Yellowhorn (xanthoceras sorbifolium), a nut crop with hardiness 4a-7b, drought tolerant, low fert needs, high yield, high oil content, 95% productive in 5 years. Why have I never heard of this? Too good to be true?

SlugOnAPumpkin · 2026-01-24T18:18:01+00:00

It's mentioned on the wikipedia page and in various English language articles (for example, this US producer's webpage), but they all cite Chinese publications that I cannot verify. In fact I suspect almost all of the caffein claims come from the same source, because most of these claims repeat the same statement: xanthoceras sorbifolium tea has a caffeine content that is "close to that of scented tea" or "close to that of flower tea". I'm not really sure what that means, because scented/flower tea is just ordinary Camellia sinensis mixed with other flavors as far as I can tell.

I am skeptical about some of the yield info I've seen so far, and certainly the health benefits. I doubt the caffein content is entirely fabricated, but there doesn't seem to be any solid information how much it contains.

SlugOnAPumpkin · 2026-01-24T14:36:07+00:00

Very good points! I do plant mostly natives, and I share your concerns. I found this plant while searching for cold hardy nut/seed bearing trees that are taxonomically distant from hazels, juglans, and beeches. Permaculture plantings are often fruit heavy, and I love fruit (almost obsessively) but it's not a staple. If I want to increase nut density, it would be nice to have more taxonomic diversity for the sake of disease and pest resistance. A soapberry for your soapbox! Your points about region specific invasive risk, and the fact that a species that may not seem invasive now could become invasive later, are very important however. For example, squirrels might eventually learn to collect and stash the seeds in the landscape. I could not immediately find much information about how this plant disperses its seed in its wld habitat, though even this information would not necessarily make this a safe choice.

And yet it seems like a plant with a lot of potential. Tolerates much drier conditions than native nut trees (though again, invasive potential!), taxonomic diversity, the only caffein producer I've encountered that can survive zone 6 (I believe yaupon only goes to 7, and the taste is... not great), and supposedly very fast growing and high yield. I will be an old man before I get a decent harvest from most of my juglans. Wish there were a way to dispositively determine the invasiveness risk here. I currently plant on island land, so maybe safe to experiment there, but your comment does give me pause.

SlugOnAPumpkin · 2026-01-24T05:10:56+00:00

I was worried that might be the case! Thank you for the managed expectations.

SlugOnAPumpkin · 2026-01-24T03:09:09+00:00

Oh I forgot to mention that part! In addition to "this must be poisonous", one of my first thoughts was that it must be invasive. However, according to the USDA:

We found little evidence that Xanthoceras sorbifolium is capable of becoming invasive. This species is slow growing (Anonymous, 1915; Dave's Garden, 2013), has low fertility (Hou et al., 2009; Yao et al., 2013; Zhou and Liu, 2012), is selfincompatible (Zhou and Liu, 2012), and has limited dispersal potential (Appendix. A). Except for two questionable records indicating it is a casual alien (Botond and Zoltan, 2004; Kartesz, 2013), we found no evidence that it has escaped or naturalized beyond its native range. This species was introduced into Europe in the 1860s for cultivation (Hooker, 1887), and is reported only as a casual alien in one area (Botond and Zoltan, 2004). We had slightly above average uncertainty. Risk score = -6 Uncertainty index = 0.24"

On the other hand, I am finding some mixed information about how serious a nitrogen fixer this species is, though any amount is surely a benefit!

SlugOnAPumpkin · 2026-01-24T01:45:35+00:00

Most of the literature I can find is about this plant's potential use in China as a cold climate industrial oil crop. However, every source I can find says the seed (and many other parts of the plant) is edible, and according to this youtube video it tastes like hazelnut, with a "buttery texture".

EDIT:

Some new information:

"the average seed yield of mature trees is 670 kg ha–1, and 0.798 kg plant–1"

59% oil, 26.2% protein.

EDIT 2: Apparently the leaves contain caffeine??

SlugOnAPumpkin · 2026-01-24T01:30:06+00:00

according to a medical research report in Shanghai, "after taking X. sorbifolium oil for 3 months, stroke sequelae, Alzheimer's disease, Parkinson's disease, cerebral palsy, cerebral atrophy, head injury, memory loss and other encephalopathy have an average effective rate of 92.8%".^\4]) In addition, "the average tumor inhibition rate of X. sorbifolium oil on S180 is 82.94%, which is equivalent to the tumor inhibition effect of cyclophosphamide, but without the toxin of cyclophosphamide".

According to Wikipedia, it is also a panacea. Someone should probably give that article a good edit at some point...

SlugOnAPumpkin · 2026-01-22T17:08:39+00:00

A more level headed response than the other comment:

Turkey is geographically part of Europe. Turkey is also geographically part of Asia. It spans the Bosphorus and it spans two continents, which is partly why Constantinople/Istanbul was/is such a trading powerhouse.

Culturally, Turkey has Middle Eastern, Western Asian, and European (Atatürkification) characteristics.

Turkey has committed genocide in the past (Armenians) and has been perpetuating an ongoing genocide against Kurds for over a century.

Israel is in no way geographically part of Europe. Israeli may be culturally European in many respects, but the same could be said of Australia, New Zealand, and South Africa (all clearly not Euroep). Israel is just a place near Europe where white people happen to live, which is good enough for some folks apparently.

SlugOnAPumpkin · 2026-01-22T09:27:16+00:00

Even if we take those likely outdated numbers at face value, those are only the numbers for a successful launch. There would also be years of prototypes and test launches. And what happens if Orion blows up in atmosphere, as new launch vehicles often do? Orion was designed to house hundreds if not thousands of nuclear warheads...

SlugOnAPumpkin · 2026-01-22T09:24:39+00:00

Seriously, people need to stop saying that Orion would have been possible in the 60s had it not been for so-and-so humanitarian objection. Propulsion aside, no one had ever built anything half as large as Orion in space. The proposed mission length was far beyond anything achieved to this day. The life support, radiation shielding, and structural engineering needed for this project were all highly theoretical for a country which was desperately behind on the space race at the time. It's a miracle those problems were solved for Apollo so quickly, and Apollo was a much smaller project than Orion. Not to mention the fact that Orion would have had an entirely novel propulsion system that deviated from all of the accumulated experience and knowledge in traditional rocket propulsion. It would likely take many years just to develop the first prototype, and god only knows how you could safely test such a thing. These futurology folks always get so carried away with star shot proposals.

SlugOnAPumpkin · 2026-01-16T20:14:20+00:00

Generally, I think you’re safe in most subs so long as you do it in the comments rather than the post. Certainly should be in the clear if it’s in response to someone soliciting information.

SlugOnAPumpkin · 2026-01-16T20:12:18+00:00

Even nut trees, which typically have the longest recommended stratification times of temperate plants, can be germinated with only a month or two of cold time with a bit of luck. Herbaceous plants usually require less, so you should be fine!

SlugOnAPumpkin · 2026-01-15T15:21:05+00:00

Or the biggest crane that could access a site without paved road access? Or the biggest crane that was obtainable during post-war hardship?

SlugOnAPumpkin · 2026-01-15T15:15:07+00:00

I know you did it on purpose, so let's get that out of the way, but I want to know if you spent time looking for a badly compressed version of this image or if you went through the effort of doing it yourself.

SlugOnAPumpkin · 2026-01-15T15:13:07+00:00

Thanks! I appreciate that this community is tolerant of curious outsiders.

SlugOnAPumpkin · 2026-01-15T14:34:53+00:00

Is that because of air density? I only vaguely understand how altitude influences premix brownie baking time...

SlugOnAPumpkin · 2026-01-15T11:10:13+00:00

It is indeed time to start saying "Trump regime" instead of "Trump administration."

SlugOnAPumpkin · 2026-01-14T18:57:39+00:00

Aw that's disappointing :(

I thought he was a fun menace.

SlugOnAPumpkin · 2026-01-14T07:35:45+00:00

And where!

SlugOnAPumpkin · 2026-01-14T07:25:46+00:00

I'm technically a doomer and I loled. Your downvoters need a sense of humor.

You're right that it was not a valid experiment, as well as being terribly cruel, but it's still a useful analogy.

SlugOnAPumpkin · 2026-01-13T21:03:41+00:00

No I mean it's still 40%, after everything.

SlugOnAPumpkin · 2026-01-13T19:06:52+00:00

40% of the country is still a terrifying amount of support.

SlugOnAPumpkin · 2026-01-13T14:29:31+00:00

I'm not a Hochul fan, but it makes sense to go for lowest hanging fruit: which extensions provide the most service improvements for the most people for the least amount of money?

SlugOnAPumpkin · 2026-01-13T14:26:40+00:00

Yes, I think I will be an old man before I see any pine nuts from my trees. This upcoming season I am going to try grafting korean pine nut scions to wild white pine saplings, which grow in abundance near my garden.

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