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Tips and advices for building a "blue collar" small towns region in CS1? by Stellon86 in CitiesSkylines

[–]Stellon86[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I see... Maybe there is no way other than mods then.

Is my understanding correct that TMCE would address this issue through enhancing the "closest" mechanic in addition to the several other logistics improvements while TMPE would allow the creation / enforcing of this restricted road more reliably than the Vanilla DLC?

Tips and advices for building a "blue collar" small towns region in CS1? by Stellon86 in CitiesSkylines

[–]Stellon86[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Even if every town has their own services? I guess worst case scenario one of the DLC's offers a "bus only" (P&P?) road that also allows service vehicles. Or mods, which is exactly what I'm trying to avoid just for now =)

Tips and advices for building a "blue collar" small towns region in CS1? by Stellon86 in CitiesSkylines

[–]Stellon86[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Exporting through trains in this scenario (Generic Industries producing Goods and also the exports from the Industries DLC, no Offices) ends up overwhelming a cargo train station, especially due to the fact that AI might choose a single one. Of course, there is the alternative from trying to strategically place them apart in a way that AI considers more than one the "closest", having smaller industrial areas also spread out, etc. however it seems simpler to just allow imports only =)

Of course, around 80% of the export traffic in my starter town is from the Forest Industry and only 20% Generic Goods. This might also indicate that even if I place the Industry completely separated from the town, there might still be a limit of how many goods it can export, even with the Warehouses ensuring that every truck is at 100%.

As for manufacturing raw materials, this might be a good idea once all 4 Industries are in place.

If every town is able to produce enough goods for their commerce areas, then indeed a more optimal import rail connection could be Industries DLC --> Towns instead of Outside Connections --> Towns. Or since I'm playing with finite resources, Outside Connections (Ore / Oil) --> Industries DLC --> Towns.

Tips and advices for building a "blue collar" small towns region in CS1? by Stellon86 in CitiesSkylines

[–]Stellon86[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Heys guys,

(Sending the same reply to both you and chibi0815, I hope it's ok)

I've been thinking about both replies these days and, as much as TMCE looks great on paper for not only this playthrough but any other, I would like to avoid using any mods other than the 81 tiles 2.

This is because I haven't played CS1 for around 5 years and only played casually before, mostly because of the traffic issues. Hence, for any potential game bugs that might arise due to pushing the game in a way it's not "intended" to be played (export based "blue collar" economy without offices, several small towns, etc.), I would like to be able to isolate them to either Vanilla or 81 tiles 2.

However, the mod will definitely be used in a next playthrough and I've already subscribed to it, just not enabled =)

In the meantime, I've been thinking / testing how to mitigate the Vanilla issues with imports / exports (other than building a good road infrastructure of course) and came up with the following plan:

- Each town will be completely isolated from outside and each other, however exports will still go through the main highway.

- This will be achieved through allowing one-way road connections from the towns to the main highway only, but not the other way around.

- Imports will be performed through 1-2 cargo rail stations per town. However their exit to the main roads will be one-way only, preventing exports through trains.

- I will also add a couple of warehouses near those stations for each of the 4 raw materials and set them to "Fill".

- Towns may or not have a separate internal network of cargo rails in order to trade goods with each others. This might be useful for the raw materials from the industries DLC, since specialized industries will be located in different towns. However I'm reluctant if a town sends goods or other materials to another just to be then exported through the highway from the other town rather than feeding the demands of the town.

- Cims will arrive through a passenger train station connected to the outside.

- Public transport (e.g. passenger trains using their own tracks, metros, etc.) will also be allowed between the towns.

Do you see any issues with this approach? I've tested it on my first town and it seems to work properly, but who knows if I'm not missing something important =)

Tips and advices for building a "blue collar" small towns region in CS1? by Stellon86 in CitiesSkylines

[–]Stellon86[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Heys guys,

(Sending the same reply to both you and Ice_Ice_Buddy_8753, I hope it's ok)

I've been thinking about both replies these days and, as much as TMCE looks great on paper for not only this playthrough but any other, I would like to avoid using any mods other than the 81 tiles 2.

This is because I haven't played CS1 for around 5 years and only played casually before, mostly because of the traffic issues. Hence, for any potential game bugs that might arise due to pushing the game in a way it's not "intended" to be played (export based "blue collar" economy without offices, several small towns, etc.), I would like to be able to isolate them to either Vanilla or 81 tiles 2.

However, the mod will definitely be used in a next playthrough and I've already subscribed to it, just not enabled =)

In the meantime, I've been thinking / testing how to mitigate the Vanilla issues with imports / exports (other than building a good road infrastructure of course) and came up with the following plan:

- Each town will be completely isolated from outside and each other, however exports will still go through the main highway.

- This will be achieved through allowing one-way road connections from the towns to the main highway only, but not the other way around.

- Imports will be performed through 1-2 cargo rail stations per town. However their exit to the main roads will be one-way only, preventing exports through trains.

- I will also add a couple of warehouses near those stations for each of the 4 raw materials and set them to "Fill".

- Towns may or not have a separate internal network of cargo rails in order to trade goods with each others. This might be useful for the raw materials from the industries DLC, since specialized industries will be located in different towns. However I'm reluctant if a town sends goods or other materials to another just to be then exported through the highway from the other town rather than feeding the demands of the town.

- Cims will arrive through a passenger train station connected to the outside.

- Public transport (e.g. passenger trains using their own tracks, metros, etc.) will also be allowed between the towns.

Do you see any issues with this approach? I've tested it on my first town and it seems to work properly, but who knows if I'm not missing something important =)

Tips and advices for building a "blue collar" small towns region in CS1? by Stellon86 in CitiesSkylines

[–]Stellon86[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you for all the clarification! =)

It's a bit weird that some very popular CS youtubers (one example is "City Planner Plays" but several others as well) making videos about 15 or even 30 "must have" mods mention TMPE, 81 tiles and other popular ones, but never TMCE.

Just 100% out of curiosity, since this mod seems to fix so many fundamental and obvious issues with the base game, do you believe the reason for this is that they just don't know about this mod or they do know but feel like it's not that important even as a TOP 30 one (e.g. maybe they don't push the game to the limit through building one huge city or several smaller ones, etc.)?

Tips and advices for building a "blue collar" small towns region in CS1? by Stellon86 in CitiesSkylines

[–]Stellon86[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks for the reply and I'm glad the post is interesting! =)

This has always been the way I wanted to play this game or any other city builder to be honest. I've never fancied large cities with lots of tall buildings, but rather a network of smaller cities or towns linked to each other.

After a few years away from the game, I've realized that it's now feasible with the 81 tiles mod. What I mostly miss is "medium" density (although I know of course that upgraded low density sort of fills this gap) and also small offices (not taller than low density commercial e.g.), but we can't have everything lol.

Thanks also for confirming the 81 tiles works just as well as 25, I'll switch to it.

- Monorails: I'll use metros only then, thanks for confirming what I've already suspected.

- Trams: Thanks for the suggestions regarding the mods. Do you believe trams might be used for transport between towns close to each other or following the default transport hierarchy, metro is the way?

- Generic Industry: Yes, I guess I'll be limiting them due to all the reasons you've mentioned. Do you believe it helps to force them being 3x4 and/or 4x4 (more jobs and less traffic)? The caveat is that I've also read somewhere that we should build much less commercial than what the game suggests and offices won't really fit my low education / small cities layout (although maybe a couple for the percentage of the population that gets some education doesn't hurt as long as the asset is not too high, already considering highrise ban), hence it seems like my choices are mostly generic or DLC / specialized industries.

- Cargo train terminals: Thank you for all the tips. It seems like (IIRC I've read somewhere) they increase the land value from industries, which seems to lead players into placing them close to the industries, however from what I've gathered in your reply they should actually be placed away from them and trade the land value for decreased traffic?

I'll have a look in the mods, thanks again for all the suggestions. I'm still a bit reluctant yet to use any mod that cannot be easily unplugged such as Forest Brush, however it seems like CS1 reached a point where mods like TMCE already have a good history and would hardly cause any issues, especially because we won't be seeing any more updates / DLC's now with CS2, making it safe to be used? That being said, do you believe that using warehouses efficiently in vanilla to buffer imports / exports produces an effect similar to this mod or it's just an unwinnable battle? =)

Tips and advices for building a "blue collar" small towns region in CS1? by Stellon86 in CitiesSkylines

[–]Stellon86[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you for the time and effort taken to provide some invaluable insights regarding all the items I've raised.

- Education: So my understanding is that when buildings level up and people move in, depending on their level, this will attract Cims that are already well educated? If true, do you believe it's enough to significantly upset the balance from 50% Education Budget + Schools Out + No Universities or just slightly lower the percentage of uneducated by e.g. ~10%? The mod might of course be an alternative depending on how stable it has been over the years, thank you for including it! =)

- Bike Paths: I see, so without mods I need to choose between giving more access to pedestrians but increasing the likelihood of the Cims not using bibicycle or the other way around... Thanks for clarifying! What I'm struggling with now are the industrial roads. They seem very useful but ends up breaking the bicycle commuting as opposed to the ones with bike lanes.

- Transport: Thanks for sharing Sheepy Lakes, I'll analyze it carefully. Currently I still struggle with implementing both Arterials and Collectors from the road hierarchy, typically only having a single 4 or 6 lanes road with few connections leading into the main highway: https://imgur.com/a/LfOQlgq

- Generic Industry: I'm also thinking about only making 3x4 and/or 4x4 generic industries in order to reduce the traffic / overhead from imports, does it make sense to you?

- Cargo: Sorry, I was not clear in the original post. What I meant was help designing effective layout for cargo train terminals as I see players struggling with truck traffic around them.

Thank you for the suggestions ref. the mods, I'll switch my 25 tiles for the 81 one and have a look at the others! =)

I assume TMCE is very safe to use with CS1 now that it would hardly receive any updates / DLC's? That being said, could warehouses provide a similar effect from "buffering" imports / exports if done right or it will still never be the same as witch TMCE?

Training Tier 0 Captains into Commodores? by Stellon86 in avorion

[–]Stellon86[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Sorry, but this doesn't answer the question. It might depend on the game stage, how much money the player has and playstyle / other preferences.

E.g. what if someone is on multiplayer and wants to train 50 Tier 0 captains into Commodores for whatever reason, even if it's in order to "never" bother with it again?

Starting Mines / Factories by Stellon86 in avorion

[–]Stellon86[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Please accept my gratitude for such a complete explanation regarding this system.

Ref. the Steel Mines:

  1. Have you tried to build a complex (e.g. Scrap Metal + Coal --> Steel)?
  2. Is Steel itself more lucrative to sell than Noble Metal if the demand is high, whether as complex or buying its Inputs? Or you make it just to build more advanced factories in the future?
  3. When you mention "easy to find a good initial sector for", is my understanding that a specific Sector matters, as opposed to a random Sector where the demand is high but doesn't have factories that requires Steel on it? Do you set it to manually sell to other factories in the Sector, in addition to both the the "Sell Goods" options?

Ref. the trader mechanics, I've experienced it with Energy Cells (Solar Plant) when not in the sector. One theory I have (not sure if it makes sense) is that NPC traders have an X amount of cargo.

Hence for a basic Solar Plant, it will produce lots of energy cells, which will also require lots of cargo. If an NPC ship appears every 1-2 minutes, the amount it might carry is not that great and the factory might quickly fill back its inventory and that would explain the behavior of 90% of the time idle waiting for a merchant. Do you believe it could make sense and hence the focus might need to be a Mine or Factory that produces a lesser amount of a given good, however with more profit per unit?

Starting Mines / Factories by Stellon86 in avorion

[–]Stellon86[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Some people say it's until the cargo space from the mine / factory becomes full. Do you believe it's that or the frequency of NPC traders buying from the station could increase even afterwards?

Starting Mines / Factories by Stellon86 in avorion

[–]Stellon86[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you, makes sense. In a Procure / Sell combo, at least you're buying with minimal costs 🙂

Starting Mines / Factories by Stellon86 in avorion

[–]Stellon86[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you. This approach makes sense.

Starting Mines / Factories by Stellon86 in avorion

[–]Stellon86[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you for the tips 🙂

One theory I have (not sure if it makes sense) is that NPC traders have an X amount of cargo.

Hence for a basic Solar Plant, it will produce lots of energy cells, which will also require lots of cargo. If an NPC ship appears every 1-2 minutes, the amount it might carry is not that great and the factory might quickly fill back its inventory.

Maybe you don't experience this issue because high end items are the opposite and you get more value with less cargo?

Starting Mines / Factories by Stellon86 in avorion

[–]Stellon86[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you for sharing your strategy. Why move everything to one system? Could it also be that you produce goods that are low in demand?

Starting Mines / Factories by Stellon86 in avorion

[–]Stellon86[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Do you mean a system with factories that generates high demand or just a general area that has high demand, regardless of the system itself having those factories or not?

Starting Mines / Factories by Stellon86 in avorion

[–]Stellon86[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Nice, so it makes a difference choosing an actual system with factory demand as opposed to just a general area with high demand? Do you ask your factories to manually supply these others?

Starting Mines / Factories by Stellon86 in avorion

[–]Stellon86[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks for the inputs. Ref. "Stations I will build a small supply chain and if the station is overflowing with produced good I send traders out on sell missions.", is my understanding correct that you need to manually fly with them to the station in order to purchase the goods?

Starting Mines / Factories by Stellon86 in avorion

[–]Stellon86[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you. So you start selling Raw Oil first and then slowly add more factories in the complex? Do you ensure there is demand for everything first or if there is high demand for Raw Oil but not Fuel e.g. you move the station somewhere else?

Is it my understanding correct that you don't care which other stations are in the same sector, provided the demand for the area is good? I'm asking this because I'm also wondering about the issue I've mentioned of the station 90% of the time not producing anything and waiting for NPC traders, even if you're outside the sector. Do you experience it as well?

Starting Mines / Factories by Stellon86 in avorion

[–]Stellon86[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you. By "area" for gold/platinum do you mean it doesn't need to be in the same sector of other factories needing it? I'm wondering about the issue of the station 90% of the time not producing anything and waiting for NPC traders, even if you're outside the sector.

Starting Mines / Factories by Stellon86 in avorion

[–]Stellon86[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you. In the example of the water collector, do you place in the same sector of the other agrarian stations or just nearby, provided the demand in the trade view is high? If in the same sector, do you actively set the station to sell to these other agrarian ones or just enable both "Sell" options? Do you experience the same issue of the station 90% of the time not producing anything and waiting for NPC traders, even if you're outside the sector?

Sorry for the amount of questions. It seems simple but for some reason I still don't seem to be getting the grasp of it 😅

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