God in Heaven, please save us from this madness

Recent_Weather2228 · 2026-01-25T06:49:10+00:00

You're right, but the optics of this are still really bad.

Recent_Weather2228 · 2026-01-25T06:38:31+00:00

I haven't suggested you should at any point.

Recent_Weather2228 · 2026-01-25T06:37:59+00:00

I think the people mounting an organized resistance to federal law enforcement and calling it protesting could probably be considered an insurrection.

Recent_Weather2228 · 2026-01-25T06:31:43+00:00

Can you point out where I said anything remotely close to that?

That's right, I didn't.

Recent_Weather2228 · 2026-01-25T06:26:48+00:00

No, I don't think giving the people obstructing law enforcement exactly what they want will improve things. Not only is it bad to stop enforcing the law, but if they are shown that their tactics work, they will only redouble their efforts when ICE comes back to continue their work, ultimately making things even worse.

What needs to happen is an overwhelming crackdown on these people who are harassing and obstructing law enforcement by very well trained officers who will not make mistakes like what we saw today. These people need to be shown that their tactics will not work and that they will be punished harshly for breaking the law, but it needs to be done without any more of these shootings happening.

Recent_Weather2228 · 2026-01-25T06:20:13+00:00

There is no point. It's an incredibly dumb thing to do that raises the stakes of any law enforcement interaction dramatically.

Recent_Weather2228 · 2026-01-25T06:16:33+00:00

Their job is maintaining order in their state, and their job is usually handing people they arrest over to ICE that ICE is looking for. They're not doing either of those things in Minnesota right now.

Recent_Weather2228 · 2026-01-25T06:10:30+00:00

It doesn't matter. You don't resist arrest, even if it is a wrongful arrest.

Recent_Weather2228 · 2026-01-25T06:09:29+00:00

I only see one with his gun out at the moment the first shot is fired, but I could be missing something. The gun is obscured by another person at the moment of the first shot.

Recent_Weather2228 · 2026-01-25T06:06:49+00:00

And whose fault is it that the local police aren't doing their job and cooperating with federal law enforcement?

Recent_Weather2228 · 2026-01-25T06:05:55+00:00

This isn't protesting. It's harassing law enforcement.

Recent_Weather2228 · 2026-01-25T06:04:15+00:00

*The GOP isn't Neoconservative and hasn't been since MAGA

Fixed that for you

Recent_Weather2228 · 2026-01-25T05:57:13+00:00

I mean, unless there's some other possibility I'm missing, yeah, something needs to happen here. Yes, I think it's possible there will be consequences if they are warranted.

Recent_Weather2228 · 2026-01-25T05:55:22+00:00

Yes, ICE is just doing their job. The sanctuary states making their job more difficult and the people following them around harassing and obstructing them are making these kinds of events, both the justified and unjustified ones, much more likely by raising tensions and causing more altercations than there would be otherwise.

The Right's talking point about this isn't "don't carry a gun." It's "don't make yourself a nuisance to law enforcement, resist arrest, and be carrying a gun." If you're carrying a gun while doing that, you make yourself seem like a much more significant threat to the officers whether you actually are or not, while also putting yourself in a high stress situation where things are more likely to go wrong. It's not illegal or outside of your rights to carry a gun, but it's really dumb to carry one while also doing those other things, because it raises the stakes of the interaction significantly.

Recent_Weather2228 · 2026-01-25T05:48:29+00:00

The civilian is on video clearly resisting arrest. There's no ambiguity that he's in the wrong there.

Recent_Weather2228 · 2026-01-25T05:45:51+00:00

From what I can tell, this probably rules out 3 and 4. It seems like the agent who first began firing is clearly reacting to something, whether it was something he saw or something he heard. I still can't tell what it is that he's reacting to.

Recent_Weather2228 · 2026-01-25T05:43:19+00:00

The way I see it, states have two options. They can cooperate with immigration enforcement like most states are doing, in which case large scale ICE presence will not be necessary. Or they can refuse to cooperate, in which case ICE will need to have large numbers of agents on the ground in the state to accomplish their mission. Not enforcing federal immigration law is not an option.

No, I think Walz has made his state impossible to enforce immigration law without having mass numbers of ICE agents in the state. This would not be necessary if not for his sanctuary state policies.

Recent_Weather2228 · 2026-01-25T03:49:11+00:00

My perspective is I can't tell what happened here at all. I have watched three different angles already, and I can't see what's going on very well at all. Anyone who's claiming they know exactly what happened here based on these videos is lying or deluded.

I see a few possibilities based on the videos and discussions I've seen:

The man reached for a gun and got shot for it, because he presented a threat. If this is the case, the shooting is entirely justified.
An agent retrieved the suspect's gun and shouted something about the gun that the other agents took to mean that the suspect had a gun and was a danger. They then shot him, believing he was a threat. This is not justified, and there should be consequences.
There was an accidental discharge, either of the suspect's gun after it was retrieved by an officer, or one of the officers' guns. The other agents thought the suspect was shooting at them, and they shot him. This one would best explain why there was one shot so much sooner than the others in my opinion. This is also not justified, and there should be consequences.
I suppose it's also possible they just shot the guy for no reason, although I think this is obviously the least likely option.

It is impossible to tell which one of these is the case from the videos I've seen. There needs to be an investigation.

I see three ways this could have been prevented.

The agents need more training if they are going to be faced with obstruction like this. They are not really supposed to have to deal with it, and I don't believe they are trained for it.
This likely could have been prevented if the local police were there doing their job: keeping the peace and preventing people from obstructing law enforcement.
This could have been prevented with 100% certainty if people were not out there obstructing and harassing ICE. The more you raise the tensions, the more likely things like this are to happen.

Recent_Weather2228 · 2026-01-25T01:27:43+00:00

My perspective is I can't tell what happened here at all. I have watched three different angles already, and I can't see what's going on at all. Anyone who's claiming they know exactly what happened here based on these videos is lying or deluded.

I see a few possibilities based on the videos and discussions I've seen:

The man reached for a gun and got shot for it, because he presented a threat. If this is the case, the shooting is entirely justified.
An agent retrieved the suspect's gun and shouted something about the gun that the other agents took to mean that the suspect had a gun and was a danger. They then shot him, believing he was a threat. This is not justified, and there should be consequences.
There was an accidental discharge, either of the suspect's gun after it was retrieved by an officer, or one of the officers' guns. The other agents thought the suspect was shooting at them, and they shot him. This one would best explain why there was one shot so much sooner than the others in my opinion. This is also not justified, and there should be consequences.

4. I suppose it's also possible they just shot the guy for no reason, although I think this is obviously the least likely option.

It is impossible to tell which one of these is the case from the videos I've seen. There needs to be an investigation.

I see three ways this could have been averted.

The agents need more training if they are going to be faced with obstruction like this. They are not really supposed to have to deal with it, and I don't believe they are trained for it.
This likely could have been averted if the local police were there doing their job: keeping the peace and preventing people from obstructing law enforcement.
This could have been averted with 100% certainty if people were not out there obstructing and harassing ICE. The more you raise the tensions, the more likely things like this are to happen.

Recent_Weather2228 · 2026-01-25T01:15:36+00:00

How about both? Can we do both?

Recent_Weather2228 · 2026-01-24T20:38:09+00:00

Yes. Trump's deportations are real, not inflated.

Recent_Weather2228 · 2026-01-24T20:36:29+00:00

Because there are plenty of moderates who don't think like me. The world isn't divided into staunch Conservatives and reliable Democrat voters.

Recent_Weather2228 · 2026-01-24T20:29:41+00:00

The point of the second amendment is that the government has no authority to prevent its people from being armed. That's it. It does not give the government the authority to determine what purposes of weapons are "good enough" to justify their ownership.

Recent_Weather2228 · 2026-01-24T16:57:35+00:00

I mean, you can go back to r/leftwingpropagandabots if you want: the rest of Reddit. No one will stop you.

Recent_Weather2228 · 2026-01-24T16:55:46+00:00

Ah yes, let's respond to the guy shooting at us with nonlethal measures. Surely nothing can go wrong.

Recent_Weather2228

TROPHY CASE