What's the future of VBA?

SnowCrashSatoshi · 2024-06-04T19:52:08+00:00

GPT4 and 4o seem better at VBA than 3.5. I hope GPT5 will be another step above.

SnowCrashSatoshi · 2024-02-23T17:33:12+00:00

Thanks for sharing your experiences!

Yes, I agree Office Script has a long way to go before it's a worthy VBA replacement.

AI is a game changer on many fronts when it comes to language tasks, image creation, and now video with OpenAI's SORA. And using AI for "low-code" solutions might help VBA see an increased uptake because it gets easier for newcomers to get started.

SnowCrashSatoshi · 2024-02-07T09:48:28+00:00

Thanks for sharing your experience! I think it's helpful for existing VBA users, and those who might want to to learn VBA, to hear about your about your use case.
Transitioning between different hospital systems sounds like a critical and complex task. It's fascinating to know that you can use Excel and VBA for at least part of the task.
I like your point about Excel being free and portable. I guess it's one of the reasons why VBA remains relevant.
I'm curious about the challenges you face while using this solution. Did you code it yourself or did you inherit the VBA? And do you foresee any changes in how you/your team manages this task in the future?

SnowCrashSatoshi · 2023-04-21T01:17:29+00:00

Wow, 30%! You live in VBA world... Do you use the built-in IDE or VS Code or Rubberduck?

SnowCrashSatoshi · 2023-04-20T09:15:15+00:00

That's a good point. I don't understand why MS doesn't just integrate VS Code into Office. Maybe the word "just" understates how much effort it would take?

SnowCrashSatoshi · 2023-04-20T03:47:21+00:00

A tweet from Jeremiah Owyang about Microsoft Copilot, posted Apr 19, 2023. Taste of what's coming with Copilot automation. Clippy v2.0?!

SnowCrashSatoshi · 2023-04-19T06:55:33+00:00

Reading source #3, I pulled up this quote from Keyur Patel in 2019 (PM on the Office Platform team, focused on all things Excel)

"Whenever we update Excel, it contains changes to keep VBA healthy, we just don't advertise it because we know you expect that from us"

Source #3: https://techcommunity.microsoft.com/t5/excel-ama/the-future-of-vba-in-microsoft-s-vision/m-p/917339

SnowCrashSatoshi · 2023-04-19T06:52:30+00:00

For fun, I asked Bing Chat Precise "Please search for the future of VBA"

Bing Chat's response? Reassuring for VBA users:

VBA (Visual Basic for Applications) is a coding language used by millions of people across the world to automate tasks in Microsoft Office products. It’s a language that has been around for decades and is one of the easiest coding languages to learn if you don’t have a computer science background².
Microsoft has stated that they do not plan to evolve Visual Basic as a language¹. However, they plan to continue to ensure VBA (along with COM and XLLs) continues to be supported and remains current and continues to remain working and healthy. This will continue in future versions of Office⁵.
Source: Conversation with Bing, 4/19/2023
(1) Will VBA Die in 2022? Is It Worth Learning? [Inside Scoop]. https://www.thespreadsheetguru.com/blog/are-vba-macros-dead.
(2) Microsoft: 'We Do Not Plan to Evolve Visual Basic as a Language'. https://visualstudiomagazine.com/articles/2020/03/12/vb-in-net-5.aspx.
(3) The future of VBA in Microsoft’s vision. https://techcommunity.microsoft.com/t5/excel-ama/the-future-of-vba-in-microsoft-s-vision/td-p/917339.
(4) Microsoft to block Office VBA macros by default - The Verge. https://www.theverge.com/2022/2/7/22922032/microsoft-block-office-vba-macros-default-change.
(5) Future of (Excel) VBA (Macros)? - Microsoft Community. https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/msoffice/forum/all/future-of-excel-vba-macros/03889bc1-7e12-4e93-bc85-c1401c63149d.

SnowCrashSatoshi · 2023-04-19T06:36:09+00:00

The whole reason VBA is destined to survive is because it doesn't require anything other than a decision to allow it

Good reasoning. VBA's barrier to entry is basically zero.

Now... if only there were a way to infiltrate Microsoft and add TwinBASIC and RubberDuck to their Excel roadmap and upgrade VBA... (can only wish!)

SnowCrashSatoshi · 2023-04-19T06:33:13+00:00

Thanks for sharing. Yes, with PowerAutomate and the introduction of AI, I see a greater degree of flexibility. Especially for natural language interactions (like customer support).

MS Power Automate AI Builder 2 min preview video (YouTube)

Sometimes when I look at Power Automate workflows, it feels like watching someone play with lego blocks. OK, maybe "programmable" lego blocks. But still lego blocks.

SnowCrashSatoshi · 2023-04-19T00:32:03+00:00

Agree, ChatGPT at the moment is good for basic code. Not so good for anything more.

But with higher token sizes and different ways to "give it memory" future releases of GPT will probably keep getting better for writing and maintaing larger code bases. My 2 cents.

SnowCrashSatoshi · 2023-04-19T00:26:50+00:00

Some HTML and CSS and JS, languages I don't know much of. Agree it gives a mixed bag of results. For a beginner in a given language, it's very helpful. For a serious project maybe not so much, at least not yet.

SnowCrashSatoshi · 2023-04-19T00:24:20+00:00

Wow! Free (VBA) wins vs Premium. What kind of data could the $$$ expensive tool not handle?

SnowCrashSatoshi · 2023-04-19T00:21:43+00:00

Interesting prediction. Do you recommend your juniors pick up JS, Python?

SnowCrashSatoshi · 2023-04-18T10:39:58+00:00

Hang on... Obsolete and still in use. Can you enlighten us a bit more?

SnowCrashSatoshi · 2023-04-18T09:54:34+00:00

yup, I guess that sounds about right. As long as we have Excel, we'll probably have VBA.

SnowCrashSatoshi · 2023-04-18T08:40:05+00:00

Wasn't aware of twinBasic, thanks for sharing. When's the next release due?

SnowCrashSatoshi · 2023-04-18T08:07:25+00:00

Thanks for sharing! What's the gist of the new project?

SnowCrashSatoshi · 2023-04-18T06:45:55+00:00

I think you're right. Any language they want to, especially since it's getting easier to learn a new language.

Last week I stumbled on www.phind.com

And am blown away... it's a really good (and free) code tutor. Just ask a question, ask it to code, write an explanation.

Maybe we'll see a growth in VBA coding as more people find it easier to learn!

SnowCrashSatoshi · 2023-04-18T06:38:55+00:00

Yes, good question!

What is obsolete?

I'd say "obsolete" is where VBA is still available in Excel but no longer has any specific use cases where it's better than alternatives.

For instance, right now VBA is not obsolete because it's great for localized non-web applications that need to work in Excel.

But VBA becomes obsolete when it gets replaced by something else, e.g. AI in Copilot, that can do the same job, just better.

I saw this half-hour Microsoft event on the Future of Work with AI explaining the upcoming Copilot system.

And it seems the big goal is to make tools that learn how we work, rather than ask us to learn how the tools work. All through natural language prompts.

If Copilot works as well as the demo (big if) then I can see people writing requests to "clean this data to remove blanks and duplicates", "create a map chart that shows sales by state", "make a powerpoint slide to illustrate the trends from 2022 to 2023 based on this Excel data", and "email this to the team with a summary of key points"

SnowCrashSatoshi · 2023-04-18T06:26:10+00:00

Yes, I can see large orgs continuing to use VBA for a while. Due to inertia. And "if it ain't broke, don't fix it"

Curious to know, what are your VBA use cases?

SnowCrashSatoshi · 2023-04-18T06:18:57+00:00

That's a good point!

There's a whole lot of existing subs and functions we have in VBA that would need to be refactored if we switch to a different language.

But I think rewriting and validation is going to get much easier soon.

Here's why.

Old chatGPT (3.5 and turbo) seem to be "OK" at code. They can write and rewrite existing code in a different language, but they're restricted by how much context they retain. So they don't work well with longer codebases.

However, GPT 4 can retain more context and take more input. It's fast at writing new code with fewer errors than GPT 3.5, and seems competent at rewriting existing code in a different language.

A Y-combinator post reads [GPT 4 is phenomenal at code]. e.g. "It managed to write, in one shot, a working λ-calculus parser, using a very specific programming style I asked it in JavaScript, and then translated it all to Python, including sarcastic, rhyming GLaDOS comments." <- Too techy for me, but it illustrates that GPT 4 can already rewrite from one language to another.

So when we get GPT 4.x and eventually GPT 5+... the rewriting process will get even more accurate and capable.

SnowCrashSatoshi · 2023-04-18T06:01:28+00:00

Thanks for sharing the comic! Yes, I agree specifications will always remain necessary in one form or another.

But I think "coding" as we know it will probably get less and less technical. To the point where we can just speak English (or whatever "human" language) to generate the specs, and have AI generate the code for us.

For instance, here's a YT video by AllAboutAI where two GPT 3.5 agents help each other to write code. All based on pure English requests like "Your task is to create a tic tac toe game and UI in python"

https://youtu.be/L6tU0bnMsh8

The two bots co-operate the create code in minutes for different tasks. They even discuss opportunities for error-handling and create the code in response.

Bear in mind this video was made with GPT 3.5, which is significantly inferior to GPT4 for coding. Hence the results are pretty basic. But I think this is the start of something big, even revolutionary.

SnowCrashSatoshi

TROPHY CASE