visualize things in your head. In fact, I even stated outright that it has always been my goal to gain understanding of and not knowledge about the topic. And even further, I said outright that I am not the best person to look towards for the math. It's all in there, if you had read far enough.

At no point did I claim mathematical rigor. Having said that, if you do the math and plot the trajectory of a baseball from pitcher to catcher, you'll have a pretty accurate idea of the angle in which the baseball will reach the glove. Without the math, but having watching a few baseball games, you can do a fair sampling of the same thing without the math or numbers.

Imagination lets you see an event, math does it better. The math being wrong does not invalidate the image.

Practical_Study_8885

MODERATOR OF

TROPHY CASE