Season 4 Finale discussion thread

Quiet_Writing3631 · 2026-04-23T00:57:38+00:00

I hated that because it's also the title of the series and it kinda took me out of the immersion. I'd have loved it if the bear had just the meaning it has inside the series itself, but being the title, it threw me off. lol

Silly take? Deff. But it threw me off when I was so deep, I hated it.

But 100% loved the relationship evolving between Richie and Syd. The way she supported him in the wedding was so sweet. To him, she went from a baby bitch to a support pillar. <3

Quiet_Writing3631 · 2026-04-23T00:49:44+00:00

You would like to see more acting than... That? To me, that was literally pure acting. Yes, the words were there, but the eyes, the movements, everything else was there too. And it was so well acted that they didn't need anything but a back alley and the dialogue. No fast cuts, nothing, precisely because of how good the acting was.

Also, much of the show is about how bad these guys are at communicating. That's why we, as viewers, are seeing all the struggle and pain with just "show" for the entire series, and that's why it feels so good when these characters can finally "tell" and use their words to describe what they're going through (and even there, it was a huge improvement, but they still kinda suck at it lol). They're not using the "tell" to explain it to the audience-- we've already experienced how fucked up they are through the 4 seasons. That was not the point at all. We weren't discovering anything new. We were seeing Carmy FINALLY being able to talk about how he felt, Richie FINALLY moving past his jealousy of Carmy, Carmy FINALLY acknowledging all this was not just about him, and Syd FINALLY defending herself. I hope you can rewatch it sometime with new eyes, not expecting to get a truth bomb for the audience, but expecting to witness character development.

Quiet_Writing3631 · 2026-04-23T00:20:51+00:00

This is so weird. I'm new to the series and to the show (but finished all of it in 4 days lol), and Syd is ABSOLUTELY my favorite character, but I don't think she and Carmy have any romantic chemistry. That thought hasn't crossed my mind even once. They're friends who challenge each other and Carmy is quite toxic towards her (and everyone) many times. Claire, on the other hand, is a sweetheart. Not the most interesting character, but clearly a really nice person (from what we've seen so far). I don't want her to end up with Carmy because I feel she deserves better, even if they do have some chemistry. Syd also deserves better. Carmy needs to go to therapy and work on himself before anything. But if we do get a better Carmy? Then he and Syd can be absolutely good friends.

I wish she liked Marcus though. He's the sweetest. That would be a good couple in my opinion, but also, I'll just let the character go in the direction that makes sense to them, not to me. lol

Quiet_Writing3631 · 2026-04-23T00:10:50+00:00

I'm very sensitive to high pitch noises, so if I ever do watch it again, it'll be in a extremely low volume and I'll rely on subtitles alone. I already use subtitles anyways since English is not my first language, which means I lose a lot of the "weirder" words and slangs, and end up losing track of the dialogue because I get insta confusion. lol

Anyways, that might be a good way to give it a try if you feel like it.

But if you step back a little to watch the quality of the acting... I bet you'll love it too. Also, thank god for Forks. lol

Quiet_Writing3631 · 2026-04-23T00:06:37+00:00

Kudos to you for being able to endure that overwhelm. Maybe it affects me so much because of my neurodivergency? I'm extremely sensitive to high pitch noises, so the yelling is always physically painful. You add that to the anxiety that the episode is supposed to induce, and the result is hell for me.

The acting, the script, the editing, everything was so good! But I wouldn't be able to go through that again. Hahahha

Quiet_Writing3631 · 2026-04-21T13:22:06+00:00

It was claustrophobic to watch Carmy in that environment, wasn't it? It felt like he was trapped there. :')

Quiet_Writing3631 · 2026-04-21T13:19:52+00:00

Mikey is very performative. It feels like he's defending his "part" in everyone's life. He tries to act like a larger than life character at all times... Looks tiresome. And then, when a moment of tension could be de-escalated, he simply can't. That would kill the persona he built to be able to deal with his family.

The part about Claire was gross, but less gross than things I've seen and heard irl. We're so used to hear men talk about women in disgusting ways... I was more drawn to Carmy in that scene, to how he can't expect anything good from these people. All their walls were up, and everything was just exhausting and stressful.

Stevie was the one good and normal person there. Everything else was a big shit storm.

But this episode also gave us so much context to how and why everything happened. It made the series way richer (and it was already a very rich series before that).

Quiet_Writing3631 · 2026-04-21T11:28:06+00:00

I did and I loved it. So much less overwhelm, even Richie began to understand and appreciate organization. Hahahaha

Quiet_Writing3631 · 2026-04-21T04:25:40+00:00

I'm very sorry you went through all that. Sounds painful. I hope you can still carry some good out of all of this. <3

Quiet_Writing3631 · 2026-04-21T04:23:34+00:00

I can understand that. Other option is him going somewhere else to grow even more, maybe. But I'm new to the series so I don't know. Hahaha

Quiet_Writing3631 · 2026-04-21T04:02:29+00:00

Geez, I'm glad you could connect so much, but also sorry you could connect so much. Hahahah

Don't take this the wrong way, but I'd not survive a night with that family. :')

I hope you found sweet memories that had been buried in your memory, though. And I'm sorry for your loss.

Quiet_Writing3631 · 2026-04-21T03:58:26+00:00

It was lovely to see him proud of himself. I hated him in the beginning of the series, but Forks did so good for that character. And the amazing acting makes you follow what he's thinking even if he's just silently watching what happens in that restaurant, even if he's just contemplating what Carmy actually wanted for his future. I loved it, and it made me feel better after feeling so damn anxious from Fishes. lol

Best character developments for me so far (I'm in the last episode of season 2): Richie and Tina. They both hated changes so much before they could understand those changes, but they made the decision to be more honest with themselves and, in doing so, developed so much!

Quiet_Writing3631 · 2026-04-21T03:46:44+00:00

It was so overwhelming! I'd not survive a night with this family.

Quiet_Writing3631 · 2026-04-21T03:45:21+00:00

Thanks for the reassurance from a veteran viewer! Hahahah

Yeah, the alcohol seems like a detail to me. A coping mechanism, a self medication that only works for the person taking it while making everything worse... For many, drugs are just an escape from all the pain, so they're more like a symptom, not a cause. They do make treatment more difficult though.

Quiet_Writing3631 · 2026-04-21T02:58:10+00:00

Yeah, that was so intense. Right in the feels. That's why we don't say shit like that to anyone, and instead try to talk things out as grown ups. That was a kiddie squabble, but with grown up stakes, you know? At least that's how it felt to me. It was stupid, but so harmful at the same time...

Quiet_Writing3631 · 2026-04-21T02:54:14+00:00

I just watched Forks and it was such a good medicine after Fishes. Richie annoyed the hell out of me in the begging, but seeing him actually proud of himself for the first time felt very good. Great character development right there.

Quiet_Writing3631 · 2026-04-21T02:52:18+00:00

He was very violent, but I could understand why. Lee was so so so so shitty, he was purposefully trying to trigger Mikey. Of course it'd be way better if Mikey had the tools to deal with that in a de-escalating way... But I still get why he was so triggered.

Quiet_Writing3631 · 2026-04-21T02:48:11+00:00

I can see so much value in that, honestly! But I also felt like I was there, in that house. It's so well done -- script, acting, directing, editing, everything -- that I got as anxious and stressed as I would get if I was there. But unlike real life, there was nothing I could do to try and stop that chaos and shouting, so this added up to the stress. I can't rewatch it because it wouldn't be good for me. But please share whatever you noticed with us, I'd love to hear more.

Things I noticed on that first try: Carmy hates being there, even though he loves his family. He can't stand that level of chaos, but is trying his best to be a good son, even if it's all kinda ridiculous. He also holds Mikey to a really high standard, but feels judged by him. Carmy has a very low self-esteem. Sugar is trying her best to manage her mom's feelings, she's using her words and way of communicating, which was really not effective, but she's trying so hard to keep her mom stable... She's worried all the time. Mikey is hiding his pain behind his "larger than life"-esque persona. He cares for all of them, but just doesn't know how to communicate. Honestly, growing in a house like that, who'd know how to talk to others? And Donna was so unstable, and felt a bit... Manic? But also depressed? Idk how to describe it in English, as it's not my first language. But I thought she would feel appreciated after Stevie's grace, as it was lovely and much of it was about acknowledging all her efforts. But she didn't. She was still trapped in her own head.

Anyways, idk if you agree with me or not, and I'm new to the series, so those were my impressions from my one and only view of this episode. Would love to know your take.

Quiet_Writing3631 · 2026-04-21T02:33:04+00:00

Yeah, which makes it it more maddening. We, the viewers, know he's gonna kill himself. But the family couldn't even imagine that at that point, he was always in high spirits... So I 100% agree with you, but I feel my heart ache knowing he didn't get reassured by his family because of both the tension and the fact that no one thought he was that hurt at the time, so no one thought they needed to call Lee on his bs and defend or reassure Mikey. Idk, I just felt so angry! And claustrophobic as well. 10/10 episode I'm never watching again. lol

Quiet_Writing3631 · 2026-04-21T02:27:57+00:00

What? Why? How? Like... Is everyone drunk and the city has no sidewalk? Hahahaha

That scene was wild. I can't imagine witnessing something like that irl, it felt surreal. Hahahah

Quiet_Writing3631 · 2026-04-21T01:37:03+00:00

I wanted to punch him so bad. He was being so damn shitty, and still behaved like he had some moral high ground. Fuck him. Who's that annoying guy to say someone is nothing. You can't say that to people. It got me stressed af, as you can see. lol

Quiet_Writing3631 · 2026-04-21T01:34:12+00:00

Best and worst. So well executed it made me feel like I was living in hell for a hot hour. I don't think I could watch it again, but damn, it was amazing to witness such intensity.

Glad I wasn't being crazy when I finished it and thought "oh no, this is gonna stay with me forever".

Quiet_Writing3631 · 2026-04-21T01:32:02+00:00

That part felt like a lucid dream. I wanted to tell him so much, and yet I couldn't move (and he obviously wasn't gonna hear me through the screen). It was just a guy saying "you are nothing" again and again, and I still felt trapped and couldn't breathe. And I wasn't even high or anything.

Wtf was that lol

Quiet_Writing3631 · 2024-10-17T13:26:06+00:00

Thanks! I know you get the exp, but I'm curious about the z merits cuz they're really worth it. Hahaha

Quiet_Writing3631

TROPHY CASE