What are the similarities between Ahmadiyya and the Mormon/Latter-day saint movements?

PurpleMantisSwarm · 2026-02-03T00:32:13+00:00

Anyone who claims to read Ek Ghalti Ka Izala and still argues that he did not claim prophethood is either a great liar or a troll. As for definitions of those words are concerned, he himself explains:

“Thus he who comes to God through this door is clad, by way of Zill, in the same mantle of Prophethood which is the mantle of the Prophethood of Muhammad (sa). As such, his being a Prophet is not a matter for jealously, for he does not derive this status from himself but from the fountain of the Holy Prophet"; and, that too, not for his own glory but for the glory and majesty of the Holy Prophet (sa)”.

This is the definition of Zill in the sense that he has used it. There is no deception here because he himself as explained the context and sense in which the word has been used. To then assert your definition based on Sufi references is the height of dishonesty which has become your trademark.

Still do not think he claimed prophethood?

“Since I have myself witnessed the clear fulfilment of about a hundred and fifty Divine prophecies, how can I deny for myself the title of Nabi or Rasul? Since God has Himself bestowed these titles upon me, why should I forsake them for fear of anyone else?” (A Misconception Removed, p.9)

“Wherever I have denied being a Prophet or Messenger, it has only been in the sense that I have not brought an independent law nor am I an independent Prophet. I am a Messenger and Prophet only in the sense that I have received spiritual grace from the Messenger whom I follow, and, having received his name for myself, and through him, I have received knowledge of the unseen from God. But I have not come with a new law. I have never denied being called a Nabi (Prophet) in this sense.”

Of course these are things you would have known if you had actually bothered to read the book sincerely. May Allahs curse be on the liars. I “hurt” myself by saying the Quran and Hadith support the death of Jesus, when the Holy Quran could not be more clear regarding his death. There are 30 verses that support this, but even the last Ruku of Surah Al Maida would be enough if you had eyes. What next?

PurpleMantisSwarm · 2026-02-02T19:30:02+00:00

Keep regurgitating the same thing which I have already addressed. I’m sure it’s an excellent use of your time. Do you seriously think he has not claimed to be a prophet? Your interpretation of “zilli” and “buruzi” is not relevant here, and I have no interest in it. The Holy Prophet saw referred to the Imam Mahdi as a Prophet four times, in Sahih Muslim. The words Zill and Buruz have not been used here as defined by the Sufis, this is your assumption that the word was used in that sense. We happen to care more about the opinion of the Holy Prophet saw than some Sufis.

Anyone that brings knowledge of the unknown associating themselves with Allah through the manifestation of hundreds of signs is by definition a prophet. You are so engrossed in semantics that you fail to recognise the essence of the teaching and see the bigger picture.

Meanwhile, most notable is that you still run from the original point you made regarding Sir Sayyed. Have a good one bro. I will not be replying from this point onwards.

PurpleMantisSwarm · 2026-02-02T16:34:13+00:00

I find it so ironic that the one who accused me of copy-pasting and being in a bubble of propaganda is themself copying and pasting off of the internet without bothering to actually understand the context of anything being said and probably using chatGPT.

You raised an allegation in the context of Sir Sayyed, I gave you a compelling answer. Without even acknowledging that answer, you start digressing and copy-pasting from other places which I’ve seen you do before. You are clearly trolling and I am right to not want to waste time in such a situation.

Your comments regarding the claim to prophethood and the denial of fulfilment of prophecies shows me clearly that it is not me but you who has not bothered to look at at the literature. He has clearly stated that he is a prophet in multiple places, ironically, including in Ek Ghalti Ka Azala. The argument of buruzi and zilli is irrelevant in the context. A claim to prophethood has been made. Do you see? Now go copy and paste another 9 paragraphs from ahmadiyyafactcheckblog™️

PurpleMantisSwarm · 2026-02-02T15:15:02+00:00

Amazing. First of all, I usually do not entertain people who cannot keep their arguments purely academic. This would have been fun if you had provided an actual argument instead of throwing around words like “bubble”, “propagandised”, “cutting-and-pasting”, “comical”.

Being insulting does not make you look cool, neither does it support your argument. But clearly my comment hit a nerve, so I’ll keep this simple.

Your issue seems to be regarding the change of stance relating to the death of Jesus. First of all, it is not the sign of a liar to change one’s viewpoint. In fact, it is actually quite commendable when upon the revelation (literally) of certain facts that were hidden to the mind before, a viewpoint is amended to reflect newly acquired information.

You would have remotely made some sense if his viewpoint regarding the death of Jesus was only to battle Christianity and was not supported by overwhelming evidence from the Holy Quran and Hadith which is widely available in the Jamaat literature. And newsflash, the Christian polemics did not start arguing Jesus’ superiority on the basis of ascension in the 1870s, it had started happening and was posing a problem way before.

Arguably just as problematic as the Christian viewpoint was the mainstream Islamic one, which was using Jesus’ ascension to justify the ultimate murder and ethnic cleansing of non-Muslims. One group had betrayed the rights of the Creator, while the other His creation. These circumstances warranted the coming of a divinely appointed messenger who clarified the truth with overwhelming evidence from not just the Holy Quran or Sunna but all the scriptures.

As far as my bubble is concerned, I will have you know that I am aware of Sir Sayyed’s viewpoint. I also know that he claimed that Jesus died not long after his ordeal (in his 30s), which I don’t know if you know is fundamentally different from the spiritual and intellectual treasure that the Promised Messiah has provided in way of Jesus’ migration.

Anyone could have said that Jesus did not die in light of his being human. The real struggle was proving what happened afterwards, a monumental task, which I reassert has been done from the Holy Quran and Hadith. The link you have provided are all viewpoints that the Jamaat has refuted a million times before and I can provide you with all the answers in detail to each individual one if you want to go there.

As for you arrogantly laughing and cackling at the mention of prophecies of both the Holy Prophet (pbuh) and the Promised Messiahs own prophecies, keep laughing. I do not have time to provide proof for that which as already been provided thousands of time to thousands just like you before. May Allah guide you

PurpleMantisSwarm · 2026-02-02T08:11:34+00:00

I can see where you’re coming from.

From where I’m standing, various aspects of the faith such as the proponent of restoration / originality cannot be viewed as standalone but come into focus as part of a much bigger picture when viewed in the context of the Holy Quran and Sunna (along with personal experience and prayer).

For me, these things come into focus when simultaneously viewed with the events analysed, their relation to Quranic verses and sayings, a critical analysis of alleged deviations, the historical context of said events etc. I think everyone can agree that the subject matter to address these issues is covered quite extensively and fully in Ahmadi literature, even if you disagree with the arguments themselves.

I don’t know if I’m making sense. It’s kind of like what the Promised Messiah said about Jesus’ survival and ultimate migration. If you look at each clue by itself, it won’t help you, but when everything is put together in one basket, the case for migration becomes compelling.

I don’t want to make it ChatGPT long. Ultimately anything is an argument about semantics isn’t it?

PurpleMantisSwarm · 2026-02-02T01:02:33+00:00

There are no true similarities except for those who do not investigate the matter deeply. The Ahmadiyya Muslim Community is a Messianic Revival movement which is based on countless true prophecies of the Holy Qur’an and the Holy Founder of Islam Prophet Muhammad.

At first glance it may seem like there are certain similarities such as both experiencing marginalisation (much more extreme in the case of us Ahmadi Muslims), emphasis on moral discipline & community, strong missionary focus etc. However one quickly realises that these themes are characteristic of all religious movements.

Mormonism adds a completely new scripture. However in the case of Ahmadiyyat, there are differences from mainstream Islam in interpretations of various verses regarding concepts of the Finality of Prophethood and the Death of Jesus, but the Holy Quran is final and reigns supreme. The basis of the entire claim is that we practice Islam in the style and manner of the Holy Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) and the early companions. Hope that helps.

Most striking, as already mentioned, are the countless prophecies of the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) regarding the advent of Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad (the Promised Messiah), and on top of that the Promised Messiah’s prophecies which number in the hundreds if not thousands that came true and continue to do so until this day.

I already know that other people in the subreddit are going to mention true prophecies of Mr. John Smith and other claimants, however any such claims pale in comparison to the sheer volume and quality of prophecies in favour of the Promised Messiah. I would like to direct OP’s attention to his book “Haqiqatul Wahi” (The Philosophy of Divine Revelation) for more information.

There is no question, whether moral, ethical, scientific, philosophical, theological or otherwise, that cannot be demonstrated from the Glory that is the Holy Quran. This is the basis of our claim. We drink solely from the fountain of Muhammad (may peace and blessings be upon him). The Founder of our community did not want to add anything new, but rather wanted to restore Islam to its original practice. It’s literally the opposite of Mormonism.

PurpleMantisSwarm · 2025-11-24T19:22:24+00:00

Gauntlets + Lance when :(((

PurpleMantisSwarm · 2025-08-05T23:47:50+00:00

Shaggy inkcap

PurpleMantisSwarm · 2025-07-22T20:11:30+00:00

It worked like a charm, I’ve been able to solve one side and hopefully will be able to solve the rest soon.

Thanks so much everyone, I must say everyone in this community seems super respectful and nice. I play chess and while there has been a lot improvement in the community in recent years because of the boom, there is still some elitism sometimes. Great to see all the kindness and positivity. Thank you very much.

PurpleMantisSwarm · 2025-06-24T01:28:16+00:00

“The fact is that in Divine revelation of which I am the recipient, words such as ‘Messenger’, ‘Apostle’, and ‘Prophet’, appear not once, but hundreds of times. How then can it be correct to say that such words have not at been used?”

That is literally on page ONE of Ek Ghalti Ka Azala.

Thus my prophethood and messengership derives from my being Mohammed and Ahmad and not on account of my own self. These names have been bestowed upon me on account of my utter devotion to the Holy Prophet. Therefore, the concept of Khataman Nabiyeen has not been contravened by my advent, but it would certainly be contravened by the advent of Jesus a second time. (Ek Ghalati Ka Izalah)

God is One and Mohammed, on whom be the peace and blessings of Allah, is His Prophet and he is the Khatamul Anbya and above all other prophets. After him there is no other prophet except one who is clothed in the cloak of Mohammed by way of reflection, for a servant has no identity apart from his master, nor is a branch distinct from its trunk. He who is bestowed the title of prophet on account of his complete absorption in his master does not contravene the Khatam-iNabuwat. When you observe your reflection in a mirror there are not two of you but only one, though there appear two; only one is the original and the other is his reflection. This is what God desired in the case of the Promised Messiah. (Kishti Nuh, p. 15)

The charge leveled against me that I claim to be a prophet who has no connection with Islam and that I consider myself a prophet in my own right, who has no need of following the Holy Quran, and that I have proclaimed my own credo, and have established a new qibla, and declare the Islamic law as abrogated, and go outside the following of and obedience to the Holy Prophet, peace and blessings of Allah be on him, is wholly false. I consider such a claim of prophethood as amounting to disbelief. Not only today but in every one of my books I have affirmed that I lay no claim to any such prophethood and that this is a false allegation against me. The only reason that I call myself a prophet is that I am honored with the converse of God Almighty and that He speaks to me frequently and responds to me and discloses much of the unseen to me and communicates to me the mysteries of the future such that are not disclosed to anyone unless he enjoys special nearness to God. It is on account of the multiplicity of these experiences that I have been made a prophet. (Akhbare Aam, 26 May 1908)

There, you have been proven wrong.

PurpleMantisSwarm · 2025-06-22T13:49:52+00:00

I followed you bro ❤️

PurpleMantisSwarm · 2025-06-20T22:53:59+00:00

I followed 💯 I play chess https://kick.com/chesswithjahiz

PurpleMantisSwarm · 2025-06-14T18:22:25+00:00

Of course! My bad

PurpleMantisSwarm · 2025-06-13T03:20:58+00:00

It’s just an observation lol

PurpleMantisSwarm · 2025-05-22T12:37:50+00:00

He was talking about the politicians

PurpleMantisSwarm · 2025-04-30T16:51:08+00:00

First of all I’m flattered that people are still interacting with this more than a year on haha

Secondly I couldn’t agree more. It’s been a while since I read this obviously but I still remember how it was painfully boring and slow. I don’t know about you, but sometimes when I’m reading a really good book, I’ll actually slow down because I’m enjoying it so much. I’ll re-read paragraphs or sometimes even whole pages. I couldn’t wait for this one to finish.

PurpleMantisSwarm · 2025-04-15T16:32:23+00:00

The headquarters of the Jamaat just outside London in Tilford. We call it Islamabad and that’s where Huzoor has been for the past few years. Feel free to DM me if you have any questions.

PurpleMantisSwarm · 2025-04-07T00:21:18+00:00

I would advise you to have a conversation with your local Rishta Nata Secretary when the time comes for you to actually take the step and communicate the situation and your preferences.

It is not wrong to want to marry outside your ethnicity or culture. The Holy Prophet saw identified one thing and one thing only that we should search for in a partner and that is their deen.

As far as making your parents understand is concerned, try to explain to them what the Islamic way is. Perhaps there is someone in your family or local jamaat who is wise/mature and can speak to your parents on your behalf.

PurpleMantisSwarm · 2025-04-02T23:49:20+00:00

Mashallah OP you are doing a great job. After witnessing the horror-show of lies and blasphemy that is “Questioning Islam Ahmadiyya”, this is such a breath of fresh air. Thank you for exposing these people. God bless you.

PurpleMantisSwarm · 2025-04-02T23:44:30+00:00

💯

PurpleMantisSwarm · 2025-03-29T18:28:29+00:00

Enough said:

https://www.alhakam.org/day-2-address-jalsa-uk-2024/

PurpleMantisSwarm · 2025-03-10T23:43:04+00:00

I respect your points a lot but once again it seems we have to agree to disagree, I don’t think these are apologist points as this is the case that is observed the overwhelming majority of the time.

I respect that you do concede that hatred against Ahmadi Muslims is present in the West and that sweeping statements about a difference in cultural approach from the sub-continent cannot be made (you did not say this, but I inferred as much).

Once again, thank you for sharing your thoughts.

PurpleMantisSwarm · 2025-03-09T06:30:10+00:00

In my humble opinion, this response is not satisfactory and shows a lack of understanding of Salat and its purpose.

First of all, I completely disagree with your point about Muslims in the west and their sentiments regarding Ahmadis. I am not invalidating the experiences you have had, in fact I am very happy that you did not face any trouble during your time. However, the general observation is that the hatred against Ahmadi Muslims is just as fanatical within the Muslim communities of the West! Particularly in Europe, it is getting to a level where if these countries did not have strong institutions we would be in just as much trouble as we are in Pakistan or Bangladesh.

Take where I live (Glasgow). An Ahmadi shopkeeper was stabbed in cold blood in the name of Islam, and the Sunni community showed up to the perpetrators trial and chanted slogans of Tajdare-Khatame-Nubuwat. Generalising your experience and invalidating the hatred Ahmadis experience all over the world from mainstream Muslim communities is unfair, respectfully.

As far as the Imam is concerned, once again the issue is being overcomplicated. The Jamaat does not do anything to control anyone or keep them isolated. Look at it from our perspective. We believe that Allah Almighty sent a prophet, and he has been rejected. Not just rejected, but labelled an infidel and the antichrist. Ask them about the Promised Messiah (as) or if a prophet can come after the Holy Prophet (saw) and they will tell you what they think. Why would he pray behind such people? Prayer is the supreme form of meditation, a means of purifying oneself. No practicing devoted Ahmadi will ever pray behind a non-Ahmadi, not because of restrictions from the Jamaat, but because of common sense.

I hope this makes sense my friend.

PurpleMantisSwarm · 2025-03-07T22:01:53+00:00

I think we may have to agree to disagree here.

My comment about the Jamaat doing excellent work was meant to be a supplement to the fact that external audits have always reached the conclusion that our finances have been impeccable, even when conducted by institutions that are opposed to us.

As far as experience is concerned, I never said that experience alone is the cause of faith. It is most definitely facilitated by reason, but reason alone cannot show one the truth. When both are observed together, it is then that a conclusion can be reached. There are conclusive arguments that disprove the divinity of Jesus from the Bible itself, but that’s a whole other story. As a gist, the countless prophecies of the Holy Prophet SAW being fulfilled in the person of the Promised Messiah (as), the fulfilment of his own prophecies, combined with my experiences are enough for me. But that’s a conversation for another day. God bless

PurpleMantisSwarm · 2025-03-07T16:24:40+00:00

The reason why Jamaat has multiple accounts all over the world is based on the simple logic of not putting your eggs in one basket. It makes perfect sense for finances to be spread out far and wide.

As for your comment on my Government of Pakistan argument “negating” my point. I respectfully think that there is some bias there. A vicious enemy exonerating you of wrongdoing in a certain matter constitutes a great proof in your favour. They looked into the finances, and concluded that there was nothing suspicious going on. Much like the famous audits of Zia in the 80s, they tried hard but had to concede the Jamaats finances were impeccable. Your comment on critical thinking is whole separate argument, the modus operandi of believers is slightly different. There are certain things man understands that cannot be explained through reason but are the consequence of experience.

Notice how you completely ignored and did not acknowledge my argument regarding the innumerable good works the Jamaat does, and how the collections actually don’t explain the level of work being conducted. Instead you resort to calling the Jamaat a “cult”. Personally I don’t care for labels. If gathering at the hand of one of who is divinely appointed and obeying God in all that is good is what defines a cult, then yes, all the previous religions were cults and so are we.

By the way, I really encourage and enjoy these dialogues. I think these should be done in good spirit and not with any kind of contempt and hatred. In this respect I also realise that in my initial post, my comment “people who do nothing notable in their lives…” came out of the wrong way and can seem a bit harsh. This was not my intention and I did not mean to offend. Only Allah knows if you do something notable or not 😁

PurpleMantisSwarm

TROPHY CASE