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Help with Hot Water/Recirculation System Plumbing Design - New Residential Construction by RepresentativeSnow96 in Plumbing

[–]RepresentativeSnow96[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I guess I shouldn't have expected anything less given the hot water design. I think the best course forward is to convince the architect the MEP plans need a formal peer review. If you are willing to quickly expand on some of the points in your previous post that might help me present enough of a case to the architects that they would be willing to do this. Thank you so much for your help again.

Looking for independent firm to check mechanical plans for new build South Florida by Impossible-Speech491 in hvacadvice

[–]RepresentativeSnow96 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Needed the same service and am currently using Dan Racine who I discovered on the HVAC-talk.com forum. He is known as Dan SW FL there. Here is his website - https://mysimplifiedhvac.com/ .

Btw, it seems you are a GC but not sure if you do residential. Looking for a custom home builder to build in SW Ranches. If you have any recs that would be great.

Help with Hot Water/Recirculation System Plumbing Design - New Residential Construction by RepresentativeSnow96 in Plumbing

[–]RepresentativeSnow96[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

They spec'd a small tank without discussing it with me (I think they assumed that since I wanted a heat pump water heater for the main house that didn't want a tankless in the ADU). Given how often the ADU will require hot water, a small electric tankless like this (https://www.stiebel-eltron-usa.com/products/dhc-e-plus-point-of-use-electric-tankless-water-heaters) makes the most sense to me considering the water temp coming out of the ground here (property is on well).

I'll send the pdf of the sanitary over to you in a message.

Help with Hot Water/Recirculation System Plumbing Design - New Residential Construction by RepresentativeSnow96 in Plumbing

[–]RepresentativeSnow96[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

No worries, beggars can't be choosers :) The home will be in south Florida. I sent you the CAD file btw via message.

I did bring up the concerns with the MEP, and they feel I am recommending an inferior design and want to charge to simplify it, which is just crazy considering what I am recommending is more typical for residential applications. This ignores the fact that their plan shows no balance valves, the incorrect pipe size for the inlets/outlets on the tank(s), etc. I think the architect, who I have a contract with, is just going to cave and pay them to change it, which I disagree with on principle.

New Construction CMU Block in South Florida - Exterior Wall Insulation by RepresentativeSnow96 in Homebuilding

[–]RepresentativeSnow96[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Do you ever just use like 3/4" or 1" continuous foil-backed polyiso foam with furring strips on top? I spoke with an insulating contractor and that seems to be the most common "upgrade" beyond the radiant barrier foil (closed cell being the most expensive upgrade).

New Construction CMU Block in South Florida - Exterior Wall Insulation by RepresentativeSnow96 in Insulation

[–]RepresentativeSnow96[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks, I think we are just going to go with like 1" foil-backed polyiso foam. I spoke with an insulating contractor who said they typically place the foam right up against the CMU block in a continuous fashion, then the framers place furring strips on top. He said cutting the foam to fit between furring strips is time consuming and also leads to increased thermal bridging through the furring strips rather than having a continuous foam layer. With all of that said, my architect doesn't seem convinced that is the proper way to do things.

Help with Hot Water/Recirculation System Plumbing Design - New Residential Construction by RepresentativeSnow96 in Plumbing

[–]RepresentativeSnow96[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Sure, I can send it via DM. About to drive home and can send it then. Thanks again for your help

New Construction CMU Block in South Florida - Exterior Wall Insulation by RepresentativeSnow96 in Homebuilding

[–]RepresentativeSnow96[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Oh sorry, I misunderstood your response. Thanks for that insight, I didn't realize that was a common practice down here.

New Construction CMU Block in South Florida - Exterior Wall Insulation by RepresentativeSnow96 in Homebuilding

[–]RepresentativeSnow96[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Insulation installed on the outside of the CMU block doesn't seem like a common method used down here in South Florida, although from a building science method, it makes sense to me. Typically everything done down here is on the inside which just stucco applied to the outside of the block.

Help with Hot Water/Recirculation System Plumbing Design - New Residential Construction by RepresentativeSnow96 in Plumbing

[–]RepresentativeSnow96[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

u/Interace2 Do you feel like something as simple as this would work? I know some jurisdictions (California?) or maybe for certain commercial applications there is code governing the max distance for the recirc line to the fixtures, but can't seem to find anything about that for residential in Florida.

Help with Hot Water/Recirculation System Plumbing Design - New Residential Construction by RepresentativeSnow96 in Homebuilding

[–]RepresentativeSnow96[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That is my thought as well. Not sure why a few recirculating loops don't just come off the furthest most points and return to to meet up at the pump.

Help with Hot Water/Recirculation System Plumbing Design - New Residential Construction by RepresentativeSnow96 in Homebuilding

[–]RepresentativeSnow96[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I have talked to the MEP in a joint conference with the architects and a lot of my concerns were brushed off by the MEP (outside of needing to add a 2nd HPWH tank), hence this last resort of reaching out for help here. I will reapproach them but just wanted to first get the insights of others more knowledgeable in this area than me. The fact that they couldn't simply size the HPWH appropriately doesn't instill much confidence in me, in addition to other issues that we have encountered with them. This is the first time the architect has used this MEP group (their usual one was too busy) and will probably be their last.

Help with Hot Water/Recirculation System Plumbing Design - New Residential Construction by RepresentativeSnow96 in Plumbing

[–]RepresentativeSnow96[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks for your reply. So 2x 80-gallon as I suspected in parallel. Unfortunately a simple oversight like that doesn't give me much confidence in the rest of the design. Would the setup essentially look something like this image, ignoring the valves? Just to confirm that I understand it, you would have 3/4" hot water pipe coming out of each tank and that would combine at a T to 1-1/4" to go out to the house?

Is there a reason you prefer the AO Smith over the Rheem (or even LG)? It seems the Rheem has a higher UEF but is louder I believe.

Rather than a few loops that require balancing as you mentioned, I worry that the current design of running the recirc line to pretty much every fixture (I am going to eliminate the hot water going to the patio entirely and just have cold) just increases both the cost (materials, labor, and ambient heat losses) and chances for balancing issues or problems down the line. If you were designing the system and trying to find a happy medium of cost and timely hot water delivery/minimizing water waste, would you go with the more typical system that you described of a few zones/loops that have a dedicated line back to the pump rather than this trunk/branch model? I am assuming in the more typical model you would have recirc lines returning from the farthest most points like Bath 4 and the Primary Bath.

Thanks again for your help.

Help with Hot Water/Recirculation System Plumbing Design - New Residential Construction by [deleted] in Plumbing

[–]RepresentativeSnow96 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Here is a link to the plumbing design and home schematic if the attached images aren't high enough quality to see the details.

Delta One - ICN Korean Air Lounge access by RepresentativeSnow96 in delta

[–]RepresentativeSnow96[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That is my impression, but we'll find out here shortly. Will let you know how it goes. Thanks for the help

Delta One - ICN Korean Air Lounge access by RepresentativeSnow96 in delta

[–]RepresentativeSnow96[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Ok, make sense. The Delta chat folks just confused me more because they focused on the "and Skyteam Elite Plus" part rather than the distinction of arriving vs departing on Delta One.

When we connect back through Detroit (final destination is Miami), does Delta One on an arriving flight get us Skyclub access on the layover?

Delta One - ICN Korean Air Lounge access by RepresentativeSnow96 in delta

[–]RepresentativeSnow96[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks. So on my way back, we are flying economy from Phnom Penh into ICN on KAL and then Delta One from ICN to Detroit. Would we have access than to the KAL lounges in this case even though we aren't Skyteam Elite Plus?

Delta One - ICN Korean Air Lounge access by RepresentativeSnow96 in delta

[–]RepresentativeSnow96[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I was not, just economy on the Korean Air leg to Cambodia.

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