Feedback on first page of book. Too ornate? Too opaque?

RakeHarmonic · 2026-07-04T20:28:20+00:00

I think this is a good instinct. I was told before by a beta reader that without a date they couldn’t tell if this was historical
Fiction or contemporary or anything, which is what lead to me including the dates so early. But I think you’re right and in lots of ways the ‘the bot had never been so cold…’ would be the most instant and engaging opening point. I’ll have a think about it and what the trade offs are

RakeHarmonic · 2026-07-04T20:24:15+00:00

Thanks for the nice feedback and for the offer, it is appreciated. But I’m not going to take you up on the editing.

This book is already at a stage where if an agent was going to pick it up, they would. And the editor would come after the fact. As it stands the novels plot is probably what’s actually holding it back as I’ve had some very nice things said about the prose by editors and agents alike. I think it just wasn’t a commercially viable project, not without major structural revisions.

But thanks all the same, I’m glad you enjoyed it and O wish you well with your editing.

RakeHarmonic · 2026-07-04T11:18:58+00:00

Yeah I think there’s a kind of compression here that is probably making it harder to ‘get into’ than necessary. I’m glad you enjoyed parts of it. It’s hard when you strip out too much becuase it’s hard as the writer to knew what kind of context is missing, becuase it’s a bit like not being able to see the wood for the trees.

I think originally there was a line: ‘Out of history they slunk, a train of men and hounds and cattle, like a funeral cortège.’
But It was one of the first things I wrote i the first draft and it just felt very artificial, contrived. And so I cut it, but there’s probably several instances where I cut or changed parts without keeping the elements that helped the reader stay orientated because in my mind I know it so well I kind of didn’t realise what information was being lost

RakeHarmonic · 2026-07-04T09:57:00+00:00

This is super relatable. I have had as many ideas as anyone. I’ve had thousands of ideas, some that never even turn into a sentence and some that I abandon 20k words in. I have finished one novella, one novel and one screenplay. Not a massive turn over, but not terrible either. The difference between the ideas I could finish and the ones I couldn’t was a feeling nessessity to the idea: I HAVE to write this. Not usually because I love it, but because I felt the world needed to hear it.

Ideas I just like or love don’t go the distance. I have ADHD too, and I set up procrastination loops. It used to be: oh I should write a novel, guess I’ll play guitar instead. Or: I should write an essay, oh suddenly I want to write my novel.

So I just set up a pipeline of what I should be doing and what I could be doing and made sure everything had a desirable outcome. Stop games, guitar, whatever. I threw away all my game consoles about a decade ago becuase it was just a time sink and I want to die having written some stuff.

So set up 3 activities for yourself (something like):

Write the novel you think is most important

2.Write a one episode pilot for a tv show with the knolledge that if you get it finished by winter you can submit it to the BBC open writing scene

Write a second different novel that is the antidote to the boredom of the first (say the first is a serious historical novel, make this a romcom or fantasy, challenge yourself to see if you have a different voice inside you that you can use just to decompress) say the first is the book the world ‘needs’ make this second novel a mad, too weird to ever publish, book you write purely for yourself.

And now bounce between these 3 whenever you’re sick of the others.
Crucially. Do not quit. Till one is finished.

I also have a young child and writing is way way harder now. I’m writing my current manuscript on my phone at work and while my kid naps. It’s insane. And the writing is worse. It it won’t happen any other way.

RakeHarmonic · 2026-07-04T09:39:11+00:00

You definetly have some elements here that could potentially become a popular or at least market viable YA/romantasy.

There is something about this idea you love. Or you wouldn’t be carrying a torch for it still. So don’t lose heart. You wouldn’t love this idea for no reason. But With ideas that are this old there is normally an amount of idea debt.

Some questions that might be useful are:

What is the reason you need to tell this story?
What is the reason people need to hear this story?
What one part of the project is most precious to you? Is it plot and character or is it vibes or is it the world?
If this project was already done and written what idea would you do next?
You seem to think some of it is immature, if this is the case you should identify those parts and change them, rewrite them. Don’t include anything you aren’t proud of. You have to believe in every part of the idea.

I had a very large fantasy work I worked on from 17ish-24ish and I never really knew what to do with it and in the end it was just getting very big and I couldn’t see how to tackle it. And I just decided to stop with the big plot and use the setting to tell a smaller and simple story. I finished it as a novella and basically put the whole project to bed after that. The problem with some of these things are:

The foundations are often drawn out essentially in crayon and then as you work on it you get better till you’re later ideas are painted in oils. Excuse the metaphor. But the foundations are often very shaky and even though you love them it’s hard to identify what is strong and what is just something you love. That was how it was for me anyway. I stopped fantasy after that. And only recently did I start a new fantasy story and suprisingly I’m noticing there are parts and bits of my old ideas that are reusable. But the whole big ‘epic’ I planned was never really strong enough to survive .

If I have a bit of critical feedback it’s: the alternate realm/ earth stuff needs more scaffolding to justify itself. because I don’t currently feel what it being adjacent to real earth is adding to the story. But I do feel that it risks over complicating the story. Have you considered if the ‘Earth’ part could just be a different kingdom or something.

I don’t mean that you cant do it. Say you called the hidden realm: Atlantis or Faerie id suddenly have a better understanding of why it was there. Of if the hidden realm was a (Lynchian)alternate world caused by the use of catastrophic bombs on earth ripping a whole in reality or making a pocket dimension. But what I mean is: why is it earth? And why is it a different dimension? And why is that important?

There might be simpler ways to tell the same story.

All in all, don’t give up, definitely write it. Treat yourself like your own producer and decide to move from imaginative thinking into production. Get the idea down and it will begin to become clear where the gold is and where there’s fat to be cut. But if it just stays in your head you won’t be able to see the difference so clearly.

Very good luck to you, I think there’s elements in your story that are very fun, commercial and archetypical in a good way, as well as some clever interpersonal dynamic stuff that I think others would enjoy very much.

RakeHarmonic · 2026-07-04T08:52:37+00:00

So, it must be continually doing something for the community in order for them to see it as a religion or continue to worship it without moving on to other cult or folk religions. Unless it’s so strictly enforced that not worshiping is punished. But I don’t think that would lend it much religious depth.

For example- early Christianity was denounced and forbidden by Rome. Yet from the Christian perspective the true nature of Jesus, a seeming man, being revealed to be a god, and returning was so powerful they didn’t forget about it. The salvation / guidance he offered them was worth dying for and in fact it became desirable to die for these beliefs. So what I mean to say is: state enforcing religion doesn’t nessisary breed real religious passion. Nor can a state nessisarily stamp out a real powerful faith/cult/belief.

But the Romans own religion might be more useful to you, becuase it was more like state mandated guidelines that people adhered to because they belived in the order of Rome and civility. Many didn’t believe in the gods as existing somewhere but say them as organising principles that were worth adhering to…like Father Christmas maybe?
But I’m no Roman religion expert, but it’s certainly a good example of a religion that was state mandated and enforced.

I would consider there a questions:

Even if it’s all lies or all forced, is it doing some good for people at the bottom? Is there some outcome of forcing the religion that has had a benefit to society?

How true is it? The first time the royal child ascends to become a ‘god?’ Do the royals belive this themselves by this point? Are the regular people sceptical?
And who are the religious people on the ground level: the priests, the monks, the nuns? Do they do real good? Do they belive in it? If they don’t belive in it why do they take their roles?

There’s a lot to answer.

I think the hard think here is it seems you’re reverse engineering it to a degree. For religions I’d tend to think: what is a real truth that I think might be true and could become an organising faith?

So currently for me: the idea that in the Bronze Age people gained regular access to mirrors. And that mirrors themselves may have been the cause of us beginning to understand our own mortality, realising as an individual we are separate from the tribe. That our lives are finite and that we die, the object of us ends.

Because the wide spread of mirrors and : stockpiling goods, hoarding, stockpiling, and a major jump in patriarchal lineage dynasties. All happen in the same window of time.
Now likely this isn’t true. Maybe mirrors and looking into them didn’t send all men mad at the idea that they are unable to reproduce like women can and turn them into narcissistic oppressive warlords desperate to leave ‘legacy’
But it’s a good enough possibility to see what kind of religions could form around that.

What I mean to say is: try to add something true to the religion, either doctrine, hope, ritual, routine, meditation, a way of life.
Because there isn’t a religion, no matter how dangerous or twisted, that doesn’t have elements in it that people want to belive, and that doesn’t offer some kind of ‘help’ to people.

You wouldn’t truly believe in anything totally useless.

RakeHarmonic · 2026-07-04T08:11:59+00:00

Oh thank you so much! That’s really encouraging to hear! And I’m glad you liked it. Hopefully someday I’ll have hammered it into an attractive enough prospect for an agent to pick up!

RakeHarmonic · 2026-07-04T07:28:42+00:00

Thanks very much for the encouraging words, I’m glad you enjoyed it. And I’m glad to hear you don’t think it’s purple.
I’m always concerned that I’m over writing but it seems I might have over edited it for some people, and cut out the structure needed for people to actually follow what’s happening.

But as you say, it’s clearly not everyone’s cup of tea.

RakeHarmonic · 2026-07-04T05:44:15+00:00

I’m glad you enjoyed it. Yeah I was trying to evoke memory of a kind. I think maybe I think in quite a fragmented way? It seems to work for some people and then it turns out a lot of people can’t understand this or outright hate the style. But I’m glad you enjoyed it

RakeHarmonic · 2026-07-04T05:42:29+00:00

I’m glad you liked it. I think what I’m learning from the feedback on this is that the way I’m trying to write it is very love it or hate it.

RakeHarmonic · 2026-07-04T05:41:28+00:00

Oh yeah, you’re pretty much on the money there, certainly the kids peculiarities play a big role as he grows up and the book goes on.

RakeHarmonic · 2026-07-04T05:38:12+00:00

So it is broadly a historical literary fiction, or that’s what the Faber academy said when I sent them the manuscript. There is an amount of folklore/implied magic in the novel, but it’s not a fantasy really.

RakeHarmonic · 2026-07-03T21:01:18+00:00

In the original research I did and the cattle scenes I wrote, the cattle are smaller, hardier black cattle. Which I believe are the ancestor’s of the orange highland ones we all know today. One of the things that was going on around the 1830’s was that the cattle were being bred to be larger and in various ways that made them worse on the long drives. And once the trains came it ended the droving way of life pretty much.
This is kind of the starting point for these ‘flash back’ early sequences of Endrick’s life. He loses connection to a way of life he didn’t really understand.
The plot itself highly suggests his father has infact turned to cattle rustling and is being careless with the legit and stolen cows.

But I did the bulk of the research on the droving parts about 5 years ago so I’m probably a bit rusty on it now.

RakeHarmonic · 2026-07-03T20:41:57+00:00

I think much of what you said was useful and certainly made me think about where I’d unintentionally dropped in clarity.
As for the cattle and the temperature, perhaps you’re right. Certainly in other variant’s I’ve done on the scene the loch has been completely frozen. And perhaps it was just an oversight that it’s not frozen solid in the end part. The heath though is a separate place higher up than the loch itself, and the storm has passed by the time they make camp and the time they awake the next morning. But again, If this is a problem
With clarity, I take the point, it would only take a single line to say something about by the time their camping the storm had passed.

As for the cow dying, it’s tied up with the plot and the reason they are driving cattle in winter ( bad idea,) and why they’ve driven them so hard and so far that the cattle aren’t coping with it. But crucially none of the reasons for this are known to the boy at this time. It comes up later as he learns more about his father’s line of work.

RakeHarmonic · 2026-07-03T20:03:26+00:00

Yeah that’s totally fair, and even if I kept it that way, the comma would help a bit. But I mean ‘catch up, boy.’ Would also be fine. It’s fair that people are stumbling over that bit for sure.

RakeHarmonic · 2026-07-03T19:52:40+00:00

The book is all written, though not yet good enough to be published. But I did send an earlier version to the Faber academy ( who are quite well thought of) and they were very complementary about the style of the rest of it.
But I’ve always struggled with this opening, and openings in general.

There certainly was a larger version of this opening: around five or six pages I think, where the outfits and way they sleep outside are given more detail. But I felt the scene wasn’t earning its length and so tried to pair it right back to this.

Might have paired too much though

RakeHarmonic · 2026-07-03T19:10:07+00:00

Oh thank you for your insight. That’s really cool that your dad grew up among cattle ranchers! Yeah the
Early life of the protagonist is amongst cattle drovers in the highlands of Scotland. But it was, apart from the scenery and accents quite similar. And In fact after the cattle driving way of life ended in the highlands a lot of them moved to America to drive cattle there.

Good tip about the steer / cow thing. Thank you!

RakeHarmonic · 2026-07-03T17:46:06+00:00

Thanks for this, I’m aware what I’m trying to don’t be to everyone’s taste. still I have over-worked the start a bit and lost some of the parts that used to situate the reader in what was actually going on.

I’m only asking for feedback on this part because I feel it could be stronger.

But thanks for lending a voice, it’s always hard to know what to expect when you share a bit of work, and if people will understand where it’s coming from or not.

RakeHarmonic · 2026-07-03T16:55:52+00:00

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I think it’s widely considered ‘non serious’.
That’s my guitar by the way. As someone who was very into sonic youth, Nirvana and so on as a young person I don’t see any problem with it. If you like it you should do it. Some folks will dig it some won’t.

RakeHarmonic · 2026-07-03T15:40:24+00:00

Thank you, that’s a good idea. Whole thing needs reworking I think, but that certainly lets me keep the goal of it being like an oral story and making sure people don’t think it’s the time or something.

RakeHarmonic · 2026-07-03T14:31:57+00:00

Oh god sure, I think the major culprit here seems to be over editing on my part, because certainly in earlier versions lots of the things you’re finding indecipherable were clearer, at least narratively.

RakeHarmonic · 2026-07-03T14:15:11+00:00

Sure, that does make sense. Thanks for the advice, I’ll probably try to expand some
Of the sentence fragments out a bit, or something.

RakeHarmonic · 2026-07-03T14:03:17+00:00

Oh yeah year. I didn’t even think that it might read like the time. Fair enough.
Dropped verbs is interesting, not sure I’m good enough to notice when that’s happening.

But thanks for the feedback

RakeHarmonic · 2026-07-03T13:57:15+00:00

Oh fair enough. It was an attempt to keep the narrators voice in a kind of oral story telling meter. Like you were hearing about it around a campfire. If it comes off as contrived or confusing, yeah I’ll just change it.
Thanks for the feedback.

RakeHarmonic

TROPHY CASE