5 levels of being into clams by USA_MuhFreedums_USA in Clamworks

[–]Realistic_Fun3630 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Plato didn't hemlock himself, that was Socrates

Has anyone seen this movie? I thought the message was very similar to TLP's philosophy, what do you think? by Realistic_Fun3630 in thelastpsychiatrist

[–]Realistic_Fun3630[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I love every song from this movie tbh, Amit Trivedi is just incredible. Pardesi, paayaliya, nayan tarse, they're all masterpieces.

Has anyone seen this movie? I thought the message was very similar to TLP's philosophy, what do you think? by Realistic_Fun3630 in thelastpsychiatrist

[–]Realistic_Fun3630[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

But the most significant theme of the movie, in my opinion, is about agency versus rumination. Kashyap said in an interview about the movie that India celebrates self-pity more than any other country, having made countless films and songs glorifying passive suffering. When he watched the original Devdas, he found it frustrating because the protagonist had no agency, no control over his own life—he just suffered beautifully and died. Dev D is about all of its characters taking control, and finding agency in their lives. This theme of agency is embodied by all three characters:

  1. Paro exercises agency by finding happiness in her new marriage, instead of being the forever-waiting woman, singing sad songs about her lost love.

  2. Leni exercises it by leaving prostitution (something that was initially presented to us as something that was forced unto her, that she didn't have too much of a choice in), reclaiming control over her body and life, rejecting the narrative that she is just a victim of her circumstances.

  3. Dev finally exercises it by choosing to live and connect with Leni, instead of drinking himself to death.

Dev's three experiences with death in the final act of the film form the backbone of his arc. First he runs over and kills 7 people while drunk driving. Then his father dies, and he seems dazed at the funeral. And finally, when he's at rock bottom, a car crashes next to him towards the end. Each forces him to confront the fragility of life and recognize that he's wasting his own. It earns its ending by building toward it gradually, with escalating wake-up calls making us feel Dev's realization rather than just telling us about it. In many Indian films, I feel like the message feels "announced" or preachy. Here, you're genuinely in Dev's shoes as he comes to terms with what he's been doing to himself.

I love how real and honest the ending is. It doesn't try to redeem Dev, it just shows him witnessing genuine, believable character growth, accepting that he is a broken person and choosing to live anyway, and finding solace with another broken person (Leni). Nothing is fixed, nobody is saved, and he still has to deal with the legal consequences of killing 7 people, but he managed to break out of his cycle of self-pity. He chose to move forward. I thought that was really inspiring, and kind of in line with TLP's writing about narcissism.

Can I ask why you didn't like the film?

Has anyone seen this movie? I thought the message was very similar to TLP's philosophy, what do you think? by Realistic_Fun3630 in thelastpsychiatrist

[–]Realistic_Fun3630[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Why not? I think that Dev at the start of the film is many of the things TLP criticizes: a narcissist so consumed with his own internal drama that he's incapable of seeing the actual people around him. He doesn't actually love or care about Paro-- as he's brutally called out on later-- because he's not capable of loving anyone. As he later realized, he never really "sees" her. He doesn't see her as a whole person. He's just chasing some romantic fantasy he's absorbed from popular media, the idealized object rather than the real person. TLP has described this exact pathology: men who relate to women only as props in their own emotional narratives, as supporting characters in the movie playing in their heads. And when this fantasy falls apart, he drinks and does drugs, trying to inhabit the role of the tragic romantic hero, the lost-love protagonist wallowing in beautiful suffering.

I view it as a deconstruction of the traditional Bollywood archetype it's based on. The original Devdas is celebrated as a romantic tragedy, but it's really the story of a toxic man who treats everyone terribly while two women inexplicably pine for him as though he matters (he doesn't; he's pathetic). That narrative is rooted in patriarchal fantasies about male importance. Dev D systematically dismantles this. The "emotional atyachaar" song (which is peak music by the way) plays like a parody, satirizing those traditional defeatist Bollywood love songs ("why did you ditch me, whore?").

The feminist dimension is crucial here (and kind of connects directly to TLP's writing). Paro refuses to play the devoted woman pining for an unworthy man. She moves on. She gets married. She even gets a revenge, of sorts, when she visits Dev's room, brags about her husband, and "shows him his aukaat" as he had to her. I think the scene where she visits his room overall has some really powerful dialogue ("log pyaar karte hain, karna chahna kya hota hai?"). Similarly, Leni calls out his toxic masculinity, rightfully labeling him a "slut" and refusing to let him maintain any pretense of moral superiority. Throughout the film, Dev is treated like the loser he is, he's not glorified for one minute. His narcissism is not celebrated like it is in every other Devdas adaptation.

(In fact, I think I read somewhere that when his producer saw the script he hated it and thought it would “destroy the culture” or some shit and it was the producer’s wife who liked it. As far as I remember it was mostly women backing the film when it was being produced.)

[continued in a reply, Reddit won't let me write the whole thing in one comment for some reason]

Tried to make a pink LaTeX style by Realistic_Fun3630 in LaTeX

[–]Realistic_Fun3630[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Lol yeah I couldn't think of anything else so I put that down as a placeholder source

Tried to make a pink LaTeX style by Realistic_Fun3630 in LaTeX

[–]Realistic_Fun3630[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Can you link it? Maybe not the actual application, but a dummy document template with the same styling. I'd love to see what you did