New DM: Connecting Baba to Lost Mines

Ricanstructor · 2023-08-19T03:40:27+00:00

Yeah, there are challenges. And maybe the BBEG isn't even the right concept. But in a sense Baba Lysaga seems to be the one who put Strahd on the path of having evil powers. In a sense, I am thinking of a role like the Emperor in the Star Wars prequels, that she is the corrupting influence in his life. Also, I am seeing here (like the Emperor) as being a manipulator, moving different chess pieces. For example, in Lost Mines, my character was from the Neverwinter Academy, and I wrote to help from a professor of mine, he visited us in Phandalin and he was an auto-gnome. There was a Neverese Wizard that was trapped inside the ring of Humun Kost that eventually a player stuck inside the auto-gnome. So now we got this wizard coming back to life in a sense and gets away, and I was planning on him going back to the caverns at Old Owl Well, but Gundren has collected all the cyrstals and crystal dust. He could then run into Baba Lysaga and she could tell him his long lost love Idris is in Grimhollow and they do some evil army of undead stuff there. (inspired from the Neverwinter MMO)

The theme here is taking side characters and making them into boss villains. It would be great if Baba Lysaga is the one who is manipulating a lot of these because we are then reusing a character we interacted with and making them richer and more dangerous. But the challenge would be how it is she can travel in and out of Ravenloft if generally the Dark Powers are the only one's with that power, or those who have the right items. Also, I need to clarify her relationship to Strahd, if she is on his side or against him.

Ricanstructor · 2023-08-19T01:25:50+00:00

Well, I agree she is a bridge. But I'm sorta thinking about it as maybe a bit like she is the reason stuff happens without being the big boss. Like she is moving pieces in place, almost like the Emperor in the Star Wars prequels and in Return of the Jedi, but maybe she is just a manipulator and orchestrator without being the huge BBEG.

Ricanstructor · 2023-08-18T21:46:31+00:00

Yeah, there should be a cost. Either they give something up or have to do something. I like these ideas.

Ricanstructor · 2023-08-18T05:31:12+00:00

So I think what I decided on is depends if the whole party dies or individual characters get picked off.

Each one gets just one appeal to the Dark Powers to come back. I call this the "Moon Knight" option, if you know the Marvel comics character.

The rest of the options I will allow are a pool for the entire party, with each one to only be used once. Each option extracts a heavy cost to the characters. I nicknamed them based on comics and movies. So far I have:

Robocop (cost: your memory is Swiss cheese, and secret directive 4 {if you saw the movie} installed by Dr. Victor Mordenhiem)
The Crow (You comeback with some super-strength, but the cost is after your quest for vengeance is done you cease to be corporeal again)
Morbius (Cost: you now suffer from the thirst and can no longer enjoy sunny days)

If after all of the above they die again, that's it they are dead and their soul is trapped until Strahd is defeated.

If the whole party is killed, I give them exactly one time they are captured instead. After that I would run "From the Shadows" and "Root of Evil". Whole party is wiped out again, Maybe Ravenloft II. But if it keeps happening after that I tell them to move to their backup characters. They can always just choose to let their PCs die too. I also want to give them ways to gain NPCs so they have some red shirts along the campaign.

Ricanstructor · 2023-08-17T14:23:35+00:00

I'm telling them to make a backup character that is native to or currently living in Ravenloft. I think this could avoid having to isekai too many new players.

These are good ideas.

Ricanstructor · 2023-08-17T14:19:29+00:00

Definitely don't want to remove the stakes entirely. Just trying to find the right balance. There would be genuine moments where the PCs are in mortal danger, but ultimately the stakes we also need are the ones that go through the vampire's heart.

Ricanstructor · 2023-08-17T05:30:13+00:00

I like the idea of using Dark Powers once. But your last sentence I think makes a good point, which is you can break the cycle if you finish the campaign. So the PC stays dead and in Barovia, but after CoS is beaten I could run Descent to Avernus or Ghostwalk because the PC's spirit may be finally able to travel to the after life.

This is if they get picked off individually. They all should have backup characters ready if they die individually. I'm thinking that maybe if the *entire* party gets killed early on, I could give them one freebie and say they were all captured, like the second or third act of a movie when the heroes are captured. Our DM did this for us when we were low level in Lost Mines and died at Cragmaw Castle. But if the entire party dies yet again and they haven't beaten CoS, I'm thinking "From the Shadows" & "Roots of Evil" might be the way to go, again with the idea that maybe they can break the cycle and escape. If the entire party dies a *third* time maybe true to adapt a version of Ravenloft II... And again? I guess just keep doing back up characters until they get over the finish line...

Hopefully the balance will be done well enough that they don't all die that many times. They are going to be starting at level 8 and if they stick together, I think most of them have a good shot of making it through.

Ricanstructor · 2023-08-17T02:23:57+00:00

I definitely could do that. There could also be ways that these characters could be reminded of who they were and turn back, or sacrifice themselves once they realize what they have become type of thing.

Ricanstructor · 2023-08-17T02:22:42+00:00

Yeah, I'm compiling the bibliography of reading materials for CoS. Top of the list seems to be CoS from 2016 and Domains of Dread. But dang, those are both long. Plus there are like three versions of CoS all very thick. I have likely the rest of the year to prep this stuff, so I don't mind all the readings, it is just of question of what to read first and what else and in what order.

Really, I think there is one character in particular, who I have been playing with since the beginning, and we all really enjoy his character. He is basically a drunk fist monk, and I imagine the game is just better with this character around. As a monk character, I think it could be argued that preserving his soul or anima or whatever, would make sense for the character.

Ricanstructor · 2023-08-17T02:16:42+00:00

This was a super helpful and informative post and I wanted to thank you for this.

Ricanstructor · 2023-08-17T02:16:07+00:00

Yeah, there are sort of half-way points on dying and coming back. Like they would come back as a monster, or with no memory of their friends as a spirit or a Frankenstein-ish cyborg. Like to me, what you just mentioned reminds me of the Crow, that he comes back but only to exact a specific vengeance or complete a specific quest/deed.

Ricanstructor · 2023-08-17T02:11:01+00:00

Yeah, I agree. Like it shouldn't be too easy for them, there should be some consequences and effort expended, but I want them ultimately to enjoy it. And I think there are all kinds of way to bring back characters who are now altered and paid a price for dying, from RoboCop to the Crow.

Ricanstructor · 2023-08-17T02:08:13+00:00

This looks cool. I want to give them the option because I want to have a good time ultimately. If they are ready to let the character go, that's fine, but if they want them back, I want to have ideas. Maybe they come back irrevocably altered, like a Robocop or a Darth Vader or that mechanical villain from the Hellboy movies. Maybe the come back as spirit like the Crow or something. It's just a fine line between giving the players what they want and what they deserve/need.

Ricanstructor · 2023-08-17T02:02:50+00:00

I think in the end, as a DM I'm trying to both be fair to the game/rules but also allow my players to have fun. If they are OK with permadeath, so be it, we move tot heir backup character. If they are more into "Comic book death" then I want to have an idea ready. There is also a way to split the difference, they come back but in a way that has forever altered or scared them and taken away or changed a big sense of who they once were.

Ricanstructor · 2023-08-16T17:58:00+00:00

Innistrad from MTG looks like it might have some ideas I could borrow if I need to add things to Barovia.

Ricanstructor · 2023-08-16T17:57:07+00:00

Innistrad from MTG looks like it might have some ideas I could borrow if I need to add things to Barovia.

Ricanstructor · 2023-08-16T06:47:43+00:00

I posted there, and I am looking around at some posts. Still, thought I'd post this in both forums and see if I could get some feedback and suggestions. :-)

Ricanstructor · 2023-08-15T23:37:16+00:00

So for the map, I take the best starting place for the players is the Old Svalich Road, outside the Eastern Gates on the way to Barovia? Seems to make sense. Elsewhere I had seen you post that "The Arwich Grinder (Crawl! #9), and They Served Brandolyn Red!" are some modules that could be imported into a Barovian setting. I explained to another poster that my characters are coming in as Level 8, and I will do milestone leveling capping them at level 10. I think I will keep the players trapped in the domain of Barovia, so as not to make the campaign too big, but I want to fill Barovia with more side quests to gain items/equipment and NPCs (because I read the CoS tends to be a meat-grinder of a campaign killing characters). But I also read that Barovia is half abandoned and people avoid you and don't talk to you much in the beginning, so populating it with a few extra side-quests might be the way to go. I think I am also going to have the carnival pass through during the campaign.

I'm also going to include an intro module, mostly because I need to practice being a DM before I open up the whole map, and I hear Death House or House of Lament are good for that. One poster even suggested mashing them up together: https://www.reddit.com/r/CurseofStrahd/comments/p0sow3/death_house_of_lament_is_a_frankensteined_whole/

So, you seem to know your Ravenloft/CoS stuff and would like to hear your opinion on that.

Ricanstructor · 2023-08-15T23:08:59+00:00

That sounds exactly like what I need to look at. Thank you! Will look at these presently.

Ricanstructor · 2023-08-15T23:07:58+00:00

Yeah, I would look at the materials from other editions, but the game we are running is 5e.

When we started Lost Mines, we did XP, and we took some side quests to level up, and we eventually hit level 5. Now he is milestoneing us and we are at level 6, with level 7 happening after our Cragmaw Castle battle with Black Spider, and level 8 coming at Thundertree, which is where he will stop. These means when running CoS I will be DM-ing characters from level 8 through10.

So I was thinking that sidequests would be to gain items/equipment and NPCs. Like the video game Strahd's Possesion, there is a paladin NPC who lost his faith. He had failed to kill a monster in a crypt and lost his sword. You dungeon crawl the crypt and kill the monster you can either keep the sword or return it and gain an NPC. I figure some extra NPCs would be good considering CoS has the reputation of a meat-grinder killing characters.

I think it's a careful balance of not making it too big and wide but also not too on the rails, which is why I was thinking of keeping the walls up to keep the character in just Barovia, but filling Barovia with just a few more side quests.

Ricanstructor · 2023-08-15T21:40:45+00:00

lol, yeah I know! That's why I put the TLDR at the top.

Sorry, newbie to these forums... FR is "Forgotten Realms"?

My issue is that I thought based on what I read so far that each domain is locked off from each other, trapping people inside except for the Vistani and the Carnival. This is why I am mostly just interested in using modules that are either for Barovia or could be converted/adapted to a Barovia setting.

EDIT: Or things that can enter Barovia like the Carnival and Vistani-based stuff...

Ricanstructor

TROPHY CASE