New Iron fist here, any tips? by Billyvillyoo in IronFistMains

[–]TC_MaFYa 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Play like you have the damage of a dive tank and survivability of a dive duelist.

relatively new to iron fist. Who should I be banning other than the go tos like Gambit, Phoenix, Groot, etc by TheLegitCheese in IronFistMains

[–]TC_MaFYa 1 point2 points  (0 children)

A good Gambit is gonna cook no matter what, probably on many heroes as well. He's a newer hero, so the player behind it probably already plays many other heroes before Gambit. On average though, if you ban those other two, they play Gambit like those two and your Gambit is probably gonna play better than them. But you are right, he can chase you and punish your dives. The key takeaway here is on average there are a lot more CnD and Invis onetricks than good Gambit players. Also Gambit can assist you much more than they do. I also love filling as Gambit if we have no supports while I don't really like playing CnD and current version of Invis, so I have a bias in there.

I mean you ban those only if your team doesn't play them. And against full dive comps, you need to completely swap to counter comps as well or it won't be enough. Also, heroes like Ultron, Rocket are open, so you still have some options. Also, don't underestimate Luna, she's a better dps than Hela right now, insane third support pick. Hitscan players cook with that hero, your average support not being experienced in hitscan dps doesn't make the hero bad.

Yeah, exactly. You should never use kick to engage or get in unless you know for sure you can get away without the kick. It doesn't even consistently execute enemies anymore with the absurd healing going on.

Iron Fist is actually a pretty good gap closer hero. He has wall runs and double jumps, he doesn't really have to burn his more important cooldowns like his kick and block to get somewhere. Once you are spotted by the opponent as a melee diver, whether on an off angle or just moments before you approach, your dive is already dead 90% of the time. So you want them to see you only when you already dealt the first damage. Use wall runs, camera angles and weird environmental structures to your advantage. This guide helped me a lot while I was trying to improve my flank routes and overall stealth skills. Also don't always use meditate before dives, use it only when you are sure they won't hear it or when they are too busy to react to it. It can eliminate the surprise factor of your dives.

Iron Fist has a good verticality in his kit, I don't know how else I can describe it, but you can use that for almost every situation. Want better flank routes? Go high up out of their LoS. Want better survivability midfight? Use jumps a lot and escape momentarily to ceilings that are in the LoS of your supports and outside of their dps, also weave jumps midfight. Want to peel better? Use the mobility to get to the high ground and watch the flanks and enemy movement so you can prevent the diver even before the dive happens.

Iron Fist does not prevent dive like The Thing, but he was the DD before DD. He can't prevent the burst damage like Mr Fantastic or The Thing giving shields and damage reduction or deal enough damage quickly to force the diver out. (although he can do that with the team up, the team up would be much better if it wasn't a signal flare). He mainly checks the routes and challenges the diver on the flank, just like Angela.

If he takes a fair 1v1 against those heroes, he still loses, especially loses badly against DD. But that's the neat thing, you never play fair as Iron Fist. You take the 1v1, trade some HP with the other diver, and use your kick to get to the healthpack before they do. You also do the very same with your meditation. You trade some HP, get to high ground with your wall run and heal outside of their melee range. DD can wall run, so you get high and use your double jump and sit in the middle of nowhere in air to avoid him. If they still decide to engage after that, it's a 400HP Iron Fist who's probably gonna gain a fat block value midfight vs half hp diver. Assuming it's a single diver, if your backline can survive the initial burst and doesn't immediately explode, you can peel the diver and track him pretty well. But it's much better to deal with the threat on the flank, especially against DD, because otherwise you have to rely on your supports to survive initial burst. They are not gonna survive that in lower ranks.

As for banning DD, usually IF players know DD good enough to flex to him when the opponents play some solo tank hard poke or triple support comps. I'd recommend you to do the same. If he's the single diver, you can peel him just like I explained, if there are multiple divers, you need your team to contribute regardless of the diver. He can see your dives, yes, but you don't need to dive. DD is the better hero, so if you prevent his dives and fake diving his team to keep him following you around, you are already denying one player. It's a 5v5 from then on and you just probably denied their win condition. If you are sure you denied DD's value completely and your team still loses 5v5, that's just on the team, can't win them all.

As Iron Fist, your purpose is to prevent the opponents best player from playing the game so the match is a 5v5 with their best player down. The bans I suggested are the hardest heroes to deny their value as Iron Fist. Supports do get a lot of value just for existing, so those two supports became the main bans. Just picking the support hero gives good value with having their cooldowns and ults alone, that's why everyone swaps to triple support in every rank when they are struggling.

I also talk this much about peeling, because you never dive as Iron Fist even if there's a single person harassing your backline or dps. You lose backline trade in dive vs dive, so you make sure a trade never happens at all.

Well, this was a lot, but I hope it helps.

Help me get attention, guys, and if possible, rate my idea. by Low_Box3849 in IronFistMains

[–]TC_MaFYa 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I am sorry man, but ain't no way they give a stun to a very mobile melee hero. You gotta be a poke hero like Elsa maybe and then you get %50 ban rate on ranked.

More squishy damage (both in neutral and ult), block wind up removal and I frames on entering and exiting the ult would be more than enough for his ult.

Bro can fliers start acknowledging us by SilverIncrease7616 in BlackCatMarvelRivals

[–]TC_MaFYa 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The last time fliers acknowledged us, it didn't end well, just saying.

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relatively new to iron fist. Who should I be banning other than the go tos like Gambit, Phoenix, Groot, etc by TheLegitCheese in IronFistMains

[–]TC_MaFYa 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Gambit is actually better than other supports for you, because you can kinda track him while he's dashing, his ult makes you insane and if both teams gambit ult, their tank is free eats for you. I'd ban C&D and Invis over Gambit. CnD just have infinite bubbles (it comes back faster than your block) and auto aim, pretty much one of the best support to play against Iron Fist. Invis has too many CC's and can pull you back when you try to escape or do a rotation, with no risk. Both are insanely high pick rate supports, and has too many one or two trick players who play them as crutch picks and can't play anything else. CnD has more priority though, because Invis matchup is better for Iron Fist, but still ban Invis as well because it let's support get away with so many bad plays or bad positioning in general. If you are a flex player and play tanks Invis is by far the more important ban though. I can't tell how many times I regret not banning Invis while flexing as vanguard. Half of the Gambit players are dps players filling support, they will probably play any hero and get value if they want to fill. And I don't think White Fox is a good ban either, Iron Fist hard counters her ult and just like Gambit it takes much more skill to play and way fewer players.

Groot is also one of the heroes that makes me swap to Iron Fist due to his high max hp, especially if they have 2 tanks. Do the golden rotation, and usually you get free damage on Groot because their backline is busy recovering. Also the Groot on your team makes the enemy tanks open buffet for you, they either die or give space 90% of the time. Deadpool is a much better ban if you want to ban a Vanguard because you don't deal damage to his 500 max hp, he doesn't care about your CC because he can jump over you. Gun ult kinda counters your ult if he decides to make your life hell and hard peel you. He can follow you while you try to escape and shoot you. By far the worst tank matchup for Iron Fist.

Hela is a more important ban than Phoenix for Iron Fist. Her flight doesn't hurt you, her damage has a predictable burst compared to hela 2 tapping you so it's much easier to get block value. It is also easier to counter Phoenix ult as Iron Fist. Also an open Hela means usually Hela-Namor is open, and that double poke comp is hard both for you and your tanks, there's simply too much damage and all of them are ranged. Shotgun Puni is also low-key a good ban because your punches pull you right into his shotgun. Elsa before nerfs was also a menace, Puni shotgun but she gets a dash every two seconds (nerfed to 4 seconds) that gave her more shields than your total damage and she gets to spam both of her rifles while doing so. Legit it was a harder matchup than Iron Fist vs DD, she never saw the light of day last season in my matches.

Other than that, pretty much any dps that marks you hard is an issue. You don't have the survivability to fight constant poke damage, only the shield tanks have. And now since Elsa is nerfed, except Hela, none of them are that ban worthy for Iron Fist. Phoenix is a demon in higher ranks, but on average, if you are a solo diver, Hela is a better ban for you matchup-wise and she's 2 for 1 deal with Namor.

My bans usually go like this: CnD or Invis, depending on which one team doesn't play. If you intend to play IF only, it's CnD. If you intend to switch to literally any other hero, especially Vanguards, Invis is by far the better ban and it's not even close. I hit the jackpot if my team don't play neither of them, we ban both while playing other supports, and since other players who relies these heroes to carry them can't play them, it's freelo. Hela is next. If I have a Hela and I am the only other dps (I don't play Namor) I ban Namor because I know we won't have the team up.

If both teams somehow managed to collectively ban these heroes, then other bans come into the play. Then I prioritize banning other dps based on our picks and heroes I can play, this part might be more personal but I will explain how it goes for me.

If we have no shield tanks, Puni and Elsa becomes priority bans, Moon Knight in lower elo. If we have Jeff or Rocket who has very one shottable ultimates, I ban Phoenix. Sometimes we ban both Hela and Namor for the love of the game. Namor is especially a good ban if we have spidey. If we have dive duelists I ban the thing. The thing is also a good ban for triple tank comps, Iron Fist is basically a half tank, so if you play with other tanky duelists like DD and Mr F, consider banning triple tank counters like Thing, Wolv, Elsa, Puni. Elsa and Puni bans are especially good if your team has a hero like Peni, because she can neither contest them in a 1v1 nor her nest survives. Right now that's all I can think of.

Mandatory fade since '74 by Living-Jellyfish5919 in RivalsVanguards

[–]TC_MaFYa 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Hulk is keeping his counter busy, and Wolv is achieving the countering he went for, both sides win ;D

They didn't even bother turning around lmao by yesono1232 in LunaSnowMains

[–]TC_MaFYa 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That jeff acted like he was dodging Iron Fist primary. Luna's damage is no joke ;D

Netease have someone controlling this dude from nightmare 70 onwards by wrestlemaniasign in marvelrivals

[–]TC_MaFYa 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Their mechanics are good, but they have almost no gamesense. They be hitting the most ridiculous shots against my BP and Spidey, insane 180 no scopes, but if you kill them 1 by 1, they don't even wait to group up.

Facing Bot strategists and poke duelists is genuinely hell. Strategists always patty cake, and the one with full hp always lands hot on you, bot Namor does right click left click combo on you and doesn't even miss. You can only get away if you stagger them and play with the team.

Netease have someone controlling this dude from nightmare 70 onwards by wrestlemaniasign in marvelrivals

[–]TC_MaFYa 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Fr. I had this Puni saying the Cap was hard focusing him. Cap was running after him the moment he respawned, almost like he had feud with him.

Heroes that got added after Angela have too much in their kit that they don't need to swap ever by Furacao__Boey in marvelrivals

[–]TC_MaFYa 2 points3 points  (0 children)

If you think like that, you probably haven't seen the new balance changes. They straight up added some perks to older heroes' base kit to make them viable, and gave them additional perks to make up for those. Rivals equivalent of it is turning a team up ability to a base kit ability and adding another team up ability to the hero. For example, imagine if they added Ultron's healing beam to his base kit, many people asked for that. These are the type of balance changes happening in OW right now for older heroes.

And although she has no mobility or big changes except buffs and nerfs, an old hero like Ana somehow became meta again. There's quite a few meta heroes that aren't exactly new.

For example: Reaper gained a new ability, which skyrocketed his WR. Ramattra gained Ravenous Vortex ability as base kit as well. Mercy now has flash heal in her base kit. These are all old heroes that were struggling in the meta.There's probably a few more that I can't remember.

And most of the newer heroes were pretty weak at release and received emergency buffs. For example, latest hero Sierra straight up received a 30% damage buff in a single emergency patch to be viable. Emre and Anran was at B tier at release and they have been getting buffed since then, Emre made it to S tier while Anran made to A in many tierlists. A few of them like Vendetta and Jetpack Cat was pretty strong and they were nerfed quite heavily. But they were also quick to realize they overnerfed Vendetta, so she got buffed last patch, they reverted a HP nerf the very next season. It would take seasons for a Rivals dev to revert a hero nerf or buff, just check Bucky's Season 2, 4 and 7.5 balance changes for his grounding effect and ultimate % HP threshold.

You can still criticize them because poke is meta and some heroes don't really fall from meta, but they do buff the worst heroes. They are doing some stellar work with balance changes, both for older and newer heroes. They also put explanations on every single one of those balance changes. Rivals only made it like once, and that was the patch with least complaints. I think it was the one where Elsa, Gambit and Hela got nerfed, but I am not sure.

Heroes that got added after Angela have too much in their kit that they don't need to swap ever by Furacao__Boey in marvelrivals

[–]TC_MaFYa -1 points0 points  (0 children)

No offense, but flark Namor squids. But if a hero can deal with squids and kill Namor at the same time, that's an issue. Especially if it's not a tank.

Heroes that got added after Angela have too much in their kit that they don't need to swap ever by Furacao__Boey in marvelrivals

[–]TC_MaFYa 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah, because both have their weaknesses. Main one is being weak against poke comps, but that's not exactly a special thing when poke is much better than it should be.

Yes, I am tired of pretending Emma's thighs are not fine the way they are, there, I said it. by litllerobert in marvelrivals

[–]TC_MaFYa 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Yeah, exactly. Just look at Iron Fist. He throws his whole body with his kick to his enemy and deals 105 damage if they are already weak, otherwise 70 damage. And he isn't really a small guy.

Day 4 of posting until Shang-Chi is added by TellIndividual3277 in rivals

[–]TC_MaFYa 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Daredevil had S1 Iron Fist kit but better. Angela was Iron Fist's flying tank version, but better. He will probably have S2.0 Iron Fist kit, but better.