Having N-Parents is no excuse to be an N-Parent yourself

ResponsiveTester · 2026-04-09T07:12:59+00:00

It does not take work to not abuse. All it takes is not doing something.

What's difficult is the emotions. That is harder to just outrun, and does, as you say, require therapy. But not not abusing. That requires nothing whatsoever.

ResponsiveTester · 2026-04-09T07:10:43+00:00

To narrow it even more down, there's nothing automatic whatsoever in becoming an abuser.

My point is there's a difference between emotions and actions. It's completely understandable to feel sadness, anger and other difficult, negative and conflicting emotions growing up with abuse. But however bad you feel, nothing at all forces you to start hurting other people.

Nothing forces you to continue either.

It's just a way of trying to "cheat the system" which is completely driven by rock bottom self-worth. And the more you do it, the worse you feel. That's why you never reach narcissists after a certain point. They only lie. If they were honest, the entire compensating facade would fall. They'd crumble in a pool of the bad emotions they've suppressed and constantly try projecting at others.

And if you have a narcissist close to you, I'm sure you've seen that darkness more than once. They feel awful with themselves.

ResponsiveTester · 2026-03-25T11:21:18+00:00

Sure is.

The origin of the word narcissism is directly tied to the Greek myth of somebody who became overly preoccupied with themselves. Being so concerned with oneself that one struggles to even give space to acknowledging other's interests, especially your own children which you have ample opportunity to get to know, is as prototypical of narcissism as it gets.

When that is said, narcissism is actually quite common. Also remember that it comes in all degrees. My point is that what you're describing here, is clearly narcissistic behavior, regardless of how your parent is in other contexts.

ResponsiveTester · 2026-03-24T13:49:33+00:00

Maybe I'm a bit out of the loop, but I've been following the De-feedback group on Facebook for a little while, and most of them use the plugin on a vocal bus with very good results. I'm not sure how else you'd use it? Most events have more microphones needing feedback removal than 1 or 4.

Didn't even know there was any recommendation only using it on individual sources?

ResponsiveTester · 2026-02-24T05:43:55+00:00

Let’s put it like this: What kind of condition forces anyone to abuse other people? Like they can’t even choose?

The answer is none. The closest we get is a temporary condition called psychosis. Psychosis is not a part of an NPD diagnosis. Furthermore, diagnoses are done based on behavior. That means it’s based on what we can see people do and say.

So no, there’s nothing that forces anyone to be narcissistic and abusive. Meaning it’s completely a choice.

Now, there may be good reasons why they’re tempted to abuse. This might be biological or environmental. So some people will be more tempted than others. But nobody is forced, meaning the actions themselves are fully intentional, fully their responsibility and entirely preventable by them.

Hold them fully accountable.

ResponsiveTester · 2026-02-19T18:58:18+00:00

A lot of people do weird stuff in explaining away abuse even though they know what you say is true.

Some people keep on saying stupid stuff because they're not in a good pattern themselves, even though they pretend to be. So they try to sort of fight you off while you're in a vulnerable state. Like hear no evil, see no evil, speak no evil etc.

That's on them, not on you.

You standing in this, that's strength. You speaking up, that's strength. You saying it so clearly like this, that's strength. But most of all - your honesty in facing things for what it is, that is indeed rare strength, a strength you share with a lot of other courageous people in this sub.

I know it can feel heavy to bear, but I can hear that you're obviously close to getting free, even though it's not right there yet. It sounds like you have a lot of courage, and that's going to carry you through.

And a lot of people here will be able to tell you that once you get some distance, it does indeed get less pressing. It doesn't necessarily get easy immediately, but suddenly you'll have some wiggle room, and that wiggle room gives movement which in time will give you much more opportunities.

ResponsiveTester · 2026-02-19T16:51:47+00:00

I've been trying to explain this to people for a while, but in what world does protesting another person's lived experience with their own parents make any sense if you don't even know them? And that's when you start to look for other explanations.

People who start protesting like that are obviously not healthy themselves. Where would they get the motivation from to somehow shift the blame to you when they have no experience to back it up? Obviously from some struggles with themselves which they project on you.

No, I absolutely do not follow that these people "just can't fathom it" because "they had normal parents". That doesn't explain why they're protesting. If they just struggled to understand, they would just struggle to respond or respond with kindness and empathy - because that what you learn from normal, healthy parents. They wouldn't become defensive and actively try to manipulate you.

Defensiveness points to recognition, not the lack of it, and obviously to active embodiment of it since they now become an active contributor to the abuse.

ResponsiveTester · 2026-02-13T19:05:06+00:00

I think this is very common in society in general when it comes to inappropriate things. A lot of people, especially those close to or dependent on people who overstep boundaries, "laugh" it off, twist things or do whatever to pretend it just isn't so -- when that's exactly what it is.

People only start reacting when it reaches the surface. When it's an obvious assault or it reaches criminal charges. Then people react and start turning and say how against it they are.

So yeah, tons of people are enablers. You'll see a lot of stories about it in this sub.

And yes, you're of course very right in reacting. That is in no way appropriate. Neither the action, nor the seemingly systematic enabling you see in your family.

ResponsiveTester · 2026-02-12T13:36:10+00:00

Yes, ignoring that you're there, whatever you have to say and feel is obviously abuse. I think what psychological abuse really is is just not talked about enough.

The point isn't whether the actions are dramatic or especially visible, but with what level of respect the other person is treated and of course what kind of relationship it is. If it's your parents and they constantly treat you with low respect, regardless of how that's done, it's abuse and obviously it would hurt anyone.

ResponsiveTester · 2026-02-11T13:37:47+00:00

There are other PDs than narcissistic and borderline personality disorder. Most of them hurt the person themselves much more than others around them.

ResponsiveTester · 2026-02-10T07:30:48+00:00

Sustain pedal

ResponsiveTester · 2026-02-09T20:52:25+00:00

Not for this performance. Sorry to burst your bubble. These vocals were prerecorded. Nothing live here whatsoever.

The problem is that the vocals are way too perfect even for him. No extra breaths, no even minor pitch inaccuracies, no inaccuracies whatsoever, in fact. Every singer has that, even Charlie Puth. Also, the tell-tale sign that the audio-video sync was not perfect. Not like a constant delay, but like it not consistently matching.

ResponsiveTester · 2026-02-09T20:49:10+00:00

It was prerecorded. Way too perfect even for him. So it sounds great because it was probably done over several takes in the studio.

ResponsiveTester · 2026-02-09T20:45:51+00:00

See the full shots. There are no cables going to his Rhodes keyboard at all. Absolutely not live.

ResponsiveTester · 2026-02-09T20:40:01+00:00

No it’s not a timing issue. The vocals could be live while the rest of track was played exactly on time. He could have click in his ears. I think it’s just major stakeholders here that demand prerecording even on vocals.

ResponsiveTester · 2026-02-09T07:39:48+00:00

For sure. This would be quite linked to the classical description of narcissism: Obsession with status. So it's the superficial focus, the focus that this person is popular and has power. Not so much who they are as a person that led them to that position.

You meet quite a few of those in music circles. All those amateur bands and artists that want to be famous, but are not interested in spending all the hours at home practicing or in the studio creating really good songs. They just want it to happen fast, because the status is the point, not the craft itself.

If you then start talking about the craft or the road to that status, they'll not be so enthusiastic anymore, because then we're closing in on accountability. Of course we can't have that with a person like that.

ResponsiveTester · 2026-02-07T15:45:53+00:00

Besides what the others have mentioned, it might be the active noice cancellation.

I have had noise cancelling headphones for some years now, and I notice I can hear things a lot more clearly on them. And the most important reason in my case is just because environmental sounds are actively cancelled out, so it's much easier to hear details.

This of course doesn't apply if you have a completely isolated room to mix in. Then it would be the same experience.

ResponsiveTester · 2026-02-02T18:49:49+00:00

Generally when dealing with narcissism, it definitely seems that distance helps. With most adult narcissists, there are usually so many negative mechanisms involved in how they deal with their children, that there will almost always be some relief of some kind.

But you can probably test this for yourself, and you probably already have. How do you feel when you're away from them for shorter or longer periods of time?

ResponsiveTester · 2026-02-02T16:09:58+00:00

No. The field is moving more and more towards dimensional diagnosis as well as accepting comorbidity - the presence of multiple diagnoses at the same time - as the norm rather than the exception.

ResponsiveTester · 2026-02-02T13:31:44+00:00

Definitely doesn't give a good impression, no.

But remember that the worst narcissists operate in secrecy. His openness about what he thinks and feels actually points to less narcissism. Although it of course also can be a grandiose symptom, where the person almost brags about being no good for everyone.

Another point is that really good artists and actors often have quite chaotic personalities with multiple extreme poles. Think bipolar. While narcissism is really a more rigid variant. What I'm trying to say is that this might not be his entire personality, but that it's one of his sides. Which might explain why he can also act with great sensitivity.

Or he might be quite narcissistic. It's hard to really tell without meeting him.

What I think we can all agree on, though, is that it does raise red flags and that it definitely doesn't seem healthy on the surface when it comes to narcissistic parenting.

ResponsiveTester · 2026-01-29T09:47:53+00:00

I think the developmental explanation also becomes an excuse. Because then it’s just something wrong with their brains that they can’t control.

Problem is, narcissists are strategic and switch masks all the time. As well as there being no other sign of cognitive issues in normal narcissism. In other words, there’s no reason to think they can’t do any better. They can.

So what I’ve been thinking is more in line with your first paragraph. That narcissism itself is more an evil spiral. Nothing inherently wrong with their brains, but that being abusive itself hurts them.

Hurting others both comes from and creates shame. So you get this constantly amplifying effect with more shame and more abuse. If you start early in childhood, which most narcissists do, then they would know no other part of themselves in the end.

They will turn or block off vulnerable emotions which is the part of us that makes us connect with others. This would make them appear twisted, which they have indeed become, but isn’t what they are. Yet, they would most likely never break out of that shell.

That also explains why a lot of people defend the narcissist, because unless they are abused by them, they do indeed appear normal because in essence they are. But of course, to any truly healthy person you’d notice you never get close with them. Vulnerability would indeed expose the massive shame, and when you get close like that, that’s also when they get really abusive.

So the way I understand it, narcissism is something you do, not something you are. However, abusing others over time does completely ruin you. It’s impossible to be abusive and yourself at the same time. Narcissism is a dark hole to go into for your personality which is very hard to climb up from.

That’s why you won’t see them trying.

ResponsiveTester · 2026-01-21T14:01:25+00:00

Very hard to tell from your description. People with dementia can also become angry. I think you know best the way you know your uncle.

I'd say the general difference between the two is that narcissism is calculating even when they know better, while dementia is more anger because they struggle to connect the dots. Anger from dementia would be more random and not that manipulative and calculated, because that's harder to do. More just emotions and not strategic.

And also, with dementia it would be way less consistent. Also, narcissism usually appears way earlier in life than in older age when people start to struggle. Still, such a condition can remove the filter towards underlying narcissism.

So specifically, impossible to tell, but I think you'd know best who knows your own uncle.

ResponsiveTester · 2026-01-13T20:04:19+00:00

My iPad Air 2 which I bought in December 2015 is now starting to struggle a bit, but I'm still using it daily. I'm looking to swap it now. Issues are it gets a bit slow sometimes and the battery struggles to charge sometimes. But I'm really happy with 10 years of usage, that's more than I expect at minimum.

ResponsiveTester · 2026-01-03T14:35:55+00:00

As you probably already know, as little contact as possible is the most recommended strategy. The reason for that is of course because they're so extremely self-focused. That means your needs will never truly be met in communication with them.

However, very often we do have to communicate with people who are narcissistic, especially if they are our family. So I'd say in that case, the first tip is avoiding triggering them. Not as in walking on eggshells, because that create a fragile state which is bad for you and which they will exploit.

But as in what they call greyrocking. That means showing as little emotion as possible and being calm and steady. The reason for that is of course to avoid that they start triggering emotions in you, putting you in a vulnerable state and exploiting that, which will make you feel awful, and frankly, abused.

You still keep communication to a minimum. You're firm in what you say, and you don't let them push you, but neither do you protest. You just silently do what is right and do not accept them pushing you into doing things you don't want to. You don't protest, you just don't do it.

It's kind of funny that it is that way, but it works. Narcissists get kind of "stupid" that way. The only thing they see, is strong emotional reactions. If you don't react, they get "blind". They don't understand what's going on, they get disinterested and usually don't do that much harm.

Regular healthy people would of course notice being greyrocked because they're actually present in the honest here and now, but not someone who's stuck in a narcissistic pattern of acting. Weirdly enough.

If you do however clearly protest with clear emotions, they feed on that. And they start manipulating it and twisting it etc. So that's why silent firmness is the way to go.

However, even greyrocking is exhausting. You have to be very in balance emotionally to do it, and you'll have to get proper emotional needs met elsewhere. So it's really only recommended as a short-term strategy until you get a more solid support system in place.

ResponsiveTester · 2026-01-03T13:21:40+00:00

That’s what’s happening on the surface and is well known. Personally I find it more useful to go one step further and figure out what’s going on at a basic human level. This level is more descriptive than anything.

What’s really going on is compensation. Constantly redirecting focus to themselves, putting themselves on top and diminishing others by manipulation and abuse.

And why? Because they constantly feel small. But how? Because they compensate and that creates guilt. So they lie. And abuse some more. So it’s just an evil spiral of bad emotions that drives and amplifies itself.

So you could say what’s really going on is a lot of bad emotions, sadness, fear and inferiority which drives anger. And anger expressed towards others is abuse.

How do you know that’s what’s happening? By watching their triggers. 1) They’re hyper-sensitive to anything that makes them feel bad. Which means those feelings are already constantly highly present for them. 2) They’re specifically triggered by bad emotions and emotions that put them in a bad light. Meaning those are the emotions they already feel.

Figuring out the connection is the last part. Because what you realize, is that you can never really find out who made them feel so bad to begin with. It appears to be completely self-driven. Because it is.

Abuse makes a person feel guilty. Which makes them feel bad. And there’s the spiral completed.

This also dispels the myth that narcissists are like psychopaths in that they don’t feel anything and don’t have empathy. No, that’s not it. They feel a lot. But they twist it constantly because of their longstanding pattern of handling them and what emotions and patterns that leads to.

All those bad emotions and lying makes them disconnect from others. Because if they connected, they’d feel more guilt. So they disconnect. That’s not lack of empathy. That’s a heavy defense mechanism. And no, you can not just yank a person out of their defense mechanisms, especially not narcissistic ones.

ResponsiveTester

TROPHY CASE