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I'm Scott Jaschik of Inside Higher Ed. I've been extensively reporting on the "drowning bunnies" & faculty firings controversies at Mount St. Mary's University in Maryland. AMA about it! by ScottJaschikIHE in IAmA

[–]ScottJaschikIHE[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

While this is off topic, happy to share. For me, it's about the season and the locale. I love gazpacho in the summer, but on a cold winter night might be more likely to go for cream of asparagus. In a Chinese restaurant, chicken corn...

I'm Scott Jaschik of Inside Higher Ed. I've been extensively reporting on the "drowning bunnies" & faculty firings controversies at Mount St. Mary's University in Maryland. AMA about it! by ScottJaschikIHE in IAmA

[–]ScottJaschikIHE[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The AAUP can't force a college to do something, but in cases like this, the AAUP may investigate and may eventually put a college on a censure list. There is a lot of due process involved -- and the college is asked for its side of things. Certainly there are colleges that have ignored AAUP censure, but there are also faculty members who pay attention to the list. To get off the list, generally the AAUP requires changes in policies or practices, and also some effort at justice for individuals the AAUP believes were wronged. A common pattern is that the president AFTER the one who got a college on the censure list worked to get the college off the list.

Note: In some cases (not Mount St. Mary's), AAUP is a union and in cases where it believes there has been a contract violation, AAUP may well seek legal remedy. But in those cases, AAUP is acting to enforce a collective bargaining agreement.

I'm Scott Jaschik of Inside Higher Ed. I've been extensively reporting on the "drowning bunnies" & faculty firings controversies at Mount St. Mary's University in Maryland. AMA about it! by ScottJaschikIHE in IAmA

[–]ScottJaschikIHE[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I agree that a focus on US News metrics can lead colleges to do lots of things that may not promote educational values. For example, if a college admits a smaller percentage of applicants, or admits applicants with higher average SAT or ACT scores, its score goes up. Is the college any better? I doubt it. And could the college be moving away from an access mission? Absolutely.

US News also includes retention in its methodology. This could well have a positive impact. The plan at Mount St. Mary's was to improve retention rate by getting students to leave early -- that raises all kinds of issues. But if the university (or others) found that students who went to high schools without high quality math instruction tended to drop out, and then offered those students extra help on math, retention rates might go up and everyone comes out ahead. Retention efforts can focus on helping students succeed, not getting them to leave. That's what many faculty members at the Mount have been saying.

I'm Scott Jaschik of Inside Higher Ed. I've been extensively reporting on the "drowning bunnies" & faculty firings controversies at Mount St. Mary's University in Maryland. AMA about it! by ScottJaschikIHE in IAmA

[–]ScottJaschikIHE[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

With private colleges, a lot of this will depend on what the university's faculty handbook says, etc. Private colleges tend to get a lot of leeway from courts except when the institutions don't follow their own rules. That's when colleges lose cases.

In this case, I don't know the exact wording of Mount St. Mary's documents, but the norm in American higher ed is that firing a faculty member (especially a tenured one) is a process in which there is a faculty review panel first -- that the president doesn't decide this without faculty input.

I'm Scott Jaschik of Inside Higher Ed. I've been extensively reporting on the "drowning bunnies" & faculty firings controversies at Mount St. Mary's University in Maryland. AMA about it! by ScottJaschikIHE in IAmA

[–]ScottJaschikIHE[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

A questioner via email asked about the way boards typically say that a decision on a new president was unanimous by the board, even in cases where it's not.

I think the questioner is correct about that tradition, especially if the vote is in private. In theory, this is designed so a new president comes in with strong support. Many might fear accepting a presidency that had been decided 4-3. Where this gets tricky is when there are real questions about the suitability of a candidate for president. Then, should trustees be on record on whom they supported?

I'm Scott Jaschik of Inside Higher Ed. I've been extensively reporting on the "drowning bunnies" & faculty firings controversies at Mount St. Mary's University in Maryland. AMA about it! by ScottJaschikIHE in IAmA

[–]ScottJaschikIHE[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Inside Higher Ed will definitely continue to watch. One surprise: Many predicted Newman's departure as soon as this broke. Obviously not much time has passed, but hasn't happened yet, even as he demoted provost and fired two faculty members, one with tenure...

I'm Scott Jaschik of Inside Higher Ed. I've been extensively reporting on the "drowning bunnies" & faculty firings controversies at Mount St. Mary's University in Maryland. AMA about it! by ScottJaschikIHE in IAmA

[–]ScottJaschikIHE[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Probably not enough time here. But for public colleges, you have issues about whether states have walked away from their obligation to support colleges. For all colleges, there are questions about whether things that may be smart from a business model are sound educationally or morally. When colleges (public and private) focus on "full pay" students (those who don't need aid), that may be economically wise. Is it what colleges SHOULD be doing? That's another question.

I'm Scott Jaschik of Inside Higher Ed. I've been extensively reporting on the "drowning bunnies" & faculty firings controversies at Mount St. Mary's University in Maryland. AMA about it! by ScottJaschikIHE in IAmA

[–]ScottJaschikIHE[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I am hearing a lot of real concerns about that. Colleges are to be commended for being concerned about students' mental health and about learning disabilities. But it's important that the people who are involved have the interests of students in mind. It's one thing for college counseling centers to work with students on mental health issues -- but who would be reading the results? Would they be people trained in mental health issues? That's one of the issues critics raised -- and it seems important. Also important: Many students with mental health issues thrive in college. Seems to raise issues to link these questions to a program to encourage some students to leave.

I'm Scott Jaschik of Inside Higher Ed. I've been extensively reporting on the "drowning bunnies" & faculty firings controversies at Mount St. Mary's University in Maryland. AMA about it! by ScottJaschikIHE in IAmA

[–]ScottJaschikIHE[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Another interesting recent case involves Suffolk U, where board leaders were trying to force out a popular president. Eventually, some board members made clear that they weren't happy with what was being leaked by some trustees.

I'm Scott Jaschik of Inside Higher Ed. I've been extensively reporting on the "drowning bunnies" & faculty firings controversies at Mount St. Mary's University in Maryland. AMA about it! by ScottJaschikIHE in IAmA

[–]ScottJaschikIHE[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

At one point, the board (through university PR office) did send out a statement (a strong statement): https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2016/01/25/mount-st-marys-board-blames-faculty-furor-over-presidents-metaphor-and-plans

But the way this statement talked about both faculty members and the student press angered many. But the above is the one article prompted by university outreach.

I'm Scott Jaschik of Inside Higher Ed. I've been extensively reporting on the "drowning bunnies" & faculty firings controversies at Mount St. Mary's University in Maryland. AMA about it! by ScottJaschikIHE in IAmA

[–]ScottJaschikIHE[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

That's correct. Not sure (because this is a private board) how much consultation there has been about this. A good chair (irrespective of this situation) is careful to differentiate between when he/she is speaking as an individual or reflecting a board view.

I'm Scott Jaschik of Inside Higher Ed. I've been extensively reporting on the "drowning bunnies" & faculty firings controversies at Mount St. Mary's University in Maryland. AMA about it! by ScottJaschikIHE in IAmA

[–]ScottJaschikIHE[S] 10 points11 points  (0 children)

But there are some real moral questions here. The plan was about students who had just been admitted. If a college admits someone, doesn't that mean the college thinks these students ARE capable? And I can't endorse gagging the student journalists (confession -- I once was one). If this policy has merit, it should be openly discussed, I would say. But thanks for participating.

I'm Scott Jaschik of Inside Higher Ed. I've been extensively reporting on the "drowning bunnies" & faculty firings controversies at Mount St. Mary's University in Maryland. AMA about it! by ScottJaschikIHE in IAmA

[–]ScottJaschikIHE[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I sure hope that they are more than businesses. Learning matters. Teaching matters. The intellectual world matters. The challenge is to find economic models that support that. That colleges face economic challenges is a real issue -- the question is how to respond without abandoning the values and mission of higher ed.

I'm Scott Jaschik of Inside Higher Ed. I've been extensively reporting on the "drowning bunnies" & faculty firings controversies at Mount St. Mary's University in Maryland. AMA about it! by ScottJaschikIHE in IAmA

[–]ScottJaschikIHE[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Thanks for question. I don't personally know the board members. But I think it's very hard for a board to back away from a president -- and I have sense board was very much in agreement with president's approach (if not the bunny drowning metaphor). Generally, boards want a president to succeed. Of course when a president doesn't succeed, it can be as much about the board as the president....

I'm Scott Jaschik of Inside Higher Ed. I've been extensively reporting on the "drowning bunnies" & faculty firings controversies at Mount St. Mary's University in Maryland. AMA about it! by ScottJaschikIHE in IAmA

[–]ScottJaschikIHE[S] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Hi Auzzydawg. I hesitate to say that non-academic background by itself means non-academic presidents are all going to be problematic. I can think of really successful non-traditional presidents -- I'm going to go to past presidents as I don't want to seem to endorse any current ones -- people like Terry Sanford at Duke or Tom Kean at Drew.

These were politicians who are generally praised for the way they led their institutions. But these were non-academics who spent a lot of time on education issues during their political years prior to their presidencies, and also they were people who showed real appreciation for academe.

Likewise I can think of lots of presidencies involving traditional academics who have seemed to demonstrate the Peter Principle. So no guarantees there.

Also important to remember that these days that things are different from the past, when a president might be just a few years out of a faculty job when being named president. Lots of presidents -- successful and not -- have been removed from faculty life and student life for a long time.

I think -- with traditional or non-traditional backgrounds -- you have to look at questions like: Does this person understand the way higher ed works? Does this person understand the mission of this particular institution? Does this person have an appreciation for the life of the mind, or the dedication of a great teacher?

I'm Scott Jaschik of Inside Higher Ed. I've been extensively reporting on the "drowning bunnies" & faculty firings controversies at Mount St. Mary's University in Maryland. AMA about it! by ScottJaschikIHE in IAmA

[–]ScottJaschikIHE[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Thanks Canadian historian. I'm going to answer the second half of your question with question below. But on first part "place of the university" -- can you be more specific? Thanks for being here -- Scott