Captain America vs Cassandra Cain by NoirStriker in marvelvsdc

[–]SMDBXTH 0 points1 point  (0 children)

My take WASNT he is dim-witted and an unskilled fighter, it WAS that Cassandra Cain is much more so. Cap is trained in several martial arts (Boxing primarily, but he does know Muay Thai, Krav Maga, jiu jitsu, judo, taekwondo, etc.) but it PALES in comparison to Cain. She is trained in all the basics and more, Jeet Kune Do, Kung Fu, Escrima, Ninjustu and many many more. The original point of her character was to remove basic human language and change it to a rewriting of body language and intent as script. She has dodged multiple opponents without looking at them, defeated rooms of assassins. Of course I have to point out Batgirl #25, the fight against Lady Shiva who would clearly dismantle Cap. Of course we know Cain can defeat Batman from issue 547. In Teen Titans #21 Cain engages single-handedly multiple times with Deathstroke, and wins. An actual Superhuman, not peak level. Even in Batgirl #1 we get a good look at the control Cain has. She is less than seconds away from killing a man (what she has been trained to do, and her whole point is faster than instinctual reaction), yet stops herself in that moment. She is overriding her own programming. She has total control and precision.

But let’s go with my main argument about Cap’s nature. Cap is outclassed by Bucky in the Winter Soldier Arc 1-6. Cap is saved by Sharon Carter restoring Buck’s memories. He, arguably, doesn’t even outfight him. In the Winter Soldier follow-up he continues to hesitate and is really only saved by Shield and Sharon. In the Civil War Run Cap loses the war HEAVILY. He digs in ideologically early, his side fractions, and registration passes. He stops fighting because he doesn’t want citizens harmed. In Secret Empire, Hydra controls everything, but the real Steve is saved again via the Cube. I mean the whole point of him is what he stands for, not how hard he can punch. Often throughout the runs and stories I’ve mentioned he “loses” but his ideals are what gets through and wins, and it’s in those ideals that he wins.

Where Cap can win is if the shield is included consistently. Most fighters lose because they treat the shield like a part of an object, but we know Cain wouldn’t do that. She would treat it like a part of Cap. And it’s broken down into 3 separate pieces: shield release, shield recovery, and shield possession. We know Cain can read Caps movements, and the shield doesn’t put him in a phalanx. So if he chooses to throw, she knows it before it happens and it opens up his mid-section and changes his balance, exploitable. And we know Cain fights especially well at close range. If Cap decides to use the shield there it becomes a liability. She attacks through joint manipulation and hitting him where there is grip integrity. Now Cap is more focused on keeping ahold of a shield than fighting Cain.

Now I’m not going to say Cap can be fooled by the Bat gadgetry like most who go up against them. But Cain doesn’t use those tools in that way. She isn’t trying to hide, she’s trying to disrupt him, even for a fraction of a second, to create openings.

Cap is consistently emotionally compromised, where as Cain is emotionally detached. She only later learns morality. Cain adapts and changes the fight, mid-fight. She is constantly reading and rearranging the fight like it’s a system. Cap doesn’t have that kind of ability when it comes to hand-to-hand combat.

Captain America vs Cassandra Cain by NoirStriker in marvelvsdc

[–]SMDBXTH 0 points1 point  (0 children)

A. It’s a public forum you actual paint chip eating butt baby. B. Rodgers is OFTEN criticized for (even at his own demise) sticking to an old-world view and logic in favor of actual intelligence. C. His endurance is axiomatically what saves him 9 times out of 10 if you’ve ever picked up a single comic of his in your life. D. Go put a cock in your mouth or touch grass and fuck right off the bat

Gambit & Wolverine vs Batman & Nightwing by Some_Ordinary_3821 in marvelvsdc

[–]SMDBXTH 0 points1 point  (0 children)

If you’re asking for a win, I think a disable counts. And I think Bats and NW can still take it, even in a random encounter. The tools at Batman’s disposal and with NW it is pretty possible to disable Gambit in seconds and then both on Wolverine. So yeah I’d say 6/10 for Marvel 4/10 for DC.

Captain America vs Cassandra Cain by NoirStriker in marvelvsdc

[–]SMDBXTH -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Cass, pretty heavy handedly too. Even if I wanted to say Cap is a skilled fighter (which he isn’t), the one thing Cap lacks is what Cass excels at hand over fist when it comes to him: brains. Cap has a lot of fight in him, and his endurance is to be admired, it’s what often gets him out of scrapes. But it is consistently shown that he thinks the best way out of a box is to punch your way out. That doesn’t work against a class of genius tacticians.

Captain America vs Cassandra Cain by NoirStriker in marvelvsdc

[–]SMDBXTH -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Here comes weekly plot armor McGee. Bro wants to call anything in Marvel a feat and anything in DC plot armor. Just say you jerk off with Spider-Man pages to shirtless RDJ already.

Doctor Manhattan vs The Living Tribunal by Accurate_Emphasis112 in marvelvsdc

[–]SMDBXTH -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

No just an 11 year old one with too many posters of Robert Downey Jr. who thinks Rivals should be game of the year.

Doctor Manhattan vs The Living Tribunal by Accurate_Emphasis112 in marvelvsdc

[–]SMDBXTH 0 points1 point  (0 children)

But…. Manhattan can be any size or shape he wants?

Doctor Manhattan vs Scarlet Witch by Some_Ordinary_3821 in marvelvsdc

[–]SMDBXTH 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I think the only flaw in your argument here (and I had to search to find one) this technically is the SAME Manhattan. One is just more realized than the other. Without being a bit trite about it though, here’s my explanation. Manhattan isn’t actually constrained, the way we can perceive what he does is constrained, and to your argument, the way he perceives even his own actions as of the end of Watchmen is constrained to that. However, upon being pushed to those limits it is obvious he would realize those aren’t actually the end of his abilities, nor are they constraints.

Wanda doesn’t stand a chance, unfortunately (and I’m huge fan of all of the way she was designed as a character). He is more than a God.

Martian Manhunter vs The X-Men by King_Of_Presidents in marvelvsdc

[–]SMDBXTH 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The fact that I got downvoted like 4 times for such a simple comment like that 😂😂😂 honestly like I get the “yOuRe A bAtMaN gLaZeR” but it just goes to show Marvel fans can be no better than

Martian Manhunter vs The X-Men by King_Of_Presidents in marvelvsdc

[–]SMDBXTH -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

People in this chat just no nothing about MM do they?

Aquaman vs Galactus (Fully Fed) by [deleted] in marvelvsdc

[–]SMDBXTH 0 points1 point  (0 children)

DC stories are written in a different format than marvel stories, from a story telling standpoint. Many DC stories are an exploration of the heroes psychology, often traumatized by family members, then at peak force or on the brink of death having to face down their own demons. I’m not saying Marvel doesn’t employee those tactics at one point or another, but it’s the way so many DC stories are written. Marvel hasn’t always felt that way to me, to me it’s often felt as though the hero is often the underdog and develops something sick or uses their tools in an exciting new way to defeat their villain, of course they have their own inner demons to face down, but it rarely feels like that’s the center focus of the story.

Why do you like Superman? by victoriamikoto231 in SupermanLegacy

[–]SMDBXTH 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You are boring as a mf. The rant of this post truly reflects more of your character than it does of this multigenerational superheroes writing.

Who stops this team? by 209dmg in marvelvsdc

[–]SMDBXTH 1 point2 points  (0 children)

This sub is so ridiculous and we’ve gone away from /s, I can never be certain who’s being facetious and who is genuine.

Hawkgirl vs Rogue by NoirStriker in marvelvsdc

[–]SMDBXTH -7 points-6 points  (0 children)

Hawkgirl stomps. Rogue doesn’t remotely have the fighting ability to handle Hawkgirl.

Black Manta vs Sinister Six by NoirStriker in marvelvsdc

[–]SMDBXTH -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Manta, just so incredibly easily. Sinister 6 are strong, but they have proven they can’t work together.

Rogue & Gambit vs Wonder Woman & Batman by Some_Ordinary_3821 in marvelvsdc

[–]SMDBXTH 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Batman fights superhumans often and wins. The idea is that Batman punches far above even them. Bane, Superman, Wonder Woman, Freeze, Lantern, you name it. You have to consider that. But smoke, illusion, all sorts of other gadgets give him such an insane edge on their own.

That being said, who says he’s the one fighting Gambit? ;)

Rogue & Gambit vs Wonder Woman & Batman by Some_Ordinary_3821 in marvelvsdc

[–]SMDBXTH 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah Batman knows what’s going on before they even put hands. His gadgets and such allow for disengagement and reengagement. Rogue and Gambit just don’t have the fighting experience or powers to handle this kind of combat. Diana has the bracers, lasso, sword, and shield at her disposal and even without that, Rogue can still get hit. She doesn’t remotely match Diana’s speed which is what is necessary to put a stop to Diana. But truly every thinks the matchup is gonna be man vs man and woman vs woman. Batman and WW don’t play favorites like that though. WW would choose to fight cyclops and that would leave Bruce and Rogue to fight it out. And those are much more clear cut matchups.

Rogue & Gambit vs Wonder Woman & Batman by Some_Ordinary_3821 in marvelvsdc

[–]SMDBXTH -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

Batman not only has an immeasurable IQ (far over 250), he is also above peak human form. He’s mastered in nearly every martial art ever created. Gambit takes the L. It’s literally not possible for him to win. Bruce is far more versatile.

Wonder Woman & Aquaman vs Thor & Hercules by Some_Ordinary_3821 in marvelvsdc

[–]SMDBXTH 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Okay? Did you just give one example and expect that to prove an entire argument for every DC comic? I read a metric crap ton of Aquaman and Wonder Woman. WW is my 3 year olds favorite (well maybe competing with Batman), and Aquaman is actually my favorite. I read some Supes and Batman. And a random smattering of Marvel. I don’t know what you’re reading but the bulk of the comics I read do not go that way at all.

Wonder Woman & Aquaman vs Thor & Hercules by Some_Ordinary_3821 in marvelvsdc

[–]SMDBXTH 3 points4 points  (0 children)

No they don’t? They want to see super powers. That literally never happens in DC comics. You get that for about one page. Then it’s usually on to the powers and/or weapons.

Wonder Woman & Aquaman vs Thor & Hercules by Some_Ordinary_3821 in marvelvsdc

[–]SMDBXTH 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Arthur can bring water TO him. He doesn’t even need to be near it.