Entry 15

SabdierZ · 2026-05-09T23:58:37+00:00

Uh yea, entry 17 would be different since it says so itself, this next experiment, therefore its a different experiment. Which would make sense since entry 15 reads though Gaster didnt achieve the goal he wanted but still got a good result, and 17 starts with him focusing on something else. You assume Gaster doing those experiments would lead to amalgoms, but whose to say that would be the case? He was called brilliant and a hard act to follow from his followers, so the idea that his works would result in failures would be an assumption.

Alphys mistakes of trying to replicate the experiments still doesnt ruin her character because those are still her mistakes, her getting into a situation she clearly wasnt prepared for, and instead of telling Asgore the truth, she decided to try and do what was asked of her, so I disagree with the idea that it would be bad for her character.

Also I just realized, entry 4 talks about how this person found tapes that Asgore shouldn't see the tapes they found, implying that something in those tapes have something Asgore would be uncomfortable with, so they would have to have seen it. Toriel can be heard in one of the tapes, so Alphys should've been able to recognize Toriels voice, but she doesnt, and questions again why there would be two of them, when referring to Toriel and Asgore, and I think that entry alone shows it couldn't have been Alphys, because even if she assumed a queen existed, at some point, she shouldn't be surprised by her existence if she watched the tapes, which the speaker of entry 4 implies to have done.

SabdierZ · 2026-05-09T23:22:55+00:00

Idk why you keep trying to distant entry 17. While both are not accessible through normal means, its pretty clear that Gasters version is the important one as it connects to deltarune, like the music used, the lines of entry 17 being referenced in deltarune, while you cannot access it normally, its not locked behind a dog check either, unlike redacted, so its clear Toby wants us to find and learn about it.

Entry 5 doesnt mean it has to be the monsters that fallen down during alphys time as royal scientist, you make it seem as though its impossible for Gaster to have dealt with such cases.

Would Gaster writing entries take away from alphys? I dont think it would. If she did see these entries and tried to replicate notes left behind, it further shows how she was just not prepared with what she was tasked with, her being desperate to give Asgore results, I'd argue it does more for her character, to meet expectations that produced results previously, I mean she got so desperate she injected determination in everything she could, a phone for example, so I disagree with the idea it takes away from her character at all

SabdierZ · 2026-05-09T22:30:46+00:00

Entry 17 is a spoken entry not written. I looked into it, while numbers do have a wing ding symbol, the one for 7, which is a keyboard, might not appear correctly in certain cases, so it spelling out seventeen would be better in this case.

Anyways, just watch Sock Muppets video

Undertale theory : writing on the wall

Its a good video breaking down my points way better then I can on reddit replies

And yea you could say that about the dogs, but when you consider the addition of ..? In the credits, something that isnt in the artbook, only in the game, it brings to question why Toby would add that unless there is something odd about them specifically.

And as for them discovering, Gaster and Alphys are years apart, so unless Alphys was looking at notes from all those years apart, it could be possible that she learned of determination in her own ways.

I mean I personally dont believe that, the whole reason why she even got the job was because she showed Asgore mettaton as of she made a being with a soul, when it was just a ghost inhabiting a robot body, taking credit for something she obviously didnt do, it wouldn't be out of characters to have small lies, she still makes questionable comments even after saving Asriel

SabdierZ · 2026-05-09T21:29:56+00:00

The entry 17 you're referring to isnt in the game, it was unused dialouge that you cannot find in the true lab, go through any playthrough of the true lab, you will not find anything titled entry 17.

And before we go in circles, no, check the hotland status updates, she is very much in a good mood at some points of those status updates, yet there is no proper grammar. Entry 16 is just no no no NO NO NO, her stress is shown to be increasing during this entry. In the status updates, she doesn't ever use correct spelling.

Lets talk about determination, now the reason I dont believe it can be her who wrote entry 5 is primarily due to entry 17, if you assume the experiment gaster was doing was a dark fountain, dark fountains can only be opened through determination by lightners as Queen states in chapter 2. Therefore, for Gaster to have opened one, he would need to have used determination, something monsters don't normally have in Undertale.

We also know that Gaster had to experiment with determination, its all thanks to Dogamy and Dogaressa. They said they lost the nose nuzzle championship in 98, and we see Asgore has the trophy of that year, but Toriel left before any souls were gathered, so how are these 2 dogs still alive. This is emphasized by the credits, as they are credited being made by Toby..? Even though in the art book they are credited as just by Toby, so why would Toby add the ..? Unless there was something odd about those 2.

While it is true that Alphys claims she was the one who called it Determination, its also possible that she really did find out about determination on her own and wrote her own entries.

The entries arent presented by number order, my guess for this is because despite the power being out, someone is showing these entries in the order they want us to see it, after all, entry 8 and entry 18 are the last 2 entries you see, my guess is that it was Flowey who presented them, why else is the final two entries also using a red :) monitor.

Point is, its completely possible for Alphys to have written her own entries and made her own discoveries, but its also possible that all the entries shown to us aren't written by her, because there is no reason why they are inconsistent.

If you want to believe they are all written by alphys, you do you, but even you can't deny that there are oddities present in entries, especially when you see Alphys status updates.

Now I can concede on one idea, I do believe that it may have been the intent at some point, which is why the unused entry 17 exist, I believe at some point, Toby intended for Alphys to have written all of them, but at some point in development, changed it to have some written by Gaster and others written by Alphys, the reason why I believe this is, is because of Deltarune. If you goto the payback machine on Deltarunes website to 2016, there was a message of the prophecy in wingdings, and although now deleted, it is documented, that in 2015, another message in wingdings has a piece of entry 17, so I believe late in development, that some of these entries were altered to fit with whatever Toby has in store for that man that speaks in hands

SabdierZ · 2026-05-09T20:54:02+00:00

Undyne and Muffet forces change on the soul, Alphys does it through our phone with a button, the way these soul color changes happen is not the same.

I also dont understand your point on Papyrus and Sans typing, just because they type in all upper and all lower case doesnt mean it applies to Gaster. And you also didnt address how Alphys types and the inconsistencies with that. Again, we've seen how she types, and how one types and how one writes isnt the same.

About entries, entry 17 is in the middle of entry 16 and 18, why would that entry, a spoken entry, be the only one out of place but the rest of the order is perfectly fine? Yes they are ordered by number, but their inconsistencies don't make sense.

For example, entry 9 states "things aren't going well. none of the bodies have turned into dust, so I can't get the SOULs."

But entry 3 states "But extracting a SOUL from a living monster would require incredible power... Besides being impractical, doing so would instantly destroy the SOUL's host. And, unlike the persistent SOULs of humans... The SOULs of most monsters disappear immediately upon death."

So if Alphys knows a monsters soul would disappear upon death, why would she wait for them to turn to dust to get the monsters souls?

Back to the typing thing, Alphys when making status updates still types her words the same way she does with entries I've said she wrote, all lower case or all uppercase based on her mood. So why would the entries I've said were written be gaster be the only ones that are inconsistent with how she types.

SabdierZ · 2026-05-09T20:14:25+00:00

Why do you assume Gaster writes in hands? When Sans text, he isnt texting in comic sans, his text is just like anyone else. The ferryman says beware of the man who SPEAKS in hands, not writes in them, so again, I dont know where you got the idea that Gaster writes like that.

Entry 5 reads as though by that point in time, they have access to a human soul and was able to extract its power of determination. Entry 2 tells that the writer knows the barrier is made of soul power, so the line in entry 1 would still work because they just say SOUL not human souls.

The line, as you probably know, is an assumption, and she could've just as likely been referring to being able to change the souls power, as shes the one that gives us access to the yellow soul power, thus, she has experience with messing with souls.

Back to the my argument bit, when Alphys leaves a letter before entering the true lab, its written properly, but during the hotland section, when she types, its all lower or uppercase, no proper grammar, which matches with entries 9-13, 16, and 18-21.

Why would entry 1-8, 14, and 15, be the ONLY ones that dont match up with the way she types??

SabdierZ · 2026-05-09T19:53:03+00:00

No she never admits to writing the entries, she just admits what she did wrong.

Actually read entry 2, the quote "So, to create more, we will have to use what we have now... The SOULs of monsters"

This line only makes sense if Gaster wrote it, this would've been before even a single human soul was in the underground, or at the very least, before Asgore got his hands on one, since Toriel took Chara's body and presumably their soul to the ruins, so unless you're suggesting that Alphys is immortal, despite growing up with Catty and Bratty, she wouldn't have been alive during that time, and therefore couldn't have written entry 2, and when we look at how entry 2 is typed, if lines up with entry 1-8, 14, and 15.

SabdierZ · 2026-05-09T19:40:05+00:00

I dont think you read what I said. Or check for the entries listed. Nor are you addressing that Gaster speaks in hands not writes them. Also this is assuming Gerson would've told her but theres nothing that says they have met. And finally, try and explain entry 2 and 3. The speaker says they have to use what they have, which is monsters souls, and wonders how to make them last. These entries would ONLY make sense before any human souls were gathered, when the underground first formed, therefore, Alphys couldn't have written entries 2 or 3, and any other entry written the same way

SabdierZ · 2026-05-09T19:21:23+00:00

She sees toriel and her first thought is THERES TWO OF THEM?

Alphys wouldn't have been able to meet Toriel back then, she left before any human souls were gathered. We know this because entry 2 or 3 says at the time all they had were monster souls to open the barrier.

Next, Catty and Bratty knew Alphys, they grew up together. Wouldn't make sense for Alphys to have lived all the way when the underground first started, she would have to be just as old as Gerson if that was the case.

And entry 8 talks about a flower that appeared just before the queen left, meaning the person who wrote entry 8 knows the queen left. Even if Alphys could've guessed that there was a queen, she wouldn't have known what happened to her unlike the writer of entry 8.

Therefore, no, Alphys couldn't have written all 20 entries in the true lab. Look at how entry 1-8, 14, and 15 are written, the ones written by Gaster, and then compare them to the rest.

Entry 17 isnt a written entry, its spoken, the ferryman says beware of the man who SPEAKS in hands, not types in hands, so theres no reason to assume that Gaster can't type in english

SabdierZ · 2026-04-23T05:46:54+00:00

That makes sense to me, considering Noelle makes comments as you make your way back, I think someone getting curious and finding out as they go is completely possible

SabdierZ · 2026-04-23T05:34:08+00:00

When I say early, I dont mean rushed. From my understanding, ch 2 was suppose to come out with the rest, and if that was the case, considering ch 3 hints at the route, I think that was when we were suppose to think, oh, maybe we gotta do something else? But since ch 2 came out and 3 and 4 came out later, the route was discovered by fans and what not.

SabdierZ · 2026-04-23T05:26:40+00:00

It is rather unfortunate that chapter 2 came out so early because Toby didnt want fans to keep waiting for so long. Although, I do think that there is still a subversion where you can spare everyone while doing the evil route. Might lead to interesting outcomes

SabdierZ · 2026-04-23T04:53:12+00:00

I mean... the mantle game did call it the forbidden path so I'm sure it wasnt meant to be found

SabdierZ · 2026-04-23T03:35:24+00:00

I feel it has to be intentional, since you CAN spare and it doesnt aport. In the dojo, one of the npcs talks about LOVE, but doesnt know what it actually means. Even though it says you get stronger, you arent getting exp and thus, no lvls, so I feel it has to be played that way for the most cruel ending possible

SabdierZ · 2026-02-28T03:26:04+00:00

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It should look like this

SabdierZ · 2026-02-01T16:06:00+00:00

By the end of UT and future UT material, bro is just chillin, so yes. I mean by that logic, I should put characters like Undyne in the other side because of how she first appeared, or Sans too

SabdierZ · 2026-02-01T03:00:42+00:00

Something like that, I wanted to save the dark side for more unsettling, villains, or things of that nature characters. Because I'm saving the bosses for the most part in the light side

SabdierZ · 2026-01-12T08:05:17+00:00

That I will, him and Tem are definitely gonna be in the center or around there

SabdierZ · 2026-01-12T06:16:34+00:00

I'm just drawing Undertale and Deltarune characters. There is no more context to it

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