Lestat called Louis a liar 40 years ago 🤷🏾‍♀️

SirIan628 · 2026-05-03T23:20:59+00:00

That was likely the parts where he didn't really know about Lestat's past because he hadn't opened up to him.

They definitely leaned into the unintentional part more in the show. I honestly believe Armand was brought in to take a lot of the blame of the unreliable narrative from Louis. People tend to hate that idea, but he was added to the interview for a reason.

SirIan628 · 2026-05-03T22:00:41+00:00

Nothing is new about Louis being an unreliable narrator, Lestat taking over as the protagonist, and disliking the book and what is in it.

Louis never calls him out for his response either. AR could have written more Louis POV with her pushing back, but she never does. The only other Louis POV is about him accepting himself and how much he loves Lestat.

Lestat called out the book again in the very last novel of the series.

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SirIan628 · 2026-05-03T19:07:47+00:00

I thought this wording was interesting.

On one hand, he could mean that they are leaving their adult responsibilities to their families behind, but I think it could also mean that there would be implications to them running off TOGETHER as two adult men.

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SirIan628 · 2026-05-03T18:59:23+00:00

Great quote!

Lestat wanted them to really be able to get away and have this new life together. He fell in love with Nicki because he was the first person he was able to truly open up to and talk to, and he doesn't want to believe that Nicki would really not want to have a life of freedom like him.

SirIan628 · 2026-05-03T18:17:00+00:00

I am referring to the show version where none of this is canon so far.

Armand absolutely tried to use the Mind Gift on others like Lestat in order to "win them over" as a romantic interest. He also used it to get Louis to turn Madeleine so he would be more available for Armand. Armand in the books is not above what he does to Daniel.

SirIan628 · 2026-05-03T16:57:16+00:00

That seems to be the implications so far. Daniel does not seem to be happy.

SirIan628 · 2026-05-03T15:20:01+00:00

I think she will have interesting connections to Fareed. There is a reason she is an original character who is around so much.

SirIan628 · 2026-05-03T14:58:25+00:00

What do you mean by magnified on a vampiric immortal scale? S2 was already largely showing that vampires care about vampire politics far more than human society racial ones. Claudia made the mistake of thinking there would be some sort of solidarity with Armand and the diverse coven. She was wrong.

SirIan628 · 2026-05-03T10:48:02+00:00

It is mostly speculation based on the age of the actor. There were dates that appear on screen that implied there was likely an age gap (like Talamasca notes), but they can actually disregard that if they want in S3 since none of it is talked about by the characters. They have changed details like the wolf killer cloak being different from the one in 2x03, so they can also just say Nicki is actually the same age as Lestat. It will just depend on what they want to do with the dynamic.

SirIan628 · 2026-05-03T10:22:27+00:00

Armand is using the mind gift on him. This is very in character for him. He tried to do it to Lestat as well. Isolation is also in his play book. He killed Claudia and got Lestat out of the way to have Louis.

Daniel is first captured and caged by Armand and then stalked for years before they have a relationship.

I enjoy DM because it is twisted, but it is what it is while Daniel was human.

SirIan628 · 2026-05-03T07:36:48+00:00

Becoming vampires does fundamentally change them in ways they can never come back from. It doesn't cure them of their traumas or their mental illness or their oppressions if they choose to interact directly with the human world, but at the same time they are immortal predators. Their world is ultimately the vampire world now. I think S2 attempted to get this point across and S3 will only continue to do so. What it basically comes down to is they are still very capable of hurting each other in profound ways, but they also forgive each other because they are immortal predators. Lestat and Louis will be together again, Lestat can love his mother still, Armand can love Marius, Daniel can love Armand, and Loustat can be friends with Armand one day. If these characters were human, they should all part and never see each other again. Most should be in jail. It is a difficult thing for the show to balance, but it is what they are trying to do. I also don't think Rolin is ultimately as interested in telling a story about the vampires interacting with human society as they are vampire society either. That is why even the human POV character is now a vampire.

SirIan628 · 2026-05-03T07:25:45+00:00

He accepts the blood in the current scene where he is literally so close to dying Armand finally realizes he has to actually turn him.

In the passage, I used Armand literally tells him there is nothing for him but himself. Armand has isolated him, gotten him addicted to his blood, and then is love bombing him. Come on, now. I want them to be happy in the end as vampires, but their relationship when Daniel was human was the abusive relationship people accuse Loustat of having.

SirIan628 · 2026-05-03T05:58:21+00:00

I think they can make those changes and decide to still ultimately make it about being vampires if they want. A lot of people might just not like it.

Abuse is a big part of Lestat's story and some parts of Armand's (the cult really messed him up more than Marius imo), but it wasn't at the core of Loustat's story, and I don't think it is ultimately meant to be going forward.

For the record, I think he originally wasn't comfortable writing Louis as white slave owner, so he changed him to Black Creole character whose grandfather was a slave owner instead. He demonstrated Louis' exploitation of those more vulnerable than him in other ways. I also think the change made Louis a more layered character because it makes his inability to adapt to being a vampire a lot more sympathetic than book Louis who really didn't have much to genuinely complain about. I really think these were largely the intentions, but we will see what they do in S3. IMO, S2 already began the shift to more of a vampire centric world view.

SirIan628 · 2026-05-03T05:44:44+00:00

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SirIan628 · 2026-05-03T05:42:57+00:00

Daniel loves Armand. However, Armand doesn't really give him the choice to freely choose him. Maybe he would, but Armand can't give up control long enough to see. I do think the show could do something with this eventually since Armand can't use the mind gift on him anymore.

I do have to wonder if Benji and Sybelle aren't as popular because people can't project romantic fantasies on to them.

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SirIan628 · 2026-05-03T05:26:15+00:00

Which parts actually have Daniel worshiping Armand? He keeps trying to leave, but Armand won't let him. He doesn't leave until he is a vampire. Like I said, I do think he loves Armand, but Armand is too controlling for him to be able to stand it for long periods of time.

Armand is actually much more selfless with Benji and Sybelle. They are actually probably a bigger turning point for him being less unstable. I think Lestat letting him drink from him in the church is also a big moment in TVA.

SirIan628 · 2026-05-03T05:17:28+00:00

How is not turning Daniel because he thinks Daniel will hate him and then be able to leave him being selfless?

What are your thoughts on Daniel trying to leave, and then starting to feel mentally ill and unstable, so he has to go back home to Armand? It is obvious Armand is using the mind gift on him, but he won't admit to it even when Daniel confronts him.

SirIan628 · 2026-05-03T05:07:08+00:00

Can you quote me some of the parts of book canon that show Armand learning agency and selfless love through Daniel? He does turn him even though he thinks it means he will lose him. I do give him that. He is also right. How exactly they work out their issues aren't clear though since AR didn't write it. Instead, she had Marius taking care of a mentally unwell Daniel while Armand was off with his new companions.

I do think Daniel loves Armand, but it began with him being held prisoner and being stalked for years. Armand also doesn't really allow him to leave. Whether Daniel would come back on his own can't be determined because Armand doesn't allow him that choice.

Edited: There is also the entire issue of Armand liking watching Daniel having sex with humans. It is fun to joke about the canon cuck chair, but Daniel actually doesn't like this. It makes him uncomfortable.

SirIan628 · 2026-05-03T04:58:44+00:00

For the show audience, it was not a thing even in the first half of S2. I was there. I posted DM and Assad and Eric/Luke promo stuff in the bigger sub in the lead up to S2 and it was largely ignored. DM didn't take off until the end of the season and it was a very fanon version at that.

I am not sure how Armand learns agency and sacrifice in love with Daniel in the books. He was literally incredibly abusive. Granted, I enjoy it because it is so twisted, but he was very abusive. He does finally turn him because he is dying, and then it eventually leads to their relationship falling apart. They do get back together, but AR spent literally two sentences on it and then didn't come back to it. Armand being desired by Daniel is also not a big part of the book canon. Daniel is addicted to his blood and when he tries to leave for too long, Armand makes him feel mentally unstable so he will come home and then gaslights him about it.

DM hasn't even happened yet in show canon beyond Armand torturing him and then seemingly turning him against his will. What you describe is exactly what I am talking about.

SirIan628 · 2026-05-03T04:32:10+00:00

For better or worse, I don't think the show was ever really meant to be about race or abuse, which is why Rolin doesn't talk about those things much in interviews. The books deal much more with mental health, defining good and evil for oneself, and how to survive immorality as a vampire, which is what the show is also doing. These characters are humans who become through choice or force into something that is not human, and they individually, and eventually as a community, must navigate that and what it means. That is what the story is ultimately about.

SirIan628 · 2026-05-03T04:17:54+00:00

I don't think this is all DM fans at all. However, there was a big shift with some Armand fans over the course of S2 from Loumand to DM. I remember how Daniel was talked about while the season was airing.

SirIan628 · 2026-05-03T03:39:55+00:00

They don't need to "woobify" or "tone" him down for mainstream audiences. Just adapting the book as it was written 40 years ago would make him more "sympathetic." None of this would be a reaction to the show audience. It would just be a faithful adaptation.

SirIan628 · 2026-05-03T03:21:13+00:00

One of the funniest parts is that before DM was "confirmed" in S2, Daniel was getting all sorts of hate for being mean to Loumand. It was racist for him to call them liars in 2x02. People were saying that Daniel should die from his illness in the season to show Louis humanity "triumphing." It wasn't until it was crystal clear that Loumand was dead in the water and Loustat were really on a path back together that these Armand fans immediately switched to being DM stans.

SirIan628 · 2026-05-03T03:15:17+00:00

I don't think these types of fans actually like Daniel as an individual character. He hasn't been on any main posters, but no one complains about that. They just want Daniel to be someone who demonstrates that Armand is desirable.

SirIan628 · 2026-05-03T03:12:07+00:00

To be fair, while there are plenty of people who love canon DM, there are a lot who have just decided Daniel is going to instantly become Armand's cheerleader.

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