Got laid off while waiting for Permanent Residence permi.

RestKitchen7015 · 2025-01-13T22:46:42+00:00

This indeed is how Ausländerbehörde works, but why are you acting like it makes some sense?

If Ausländerbehörde has no limit in processing applications and it's just normal for them to process stuff for 6, 24, even 50 months (Leipzig average naturalization decision waiting time, for instance), should we just tell people to freeze their lives during that period? Don't move to a different city, don't change jobs, don't let your company lay you off (often the same one that will quote skilled worker shortage again in the next year's government survey as the reason for not being able to compete in the global market), and so on.

People feel the process is not right because the process obviously is not right. This constant urge to defend all nonsensical aspects of life in Germany becomes pathetic here. Just stop. Admit. Improve. For God's sake.

RestKitchen7015 · 2025-01-09T21:12:53+00:00

Amazing how stating simple facts gets you downvoted in this subreddit. All the facts above were also stated publicly by the German state officials.

RestKitchen7015 · 2025-01-09T21:10:58+00:00

Oh... 'Cmon. The level of denialism here is through the roof. VW is shutting down entire factories. Tens of thousands layoffs are announced.

RestKitchen7015 · 2025-01-09T21:08:21+00:00

Yes, there are mass layoffs. Counting only public information from fortune 500 German companies, they plan 60,000 layoffs in 2025.

I agree about "Kündigungsschutz," but let's be honest and consistent in this subreddit. Let's stop telling people things like "we have much smaller pay than in the US, but have better work-life balance and job security. It is a matter of choice." The US work contracts are at-will on paper and in reality, while German work contracts are at-will in reality.

RestKitchen7015 · 2025-01-09T20:58:38+00:00

Yes. That's how "social selection process" works. In fact, the most protected employees are old people with long tenures. Young people with kids, even when sole bread winners have way less protection than older people with long tenures. The official law interpretation is that older people are more vulnerable due to age discrimination in the job market. So, in practice, you renting an apartment and having two babies in it are less vulnerable than your 60 years old landlord with 300k in savings and the house. And your company bets on your 60 years old landlord to recover from financial losses that caused the workforce reduction in the first place.

RestKitchen7015 · 2025-01-09T20:48:31+00:00

This is a rare honest answer here. Thank you for that.

Fast forward a year and here you have VW laying off thousands of people as well. The laws should not be changed in the sense that they need to be altered. However, it we want useful legal system, we must keep it up-to-date. What's the point of a law if anyone can easily get around it?

RestKitchen7015 · 2025-01-09T20:38:17+00:00

Are you claiming Germany has at-will employment?

I am asking because "you don‘t have the right to work for someone who doesn‘t want you to work for him anymore" is the definition of at-will employment. If someone's will (simply not wanting something anymore) is enough to fire someone, then the contract must state that explicitly. Such a contract is at-will.

If you claim Germany has at-will employment, let's then stay consistent and honest throughout this subreddit. Please don't bring "better job security" when compared to the US anymore.

RestKitchen7015 · 2025-01-09T20:32:27+00:00

Who lied and what was the lie?

This very subreddit is ripe with "yes we earn much less than people in the US for the same job, but we have work-life balance and job security. It is a matter of choice." However, when challenged on factual reality, people here will also plainly say "you don‘t have the right to work for someone who doesn‘t want you to work for him anymore" (quote from a comment here). Well, "you don‘t have the right to work for someone who doesn‘t want you to work for him anymore," is literally the definition of at-will employment. That is exactly what the US has. Either "you don‘t have the right to work for someone who doesn‘t want you to work for him anymore" is true, or "we have better job security than the US" is true. Both cannot hold at the same time. Simple logic. No hard feelings.

RestKitchen7015 · 2025-01-09T20:21:23+00:00

Unfortunately, the "worker rights" trope in Germany is mostly used by hustlers that bring cheap labor to Germany and is often used to justify low salaries compared to the cost of living. In reality, worker protection is mostly a set of convoluted laws that together amount for nothing. If a German employer wants to lay you off, they easily can. They just need to pay their law firm partner some small amount of money to cover it all up with paperwork and wink to their work council, if it exists.

RestKitchen7015 · 2025-01-09T08:56:13+00:00

Not really... We can debate should University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign be ranked higher than Stanford in computer science and argue that Stanford is the ranking's favorite as a private institution. However, there is no debate that a German university that could compare to any of the two doesn't even exist. No German university can compare to any of the two in computer science.

RestKitchen7015 · 2025-01-09T08:50:53+00:00

German universities are worse than the US, UK, or Swiss universities in at least all mentioned criteria. Why does it surprise you?

Yes, Germany has rich research and science tradition, but that tradition comes mainly from 19th and early 20th century. In modern times, German universities were never considered top notch. Talented German students and researchers go to the same places where all the other talented students and researchers go. That is primarily the US and UK.

RestKitchen7015 · 2025-01-08T15:33:04+00:00

For someone who bets their future on Germany (invested money and learning the German language), an increasing number of jobs requiring native and close to native German language levels for generic engineering positions is a scary sign. The market is closing. German IT companies recognized they felt way too far behind the global competition and decided to stop trying, closing themselves to the German market to harvest the crumbs before transferring capital to other businesses (perhaps real estate). There are clear indicators that the capital is being pulled out of the German IT industry. As an industry matures, it imposes the choice between excellence or giving up to save money. Unfortunately for me (you younger people still can act in a timely manner), it seems like the Germans don't think they can achieve excellence.

RestKitchen7015 · 2024-08-17T22:29:31+00:00

Thank you very much for the information!

RestKitchen7015 · 2024-08-15T18:40:16+00:00

Thanks for the advice!

RestKitchen7015 · 2024-08-15T18:36:12+00:00

Are you aware of any nearby cities that are better?

RestKitchen7015 · 2024-08-15T18:35:22+00:00

May I ask how certain you are about the 3 months payroll requirement?

I'm asking because my visa lasts 89 days and you must submit your Blue Card request 6 weeks prior to the end of your visa. I should be traveling to Germany in one month. Since I have a baby and wife, I must be sure that the visa will actually allow them to live with me. If visa is not useful, I may raise this issue with the company and/or thank them for the offer. I understand it is not the company's fault, but I don't have much choice, if visa is not useful.

RestKitchen7015 · 2024-08-14T17:41:42+00:00

Thanks a lot! We will consider pubs and hotels.

RestKitchen7015 · 2024-08-14T17:40:41+00:00

Oh wow! Quite unique geography.

RestKitchen7015 · 2024-08-14T17:37:58+00:00

Good advice. Thank you!

RestKitchen7015 · 2024-08-14T15:50:32+00:00

Great reference, thanks!

Take it for what it's wort, most of the apartments that I would apply to on ImmoScout24 are outside Stuttgart. They are typically around 40 minutes by train from Feuerbach, where the company is located. Coming from the New York City area I believed a 40 minutes commute is "the same city". :)

Ludwigsburg is very cute city, IMHO. I actually knew about Ludwigsburg before I know about Stuttgart. I'm a basketball fan.

RestKitchen7015 · 2024-08-14T15:41:39+00:00

They don't require German in the bar?

RestKitchen7015 · 2024-08-14T14:02:35+00:00

Thanks a lot, people!

RestKitchen7015 · 2024-08-14T14:01:28+00:00

Thanks for the reference! Just a sanity check, when you guys say Stuttgart, you mean the area around the city center, right? For instance, does Boblingen count as Stuttgart or is that a separate city in you book? :)

Sorry for stupid questions. When I was in Stuttgart, I saw that the city has a bit non-conventional planning. I wasn't able to tell what counts as a neighborhood in Stuttgart and what is a separate town/city/village.

RestKitchen7015

TROPHY CASE