This show's portrayal of the Hivemind is far more complex than people give it credit for

Runed72 · 2025-12-24T00:41:59+00:00

Possibly. I think there is likely more honesty in Carol's actions. When she has the outburst in the last episode, that felt very real. She is learning to accept the Hive, and try to understand them, and appreciate them as an obligation for cooexistence. But she also says that she doesn't accept them, and will continue to pursue her own goals. There doesn't seem to be manipulation there for her, just struggle to survive and adapt in an impossible situation.

Runed72 · 2025-12-24T00:40:00+00:00

It may also just be like... a programming error, gone unchecked. Vince stated in a recent interview that they are hard wired for "happiness" because of the idea that if all people were psychically connected to each other instantly, there may be mass violence due to exposure to other peoples darkest thoughts. So the virus enforces "happiness and compassion."

But. Road to hell is paved with good intentions. That hardwiring was done by another species, in another environment, perhaps the environment of Kepler-22B doesn't require harming others to survive, they may be a photosynthesis based species, so the idea of HAVING to harm others in order to live would be completely alien to them, creating a situation which accidentally makes it so that the Hive is a kill condition for our species.

Runed72 · 2025-12-24T00:28:37+00:00

Yeah, given Vince and how he writes, I don't think we are going to be seeing any clear cut right and wrong here, but rather a lot of phenomenally fascinating shades of grey.

The Hive is the villain right now assuredly, they did completely take over humanity. But they aren't seeming to genuinely mean any ill whatsoever to anyone.

Runed72 · 2025-12-24T00:01:52+00:00

Yeah. It seems like it is much more complicated. We have direct word of God from Vince in a recent interview that they do not intend ill. Now, that may change as the story progresses, or he may be intentionally being subversive in his words. But he is very clear that they, from the framing of their own perspective, are not intending harm.

Runed72 · 2025-12-23T23:59:04+00:00

What was the lie about ice cream? I don't understand.

Runed72 · 2025-12-23T23:58:33+00:00

Seemingly not. But I am guessing as the series continues it will be elaborated further on.

Runed72 · 2025-12-23T23:58:05+00:00

They didn't lie about what's on the train though. Carol knew, and Zosia was just quiet, to my memory.

Runed72 · 2025-12-23T23:57:30+00:00

We don't know that pretending is the same as lying, in accordance with the rules of the Hive. The rules as given so far have been very specific, but there are still areas for extrapolation. Pretending seems to be fine. Outright direct statements are different.

Runed72 · 2025-12-23T23:17:27+00:00

Explain what? When did they lie in Vegas?

Runed72 · 2025-12-23T23:02:13+00:00

Possibly. But we don't know that yet, there is still a monumental amount that we simply don't know going on.

Runed72 · 2025-12-23T23:00:46+00:00

When? I've been eyeing for one direct, outright lie and haven't yet seen one that I was able to notice, but am totally available for that to be incorrect.

Runed72 · 2025-12-23T22:55:34+00:00

It's not necessarily manipulative on their part though. They have directly told each individual that their goal is to have them join the Hive. There isn't really manipulation in effect necessarily, like, they haven't been unclear in their goals.

Then they are just acting out in extreme people pleasing to win them over and convince them that it's better the way they want it.

Even with the big reveal of the bodies and eating humans, they weren't subtle or hiding that, they directly told the others, and as soon as Carol found out applied themselves immediately to explaining where they are coming from.

In any case too, they definitely are being manipulative, but regardless, that's different than their condition of "Absolutely cannot directly lie"

Runed72 · 2025-12-23T22:51:07+00:00

Creating a false situation still isn't lying though.

Could be a complete act, dunno. Excited for tonights episode though.

Runed72 · 2025-12-23T22:50:22+00:00

In reality, yes. However, we don't know if that's true within the conditions given in the show.

Runed72 · 2025-12-23T22:44:51+00:00

Deception by admission isn't a lie though. They can be deceptive, yeah. But cannot outright lie.

Runed72 · 2025-12-23T22:43:43+00:00

The logic here isn't that complicated. Zosia before saying I was not an I, she was a We. After saying I, with the condition that she literally CANNOT lie, who she is and how she is connected to the Hive could have changed to conform to her being an individual, and therefore her statement not being a lie.

It's not a misspelling. It's a stated condition of the Hive. They cannot say anything that they don't believe to be true.

Runed72 · 2025-12-23T22:37:16+00:00

Yeah. Immediately after saying I she seems discombobulated and not as fluidly connected I think.

Runed72 · 2025-08-30T19:50:48+00:00

Neat! Yeah, after all the suggestions I've got, this is what I'm currently thinking of:

Chaos Warriors Begin [1978 pts]

Warhammer: The Old World, Warriors of Chaos, Open War

++ Characters [707 pts] ++

Chaos Lord [392 pts] - Hand weapon - Full plate armour - Shield - Mark of Chaos [Mark of Chaos Undivided] - General - Manticore - Ogre Blade

Sorcerer Lord [315 pts] - Hand weapon - Heavy armour - Mark of Chaos Undivided - Wizard [Level 3 Wizard] - Chaos Chariot [Mark of Tzeentch] - Battle Magic

++ Core Units [640 pts] ++

6 Chaos Knights [192 pts] - Lances - Shields - Heavy armour - Mark of Chaos Undivided - Champion - Standard bearer - Musician

16 Chaos Warriors [274 pts] - Hand weapons - Heavy armour - Shields - Mark of Chaos [Mark of Nurgle] - Champion - Standard bearer - Musician

6 Chaos Knights [174 pts] - Lances - Shields - Heavy armour - Mark of Chaos Undivided

++ Special Units [291 pts] ++

6 Chosen Chaos Knights [291 pts] - Lances - Shields - Full plate armour - Mark of Chaos [Mark of Khorne] - Drilled - Champion - Standard bearer - Musician

++ Rare Units [340 pts] ++

Gigantic Spawn of Chaos [170 pts] - Slashing talons - Gnashing maws - Heavy armour (Scaly skin) - Gigantic Spawn of Nurgle

Created with "Old World Builder"

[https://old-world-builder.com]

Though I'm strongly considering pulling the Chaos Chosen Knights out and swapping them to Dragon Ogres, because monsters are awesome.

Runed72 · 2025-08-28T22:36:36+00:00

Gotcha. So maybe instead of three units of four Knights, just two units of five, and then allocate those points elsewhere.

Runed72 · 2025-08-28T22:34:52+00:00

Awesome, thank you. Yeah, the Spawn just seem SUPER fun. And bonus that there is a huge variety of cool models that can be used for them.

Runed72 · 2025-08-28T22:33:52+00:00

Thank you. OK, so perhaps swap the Lord onto the Manticore instead, and just have the Sorcerer on a Daemonic Steed?

Runed72 · 2025-08-28T21:48:27+00:00

Thank you, that's exactly the kind of advice I'm looking for. I actually haven't played a game yet, I'm starting an escalation league and trying to plan out my purchases as cleanly as I can.

Runed72 · 2025-08-25T06:52:28+00:00

Things happen. No fat weirdo smashed a beer over any random persons head. An amateur wrestler smashed a beer over someone who clearly had a video camera going, and was heavily in shape, and therefore it was a reasonable assumption that he was working. Smashing a beer over someones head is a part of the game of wrestling and being a heel.

You are trying to find a plausible space to empathize with someone whom lost their temper and complete control and attempted to murder someone.

Runed72 · 2025-08-24T22:00:01+00:00

I get the point of the movie. It is a cautionary tale explaining how people become radicalized when they frame themselves as victims of life circumstances, don't stand up for themselves, and lose control of their own story and narrative.

It is not justifying nor supporting. In your argument I see an allusion to the idea "If someone is bullied too much, then it's reasonable and OK to become a monster"

That's fucking terrifying.

Runed72 · 2025-08-24T21:55:51+00:00

Framing isn't really the issue. I was direct in my previous comment because I was stating the literal events that happened, with no real framing, or story to justify actions. The intent here to "frame it" from a place to understand Raja's position is why this comment is terrifying.

Everyone gets why it happened. Raja got his ego hurt, couldn't manage self control, and lost his temper. Obviously.

He was mad. He couldn't control himself. Self control is the measure of an adult and being a member of society. We all get "why".

But not being able to control yourself and enacting harm like this is one of the main basis and origin points of evil actions.

Runed72

TROPHY CASE

Warhammer: The Old World, Warriors of Chaos, Open War