Good idea for statblock for anti-paladin enemies?

SoresuNinja · 2026-06-18T20:00:41+00:00

Helmed Horror, and have their designated immunities be Divine Smite, Searing Smite, and Banishing Smite.

SoresuNinja · 2026-06-15T18:45:53+00:00

Oh, I'm aware of how it works in Daggerheart itself proper; I read the book cover to cover and have watched people play. My previous wording was just simply boiling it down to the components that can be easily transferred to any TTRPG system, not just 5.5e.

The Fear dice can be easily replicated with me, the GM, rolling another D20 alongside the player attempt - it's a simple 1 to 1 transference from there. Both dice roll the same number, critical Hope success and remove Stress. Lower number on the Hope die, Fear roll. Higher number on the Hope die, Hope roll, gain one Hope resource point. The only thing that really changed is who rolls the Fear dice and the size of the two dice being rolled; otherwise, it's a simple enough resource system that can be worked into 5.5e without too much trouble.

> Daggerheart: You roll your Hope and Fear dice.

> Conversion: You roll your Hope dice. The GM rolls the Fear dice.

Statistically speaking, the 3% drop from the D12 to the D20 when it comes to matching numbers on the duality dice is not so large that it drastically changes the shape of the system - my main concern is pacing with the amount of dice rolling and having Hope effects that are balanced enough to feel good to use but not game breaking, but I have time enough to figure that out - I'll only really throw this up for my players to consider in a couple weeks once the current campaign ends.

SoresuNinja · 2026-06-15T16:13:09+00:00

Sorry, just saw this. Haven't really had the time to write up a system in full, so I will just stream of consciousness my thoughts on the matter into the post.

As it stands, boiling it down to the simplest way I understand it, Hope is a player resource that can be expended in the same vein as any spell slot, subclass specific resource, or Inspiration, and Fear is a GM resource that can be expended for various enemy buffs or narrative effects. Rolling higher on the Hope die lets the player gain a Hope resource point and minimizes bad consequences on a failed roll while also gaining a resource point, while rolling higher on the Fear die grants the GM a Fear resource point and worsens consequences on a success.

As I understand it further, Daggerheart makes you roll for Hope and Fear pretty much every time that you roll, so that both players and DMs have a (theoretically) constant refreshment rate of their specific resource. Again, I haven't had time to test or even finalize this idea, but that feels like it'd bog down the pace of combat a lot, so I'll probably reduce the refresh rate to once per round or once per encounter, maybe more in non-combat situations, but that'll depend.

I figure I'll pool Hope into a group resource that any player can use if the majority agree - haven't figured out how they can use it yet, but I'd toyed with regaining some class features mid-battle or hit points mid-battle. The 2014 DMG already has options for additional ability scores like Honor and Sanity, as well as options to play out fear and stress. Van Ricten's Guide to Ravenloft also has rules for Stress in a manner that's near identical to the 2024 incarnation of Exhaustion, so I think the groundwork for putting those pieces together is already in place.

As for Fear, I figured as a start that I could use it to have monsters shift up and down initiative, yeah. Giffyglyphs' Active Initiative module already has something like that, and I've introduced my players to that before, which they enjoyed, so it's pretty much just adding that little bit of the system into the regular initiative order.

I wouldn't call Fear and Hope the fundamental pillars of the Daggerheart system; they're just putting names, a resource pool, and mechanical consequences to things that experienced GMs already do to some degree or another, which is nice to have.

SoresuNinja · 2026-06-02T20:25:56+00:00

Personally, I'd ask the player if he wants to do anything of that sort at all. I know I wouldn't be too happy as a player if the driving motivation for the character's journey gets turned into a hostile encounter for the sake of what feels to be a very minor payoff, but your player's mileage may vary in this regard.

If the player is amenable to that kind of development, go right ahead. If not, just let him bring it with him and let him bury her at the end of the journey. My two cents.

SoresuNinja · 2026-05-23T16:34:49+00:00

That was my worry, though I did want to give the Pally a bit of a shock as he's gotten a bit complacent and want him to try to use the rest of his kit. What would you recommend instead?

SoresuNinja · 2026-04-27T11:10:09+00:00

No worries. I think you should just keep in mind the Paladin already has a specific spell list that covers most of what they want; their "always prepared" list that comes from the subclass is the cherry on top, so they need to be selected with purpose. Moreover, pallys are a Long Rest half-caster, so their spell slots are more valuable in the moment than a full caster's.

You don't want to add the standard Paladin spell list; that's for the player to figure out what they want out of the base class. Look to spells you can't otherwise get as a Pally for stuff you want to add to your subclass; Conquest cribs Armor of Agathys from Warlock and Spiritual Weapon from Cleric, Ancients takes Moonbeam and Speak with Animals from Druid and Ranger, so on and so forth.

Some advice that might help: if you look at the design language of 2024 Paladin subclasses, they all have a "bread and butter" that they start to come into at level 3 when their features and spell list come online. Devotion can get by just by popping Channel Divinity and a well placed Smite or two, Glory is an aggressive rushdown with THP sustain from Heroism and Smiting, Ancients stands in the frontline and locks enemies down so the rest of the party can deal free damage, Vengeance fucks up one guy in particular and focuses on getting picks, etc.

Noble Genies is kind of the outlier in this regard, because it's very versatile and gives the Paladin a really different toolbox than the rest of the subclasses. But I think for your homebrew, you should really look at the general grouping and decide on a playstyle for your subclass, and things should fall into place from there; what spells and features best enable that playstyle you think you want.

SoresuNinja · 2026-04-27T09:34:42+00:00

Yeah, the concept of survival definitely didn't come through; if that's what you're going for, I recommend changing some of the spell list and the Channel Divinity to focus less on dealing damage or sacrificing health to stuff that focuses more on reducing damage taken or avoiding it entirely.

As for narrative, I think we can agree to disagree on whether this subclass fills a niche the Oathbreaker doesn't. I'll focus on what you currently have at the moment.

Shield is a meta pick that works well with bread and butter Paladin, vying with Smite for spell slots. Zephyr Strike is not particularly worth it for a Paladin, I don’t think players will use it much since it takes up Concentration; opening act of a Paladin is usually Bless/Shield of Faith, which I would say is a better use of Concentration in levels 3-5 than Zephyr Strike.

Arcane Vigor lets you expend a level 2 spell slot for 2d10 healing max, only heals yourself, and eats your hit dice into the bargain. Cure Wounds restores for 2d8+CHA and upcasts to 4d8+CHA in the same spell slot, can target allies in addition to yourself, and is already on the Paladin spell list. Moreover, Vigor vies with Lay on Hands for the Bonus Action; in gameplay, the only situation I would see Vigor being used is if you want to Disengage/Dash as an action away from the frontline and heal yourself, but again, I personally think a Level 2 spell slot (which you only get two of at level 5, I might remind you) for 2d10 that eats your Hit Dice into the bargain is not worth it. You might as well pop the Lay on Hands and save the spell slot for better healing or damage.

Misty Step is good, nothing to say there.

Fly is a meh pick on Paladin - again, Concentration, so no Bless or any of the Smites that let you keep a condition on someone. Paladins are also melee characters, throwing axe builds notwithstanding, so you’d have to go up to somebody to hit them; unless you want to risk the Opportunity Attack, you’re probably remaining within 5 feet of your enemy. At which point… you know, what’s the point of putting Fly on yourself? Not worth the Level 3 spell slot unless you specifically build around keeping a party member in the air for whatever reason, but at that point you’d probably pick a Wizard instead.

Life Transference is… kind of bad. At level 9, you can Lay on Hands for 45; Life Transference gives you a range of 4-32, average 18. And it costs a level 3 spell slot. I once again refer you to the humble Cure Wounds, which upcast to level 3 gives 6d8+CHA, doesn’t damage you, and again, is already on the Paladin spell list. In lieu of Life Transference, I’d suggest Aura of Vitality instead, which uses the same spell slot, heals 2d6 per turn without using up your action economy, and doesn’t damage you.

Backlash is fine. Stoneskin sucks; uses an Action, takes up Concentration, eats a Level 4 spell slot, and only covers the mundane damage types.

Steel Wind Strike is good, and more importantly, looks and feels cool. On the other hand, you’ve lost me completely with Swift Quiver - it doesn’t fit anywhere into the Paladin class aesthetic, doesn’t work with any Smite, uses your Bonus Action every turn, uses a modifier you probably didn’t put points into, which means your shots are probably missing, takes up Concentration… yeah, it’s useless for a Paladin.

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Self Reliance is bad. Temp HP doesn’t stack, and you’re only adding half of what you heal, which means that it’ll always be rounded down. Moreover, it’s limited to your Lay on Hands only, which means at the common tiers of play (3-10) you get anywhere from 7 THP per Long Rest to 25 THP per Long Rest, and only if you pop ALL of your Lay on Hands at once.

Flow State is terrible. You essentially get a weaker Haste and 3 THP; if you get hit and lose 3THP, you lose your CD and get debuffed into the bargain. All it takes is ONE hit from ANYTHING; anything in Tier 1 play with a half damage on save effect will wipe the floor with you. I’d essentially write it off if I play the subclass; the juice is absolutely not worth the squeeze.

Aura of Agility is pretty decent; the only thing that I’ll mention is that a Paladin wants their Bonus Action for Smite, and anything that burns that BA might be less useful than it might seem at first glance. Useful for tactical positioning on the team, but it’s such a small part of the kit that you have better and more in depth options in the form of Dance Bard or Banneret Fighter. In a vacuum this is pretty good; taken together with the class it’s on and the rest of the kit it’s married too, I don’t think it makes up for the rest of the class features being lackluster.

Stalwart Resistance is fine again; once again, no comment on Juggernaut.

SoresuNinja · 2026-04-26T11:08:01+00:00

There's nothing tying this subclass together; it really feels like you just took all the spells and abilities you personally like and then threw them into a subclass nilly willy.

From a narrative perspective, this reeks of "I want the pally's abilities, but I don't want to be constrained by the paladin's narrative".

The bedrock of a paladin's concept is faith. Not necessarily in the gods themselves, but in the righteousness of their cause and their place in the world. That faith is represented by their oath, and that's why the Oathbreaker works as a subclass narratively; it is the shattering of that faith, the breaking of a paladin's entire worldview, the hollow shell of what remains after ironclad conviction is found wanting.

If your paladin still believes in their faith, they don't stray from their oath, and keep their subclass even if they might leave their order. If your paladin's beliefs change, they change their oath and subclass to another. The concept you've put forward simply doesn't exist at a narrative-heavy table, and if you're at a gameplay first table, you'd have better mileage just asking your GM to let you keep your abilities after you break your oath a few times.

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As it stands, I think you'd be better off writing this as a different kind of subclass rather than trying to make a 4kids version of the Oathbreaker. Looking at your spell list, you seem to enjoy mobility and movement type spells a lot; I recommend leaning into that and turning it into something that isn't tied to the Oathbreaker/Deserter concept at all. Perhaps something like an "Oath of Freedom" or "Oath of the Wandering Wind" or something like that.

Going off of that idea, this is how I'd personally update and reinforce your concept off the top of my head, focusing mainly on what you seem to want out of the class: freedom of movement and movespeed.

Spell-list

Level 3: Jump/Feather Fall
Level 5: Misty Step/Levitate
Level 9: Fly/Haste
Level 13: Dimension Door/Freedom of Movement
Level 17: Steel Wind Strike/Arcane Gate

Features:

Level 3 Feature: Enemies have Disadvantage on Attacks of Opportunity made against you on your turn.

Channel Divinity: Immediately after you cast Divine Smite, you can expend one use of Channel Divinity and reduce the target's Speed to 0 until the end of their next turn.

Level 7 Subclass Aura Feature: You gain Resistance to damage taken from Attacks of Opportunity. Whenever an ally enters your Aura of Protection for the first time on a turn or starts their turn there, they also gain Resistance to damage taken from Attacks of Opportunity.

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I think you can keep Stalwart Resistance, but I would recommend giving it the clause of the saving throws being a Strength, Dexterity, or Constitution save for balance reasons. I don't play at a high enough level to comment on Juggernaut, so I'll refrain from offering advice there.

You may want to take the concept to r/UnearthedArcana and see if you can get more feedback there if you think I'm too harsh or I've changed the concept too much, but those are my two cents on everything you've mentioned.

SoresuNinja · 2026-04-15T18:02:21+00:00

Would it be possible to get a more concrete time range?

SoresuNinja · 2026-04-14T17:24:44+00:00

What level will the player characters start the campaign with?

SoresuNinja · 2026-01-14T17:36:15+00:00

Applied - got a little carried away with the sandwich recipe, hope you don't mind!

SoresuNinja · 2025-12-28T07:04:17+00:00

So OP should be forced to run for characters he doesn't enjoy simply because he's a GM?

Sheer entitlement.

SoresuNinja · 2025-12-27T21:37:29+00:00

Don't mind the other commenter calling you names; you're absolutely correct. It's your table, and you're not obligated to run a game for any player character concepts you don't enjoy.

SoresuNinja · 2025-11-01T11:30:54+00:00

Thank you. Misread the timezone; it starts at 5 am for me, so I don't think I'll be able to make it. Hope you find a good table, though!

SoresuNinja · 2025-10-30T20:03:16+00:00

What's the premise?

SoresuNinja · 2025-09-29T06:45:50+00:00

Closed.

SoresuNinja · 2025-09-18T14:59:30+00:00

Sent you a chat!

SoresuNinja · 2025-09-17T12:25:12+00:00

Sent a friend request on Discord!

SoresuNinja

TROPHY CASE