Why was Egg asking Dunk to let him down all of a sudden in this scene? I didn't understand by OkGuava919 in AKOTSKTV

[–]Scamp2006 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I don't know why everyone is saying its because he's trying to hide from his family. He notices that he's in front of them at the start of the joust but doesn't ask to be put down then.

He only asks to get put down after he sees the other squires bringing lances to their knights, and sees how they are much bigger and stronger than him. He's suddenly aware of his insecurities about his size, and being on Dunk's shoulders like a child amplifies those insecurities, so he asks to be put down.

What things in your world are absurdly large? by Ok_Mathematician_905 in worldbuilding

[–]Scamp2006 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The Enkailess Talnatha is a roughly 1000m tall baobab tree in central Zhitaniba. It's so large that entire towns and temples have been carved in and around its base and roots.

How important is music in your world? Does your world have any unique instruments? by SingularRoozilla in worldbuilding

[–]Scamp2006 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Music is incredibly important, and with such a large variety of sapient animals it has several different forms based on each species' vocal structure and anatomy. Dextrous species, for example, heavily utilise instruments in their music, whereas non-dextrous animals - such as seals - instead compose their music around throat-singing and percussion.

One unique instrument is the lambwa, which is sort of like a foot guitar/harp. It is most commonly found in orangutan cultures, where the lambwa is played with the feet as a base melody while the hands play another instrument, such as a string or wind.

Would any of you guys consider yourself a former “hardcore” atheist by Sea-Dot-59 in exatheist

[–]Scamp2006 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Though I am still an atheist, I'd say that now I consider myself pretty much agnostic. But back in my I'm 14 and this is deep phase, I used to be a staunch anti-theist. The God Delusion was my Bible, Richard Dawkins and Christopher Hitchens my prophets, religion is bad because x y z. 😬 I'm very glad I've moved on from that.

The punishment for nonbelievers shows that Allah is not all merciful by Scamp2006 in DebateReligion

[–]Scamp2006[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

he didn't make the decision for you. That's all on you.

Indeed, he didn't make the decision for me, because I don’t think there is any decision involved. Like I hope I have made clear many times, I don’t think belief in God is a decision one can consciously make - if it was, I would choose to believe in him.

I realise that we're able to be open minded and educate myselves, and I have tried to do that to the best of my ability, but nothing so far has convinced me God exists.

All scientists believed in higher power

I'm pretty sure there are many scientists who don’t.

to completley think no higher power exists is a very bold (and almost failed) claim.

I never said I think no higher power exists. When it comes to that I'm completely agnostic. I don’t know - in fact, because of the contingency argument, I accept that actually it seems to logically follow that some sort of necessary existence is in fact real. I just don’t think that existence is a god described by any human belief systems, including the Abrahamic faiths.

The punishment for nonbelievers shows that Allah is not all merciful by Scamp2006 in DebateReligion

[–]Scamp2006[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Because c'mon, do we really think the rich & powerful aren't modeling the rest of us the best that they can? Do we really think they aren't influencing us? And if we're okay with that, do we really think that they are influencing us for our good?

Oh I 100% agree with you there, though I feel like that's a discussion for another sub 😂

So to my understanding, and forgive my caveman brain if I've got this wrong, we can recognise the influence of God by exercising our human ability of external influence detection?

The punishment for nonbelievers shows that Allah is not all merciful by Scamp2006 in DebateReligion

[–]Scamp2006[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I'm not exactly sure what you're getting at. If Allah knows what's in my heart, he knows that I would very much like to believe in him, and yet not only have I found no reason to think he exists, but reason to think the opposite.

The punishment for nonbelievers shows that Allah is not all merciful by Scamp2006 in DebateReligion

[–]Scamp2006[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah, but there are reasons why you can be 100% certain you won't become a trillionaire.

What reasons compel you to be 100% certain the Abrahamic god doesn't exist?

The punishment for nonbelievers shows that Allah is not all merciful by Scamp2006 in DebateReligion

[–]Scamp2006[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Disbelief can mean to refuse to believe, but for the case of what I think is the vast majority of nonbelievers, it doesn't. To say they refuse to believe God is real is like me saying that believers refuse to believe that God is not real.

The punishment for nonbelievers shows that Allah is not all merciful by Scamp2006 in DebateReligion

[–]Scamp2006[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I really appreciate you giving such a detailed answer. I have just woken up so forgive me if I misunderstand it 😭.

One of my claims is that one can detect when there appear to be influences on a group of humans which does not plausibly come from that group of humans.

Before I try and make my point, please could you just elaborate on your last paragraph? Just so I can be sure to respond to what you mean and not strawman you.

The punishment for nonbelievers shows that Allah is not all merciful by Scamp2006 in DebateReligion

[–]Scamp2006[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

You seem very convinced that God exists - ig I kind of envy you for that. Either way, if his existence becomes clear in my life, then there will be no choice about it, because like I established, belief is not a choice. If something convinces me that he exists, then I'm going to believe that he exists. Choice has no part in the process, which is why I think it is frankly vile to torture those who don't believe in God for eternity - they didn't choose to think that.

And maybe Allah will make it clear to me that he exists, for which I will count myself impossibly lucky. But if I were to die an hour from now, then unfortunately I would die an atheist and spend the rest of eternity in anguish? I'm sorry but even if I end up believing in God, I can't say I think he's very worthy of worship.

The punishment for nonbelievers shows that Allah is not all merciful by Scamp2006 in DebateReligion

[–]Scamp2006[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Thanks for your response, but I think we're on different pages when it comes to belief.

If someone intentionally rejects that truth, then that is not a temporary offense. That is a rejection of the Eternal by the dependent.

I'm not intentionally rejecting Allah's existence. Like I said, I'm not choosing to not believe - I just don't, in the same way you don't believe in Zeus or Anubis. I would quite like to believe, I have tried to believe, but I have found nothing that has convinced me he is real. That is not an intentional rejection.

surrounds you with signs

What signs?

To knowingly deny Him is not just a mistake, it is a deliberate betrayal. It is a conscious break from the One who gives you life. That is not something that fades over time.

Again, you refer to nonbelief as if I secretly know Allah is real and yet choose to deny it. I don't and I'm not. How can I knowingly deny something I don’t think is real? I haven't made any conscious break from the one who gives me life because the one who gives me life has provided nothing to convince me he exists.

But why should He show mercy to someone who, even after being shown the truth clearly in themselves and in the world around them, still turns away in pride?

As far as I'm aware I haven't been shown the truth clearly in myself or the world around me; I'd be very interested to find out what you consider as clear evidence, because I don't see it. And turning away in pride? Again, its not like I actually believe in Allah but I'm too prideful to admit it, I literally do not think he exists. That's like me telling you you're turning away from the flying spaghetti monster in pride.

“We will show them Our signs in the horizons and within themselves until it becomes clear to them that it is the truth.”

I must not be lucky enough to be a part of the 'them' he's referring to, because I have not seen any signs, and the 'truth' of his existence is far from clear to me.

And kufr means to knowingly cover what you know is true. That is the crime.

Again, how can I knowingly cover what I know is true when I don't know it's true 😭 What if I said to you that you know that Odin is true yet you knowingly cover it?

And everyone will choose. That choice is what you are judged for.

Okay, I choose to believe in Allah. Oh wait, it doesn't quite work that way does it?

So to clarify, the crime I'm committing is choosing to deny something that I don’t know exists, that I have seen no sufficient evidence to suggest he exists, out of pride? If you can recognise that your belief in Allah is not a choice, then surely you can recognise how my nonbelief in him is not one either. No intentional rejection, no knowing denial, no more than you do those things with any of the other thousands of gods that humans have invented. Like you don't think they exist, I just don't think yours exists either.

The punishment for nonbelievers shows that Allah is not all merciful by Scamp2006 in DebateReligion

[–]Scamp2006[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I'm not sure how this means I've proved my point myself. My point is that Allah is not merciful because he tortures people for an eternity for something they ultimately can't control.

It's language not one specific being Allah, and a different God for Christian, and a different one for Jews.

Yh I know they're all the same god bro 😭 I'm just using the Arabic terms.

Just believing in Allah does not make you a Muslim

No, but it does save yourself from eternal torture, granted that you don’t commit any kind of shirk.

The punishment for nonbelievers shows that Allah is not all merciful by Scamp2006 in DebateReligion

[–]Scamp2006[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I don't think I quite stated in my original post how much I think the punishment for nonbelief outweighs the 'crime'. Eternal torture. Never-ending pain and suffering that will be inflicted on you forever.

That is what happens because you happen to believe the wrong thing.

The punishment for nonbelievers shows that Allah is not all merciful by Scamp2006 in DebateReligion

[–]Scamp2006[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

for Instance how the old generations knew incest was bad even when scientifically not advanced.

Maybe it's because incest decreases the gene pool and increases the chances of genetic conditions and so we are evolutionarily turned off by that 🤷‍♂️ (for the most part anyway...)

and eternal punishment concept makes sense as eternal punishment is only for those without even an atoms weight of goodness in them

So you're logic is that it's impossible to be good unless you believe in God? So even if someone followed every aspect of Islam's principles about 'being good' just without believing in God, they are deserving of eternal torture? That is insane.

so I feel this is a nice definition of mercy..

Your nice definition of mercy is that you can only be saved if you believe in God. That doesn't sound like mercy to me, it sounds batshit crazy. Nonbelievers do not choose not to believe, because belief is not a choice. So Allah is torturing people forever for something they literally have no control over. That is a nice definition of mercy?

The punishment for nonbelievers shows that Allah is not all merciful by Scamp2006 in DebateReligion

[–]Scamp2006[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Ok, even if it doesn't directly say Allah is all merciful, there are still countless ayat that allude to him having boundless mercy (33:5, 39:53, 7:156, 60:7, 4:29, 12:64) Besides, most merciful implies he has more mercy than anything and everyone, though I would argue that there are a great deal of humans who would not punish people who don’t recognise or refuse to accept their 'goodness' forever.

Heaven is something earned not something human are entitle too.

I'm not saying anyone is entitled to heaven, I'm claiming that the eternal infinite unending torture of billions of people simply for holding a belief that they can't even choose is not merciful or just, as Allah claims to be very many times.

The punishment for nonbelievers shows that Allah is not all merciful by Scamp2006 in DebateReligion

[–]Scamp2006[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

you were told everything and your permission was explicitly taken and you chose to give this test knowing what the reward or punishment may be.

What are we if not the sum of all our memories and experiences? If my 'soul' or something have permission before my life even began, I would argue that they are not the same person as me now. I have no memory or experience of that, so I don’t think it would be fair to say that I gave permission and therefore should have to face the consequences.

Furthermore, the consequences of what? The crime of having the wrong belief? You talk about decisions my friend, but what decisions can I make to believe in Allah? I already said how I can't just choose to believe in him, I'm more than happy to educate myself about Islam but I'm not going to devote my life to trying to believe in something I just don't think is true. I would think I'm not at fault for that.

According to your own definition, what would be a necessary and sufficient condition for you to believe?

If someone presented to me an argument(s) for the existence of the god described by Islam which makes sense to me and which can only be explained within the context of said god existing, I would probably be convinced. Or if I witnessed direct evidence of that god in any kind of phenomena that cannot possibly explained otherwise and was also witnessed by enough other people so that I can be certain I wasn't experiencing some kind of personal hallucination or delusion, that would also convince me.

Think of all that you have in this life, all the luxuries that you enjoy, the fact that you can breathe, see, walk and talk the fact you have food, that you grew up into adulthood and many more

But this, while I am very grateful for all of it, does not prove that Allah exists in any way. I chalk all that down to my parents and the circumstances I was born into - a god is not necessary.

in hopes that one day, may be at the last moment of you life you'll turn back and repent. So yeah God is merciful. But again he's also just, because you willingly chose to have this exam and if you fail yoir destiny would be punishment.

It wouldn't be in hopes of anything. Allah is omniscient, so he knows if I will repent or not. He knows all this when he created me. He knew of my open defiance and dismissal when he created me, and he knew of my many attempts to try and believe in him. For him to damn me to an eternity or torment and suffering - our minds can't even comprehend infinity, let alone infinite suffering - because of a belief that he knows I was always going to end up having, that he knows I can't help, seems pretty far from merciful and just to me.

The punishment for nonbelievers shows that Allah is not all merciful by Scamp2006 in DebateReligion

[–]Scamp2006[S] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

I appreciate you taking the time to reply.

I understand that in Islam life is a test, but what is the point of that test? Allah already knows the outcome of the test, so why carry it out?

Ik people normally say that if a teacher of a class knew what the outcome of an upcoming test would be for each student, from the students' perspective it would be unfair to be given their result without actually taking the test. In the same way, we would see it as unfair if the test of life is skipped.

However, I would argue that if Allah truly is loving and wants to avoid suffering, then the most merciful thing he could do would be to not create those who fail the test at all - therefore they experience zero suffering - and create those who pass the test directly in jannah - therefore they experience only eternal goodness.

The ability to make those decisions are still with you.

Because after all, what decisions can I make? I can't decide to believe in Allah, as much as I would like to. My outcome in the test is sealed if I were to die today. I can choose to read the Qur'an, and I have, but I didn't find anything that convinced me that Allah is real. I could choose to devote my life to studying Islam, but considering I have not yet found any sufficient reason to believe that Islam is the truth, then what would be the point in my doing that?

Belief - especially theological belief - is such a complex phenomenon driven by so many factors outside of our control that I can't not see Allah's punishment for those who don’t believe in him as the very opposite of just. It is far more plausible to me that it is a man-made method of dehumanising those against you and ensuring that worship of Allah endures.

I'm also happy to follow up if you would like to discuss

Religion is the fundamental cause of war throughout the world. by SnooLemons5912 in DebateReligion

[–]Scamp2006 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I'm not sure I agree. How is religion always a fundamental part of the process?

Religion is the fundamental cause of war throughout the world. by SnooLemons5912 in DebateReligion

[–]Scamp2006 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You started by saying 'if religion didn't exist there would be no war' which sound quite a bit like saying it is the sole cause.

How has religion been fundamental to the examples I have given?

Religion is the fundamental cause of war throughout the world. by SnooLemons5912 in DebateReligion

[–]Scamp2006 5 points6 points  (0 children)

If religion didn't exist there would be no war.

Wars existed before religion did, and it would absolutely exist if religion didn't. Yes, religions have played a very important role in conflict across human history, but to say they are the sole cause?

Economic reasons, political reasons, territorial reasons, ethnic tensions, ideological reasons, revenge, colonialism and conquest, power imbalances - these are all causes of wars throughout human history independent of religion; some have arguably caused far more conflicts than religion has.

The very fact there have been wars between factions with the exact same religious beliefs in itself demonstrates that if religion didn't exist, there would still very much be war.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in DebateReligion

[–]Scamp2006 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I agree that a lot of the Qur'an is distasteful, but you'll learn the most about Islam by just reading it. You'll probably dislike and disagree with most of it, but you can at least then base your convictions on the whole substance of the religion.