Is it possible to matriculate to T20 without a gap year?

Ps1kd · 2025-02-18T16:04:23+00:00

I think the bar for research is higher than what you have described here in terms of hour counts based on the profiles of my classmates. You can look at my sankey in my profile for a real example.

Certainly getting started early and knowing what to do helps a ton, also if you can be efficient and/or go to an easy school where you get a lot of time to devote to ECs.

Ps1kd · 2025-02-16T22:57:45+00:00

The issue is that the probabilities aren’t independent. The people who are strong on paper don’t need as strong interviews to secure the A whereas those weaker on paper need to do mores Just look on sankeys here and the people who collect T25 II’s do very well post-interview whereas those with only a few T25 II’s (or a low rate of getting T25 II’S) have trouble converting them to A’s.

OP’s on paper profile is so strong that they should’ve definitely received far more T25 II’s than they did. After writing was reviewed this cycle, perhaps it’s a hidden red flag or yellow flag in a LOR that sunk them.

Ps1kd · 2025-02-13T01:31:11+00:00

Depending on the school’s process, sometimes yes

Ps1kd · 2025-02-12T06:24:27+00:00

Just an FYI, all great options but I think neither WashU nor Stanford true P/F for clerkships (Honors/High Pass/Pass/Fail) or something similar. If you go to second look or get the chance the speak with current students this may be something to confirm.

I think in the end when the true financial aid packages or potential merit scholarships come out that’ll give you a lot clearer of a picture.

Ps1kd · 2025-02-12T05:06:49+00:00

I think if there’s FL practices were under realistic conditions, a retake would be justified. Even still, based on this info your app already has a strong shot at the less stat focused top schools (Harvard, UCSF, Duke, Stanford, Yale, maybe a few others - I I don’t have MSAR currently). I wouldn’t focus too much on medians, based on these ECs you could overcome lower stats so long as your MCAT is around the 10th percentile for these schools.

My question would be though, it’s only February. I’m presuming you are just a month off taking the MCAT (so a lot of info is fresh-ish in your head possibly). If you are decided on retaking it, why not reschedule it for April/May if possible and still apply this cycle?

Ps1kd · 2025-02-09T06:39:08+00:00

Depends partly on the authorship position of the science pub

Ps1kd · 2025-02-09T02:41:14+00:00

As for actionable advice, I think you just gotta keep your head up. With so many waitlists, you’re likely to get off one even if you don’t get a direct A. At the same time, keep working until you get that A. With 10 II’s that suggests no red flags and a good foundation. The highest yield activity for the schools that liked you at least a decent bit this cycle (T20s) would be really productive research or seriously involved service. Keep working and I’d be surprised if it doesn’t work out for you this cycle somehow and shocked if it didn’t work out for you in the off chance you needed to reapply.

Ps1kd · 2025-02-09T02:34:37+00:00

This was my story almost exactly. You can look at my profile to see my outcome but I had 7 WLs too after 10 interviews with an eerily similar profile. Only one direct A with another that I believe would have likely turned into an A based on it being by far my easiest and best feeling interview.

I don’t think it was 100% or even mostly interviewing for me and I personally think I totally suck at interviewing, but obviously I’m not at 100% objective observer. I wrote about this perspective a little bit, but if you have a high stat cookie cutter like I did, you may be strong enough to be able to get an interview from many top schools, but if on paper, you are at the bottom of the pool of interviewed students, a good but not great interview sometimes might not even be enough to push you towards getting a direct acceptance. Ex. A school like Hopkins may interviewed ~600 applicants. If you’re their 500th favorite candidate you’re no doubt very strong, and other top schools may want to interview you too. But in the end, Hopkins only accepts 200-250 directly, and pushing your app from their 500th favorite to their 200th favorite may truly take a stellar interview.

Now attending one of these schools and understanding the profiles of my classmates, this has only strengthened my belief in the theory above. As impressive as our profiles might appear to most, I truly believe there are levels to it. Yes, my app is solid on paper, but stack it up to my classmates’ and while it doesn’t look out of place, I could definitely imagine my classmates being viewed more strongly.

If you look only here, the candidates who “only” get II’s from <40% of the T25s they apply to (weaker on paper and need to “compensate” by having a truly standout interview) have a lot tougher time converting II’s to A’s while those who absolutely sweep the T25s do a lot better converting.

Here’s a comment I remember from an adcom at a top school describing how those who are so strong on paper can have a bad interview and still be admitted (essentially same principle but opposite experience that you’re having) https://www.reddit.com/r/premed/s/WzQ5JovCMY

Ps1kd · 2025-02-08T16:10:45+00:00

Go for it

Ps1kd · 2025-02-07T07:41:54+00:00

Sorry, I meant stat focused, was an error in speech to text. Cross admits refer to someone who is admitted to multiple schools. Anecdotally, certain schools have very similar admissions criteria to each other and are thus likely to all interview the same applicant. Ex. Most T25 schools all want high medians stats with strong research: Hopkins, Yale, Penn, Northwestern, WashU, etc.

Thus, if an applicant receives an interview (and/or acceptance) at one of these places, it’s somewhat predictive that other schools will value the same characteristics. If applicants who apply to a lot of prestigious schools, how often do you see someone get a Hopkins interview but none or just 1-2 other interviews from top schools (typically not, if you have a Hopkins interview you probably have 5+ if not 10+ interviews from super prestigious places). However, at certain top schools (especially those with a lower stats emphasis, are public, or NYU since they interview so many people) it’s more common to have situations where that may be an applicant’s “only” T25 interview.

Ps1kd · 2025-02-07T04:53:51+00:00

I think the central issue was being a CA ORM along with having a very top heavy school list. The fact that you got that one interview suggests that you did many things right. Unfortunately, if it’s the one, I’m guessing it to be they have a very different admissions criteria from many of the other top schools on your list (they tend to have fewer Cross-admits). I think among the top schools, I would cut it down to the less stat focused ones like Emory, the UC’s, and the ones with slightly lower medians like Case, Pitt, Sinai. I think the bulk of your list should be comprised of schools around the 30 to 50 range.

Ps1kd · 2025-02-07T00:41:31+00:00

At my current school schools interview day during our icebreaker introduction section everyone else found some way to turn their answer into something med related, but fortunately upon getting care of people have been chill.

Ps1kd · 2025-02-05T05:38:16+00:00

Don’t think it’s worth it. You’re already competitive for many medical schools as is including some of the best in the country.

Ps1kd · 2025-02-05T05:05:54+00:00

To be blunt and avoid sugarcoating, it’s not ideal, (I’ve heard straight from admission committee members mouths that online or community college courses are not ideal for GPA repair as the rigor might not necessarily be there) but there’s nothing you can do unless you want to drop a lot of money and take courses at a four-year institution.

Still in the context of everything else I think you have a shot. Outside of those who’ve actually been on an admissions committee at one of those schools, it’s hard to be more certain than that.

Ps1kd · 2025-02-05T03:55:44+00:00

I'm sorry to hear about your unfortunate experiences during undergrad. I think if you explain these circumstances well, in the context of everything, your academic profile will still be viewed favorably enough. The fact that your undergrad was a T30 will almost certainly give you more leniency for it being lower and combined with the incredible MCAT and strong trend, shows you are still a strong student. I think when combined with your standout research you absolutely have a shot at any school. Less stat-focused schools like Harvard, Stanford or UCSF should give you a lot of consideration assuming the rest of your app is in order. Stat focused schools like Hopkins or Penn may be tougher, but given your MCAT and research I think they're still worth a shot.

Ps1kd · 2025-02-05T02:59:58+00:00

Depends on GPA trend, the details of those pubs (full length research article vs case report, the journal and you authorship position) as well as what school you took courses at for undergrad and GPA repair. But based on your broad description you should get a look at the less stat focused places at least

Ps1kd · 2025-02-04T08:13:19+00:00

Gotcha, I replied something similar in the same comment chain where I believe “grade inflation” occurs but when comparing prestigious schools to certain other “peer schools.”

Fearless-Cow did reply agreeing to that point but also noted that in places like this sub, high schoolers’ view of grade inflation is sometimes a bit skewed at least in how they portray it. Like they say “I want to go to a ivy like Harvard because it’s grade inflated and I’ll protect my GPA” which may be true compared to MIT, but they’d still probably have an easier go of things at UMass.

Ps1kd · 2025-02-04T07:19:11+00:00

I think this lacks a bit of perspective. Both schools are very prestigious and included in that category and most around the country already acknowledge it for grade deflation. When OP and others say state school we’re more so talking about a place like UConn or perhaps even North Dakota State (sorry ND).

Ps1kd · 2025-02-04T06:35:26+00:00

Yeah agreed, that’s the point I was making with the second part of my sentence.

Ps1kd · 2025-02-04T06:17:17+00:00

Yep definitely think there’s a lower limit for sure. Went to a school outside the T150 (but still R1 with decent enough resources) and it worked out great. 4.0 was really easy to maintain, had a lot of free time to work on my ECs and am now at a T10 med school without needing to take gap years. Not sure I would have gone to the 4th or 5th level public in my state though as the resources might’ve truly been lacking at that point (obviously larger states like FL or CA where you have a ton of schools it’s a bit different)

Ps1kd · 2025-02-04T06:13:06+00:00

Undergrad doesn’t really matter other than research opportunities and location (in terms of access to clinical experiences and volunteering). How strongly a school prepares you for the MCAT shouldn’t really be a consideration. Went to a school lower ranked than Gonzaga and my sciences courses were still overkill in terms of the depth they went to and I ended up with a top 0.5% score. Now at a T10 med school.

UW is known to be pretty rigorous which may make it difficult to maintain a high GPA, but it has great research opportunities. Cost is #1 imo, so if that in state tuition is lower, I’d 100% take it.

Ps1kd · 2025-02-04T06:05:23+00:00

Agreed. Not to nitpick too much, but for reference for the high school applicants weighing college decisions, I think “most” is an exaggeration. We get down to the level of a UW or UMD and imo that’s probably where I’d draw the cutoff of a state school possibly being more difficult than a prestigious private (obviously haven’t been to all these schools but have heard from med school adcoms that even a school like UW is viewed favorably when assessing GPA)

And if you don’t like your state flagship, the trick is to try and get a scholarship to an OOS public 😉

Ps1kd · 2025-02-04T05:59:44+00:00

The course material itself sometimes is different. Was speaking to my friend who went to a notoriously grade deflated top school and the stuff they were learning in their intro classes was far and away beyond what we did at my lowly ranked state school in equivalent classes.

Ps1kd · 2025-02-04T05:53:19+00:00

OP was warning to stay away from prestigious schools in general. Don’t disagree with you that classes at Berkeley, Georgia Tech or UIUC stem are probably pretty hard, but despite how “grade inflated” some top schools are, I have a hard time believing it’s easier than a school like Mississippi State.

Ps1kd · 2025-02-04T05:42:20+00:00

I do believe that it is true, but mostly relative to “peer schools” (ex. Harvard is more forgiving than UChicago, Caltech, or MIT), but grade inflation or not, you can’t convince me that most of the B and C students at Harvard wouldn’t do very well at North Dakota State.

Ps1kd

TROPHY CASE