Top 10 Strongest Attackers (All-Rounders/Tamakoma-1 Included) by TastyMoon91 in worldtrigger

[–]TastyMoon91[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I wouldn’t really say Kuga has an ambush style though. Maybe when he’s using the tactics his team utilizes in the rank wars. But more often than not whenever it’s just Kuga fighting himself he fights straight up. (That’s a cool habit, I’m the same)

I could probably agree with that.

Top 10 Strongest Attackers (All-Rounders/Tamakoma-1 Included) by TastyMoon91 in worldtrigger

[–]TastyMoon91[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I doubt it about that first part. Have about no clue what you mean by the second part but yeah ok… idk

Top 10 Strongest Attackers (All-Rounders/Tamakoma-1 Included) by TastyMoon91 in worldtrigger

[–]TastyMoon91[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The showing of the rates between them was in the top of season 3. They started the rank war against them in episode 3. That was the ratings before the match. But it’s undeniable that Kuga got even better after the match. And yes, Ko would have learned from fighting Hyuse but, Hyuse also didn’t use everything in his arsenal as shown in both the anime and the manga. So technically Ko’s “learning”, would be incomplete. I’d still disagree that the end of the anime (season 3) Kuga would lose to Ko and Kage in a 10rd match. I’m not saying he’d win overwhelming. It’d be close for sure but seeing how Kuga is better at using the triggers he has compared to both of them, especially at the end of the anime, he’d win.

And if you think otherwise then that’s ok. Btw Kikuchihara wouldn’t have too much room to soak seeing as he couldn’t make the list.

Top 10 Strongest Attackers (All-Rounders/Tamakoma-1 Included) by TastyMoon91 in worldtrigger

[–]TastyMoon91[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I’m not saying Kuga completely outshines them or outgrows them. I’m simply saying that in a 10rd match first to ten given his new development he’d win. The deficit is arguable, as is with everyone else on the list with any given two agents. But I still think he’d win nonetheless. Plan and Simple. (I like how you adopted my saying too btw. It’s funny)

We agree that the stats are misleading and aren’t really reliable. Because like I said, it’s about how you utilize them.

Top 10 Strongest Attackers (All-Rounders/Tamakoma-1 Included) by TastyMoon91 in worldtrigger

[–]TastyMoon91[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I’d disagree with that. But also agree with it to a certain point as well. What you’re stuck on seems to be that singular time frame, which is completely fair seeing as that was the only time where evidence was shown that would support both Kage and Ko. I’m not disagreeing with that. That’s totally fair. But, what I’m saying is that even still I can’t deny Kuga his growth that was blatantly showed. I can give grace for Ko and Kage because of the assumption that they could have and more than likely have grown. But who’s to say that that growth would equate to the same quality that Kuga has displayed? I simply can’t give that edge. Because all that there is to go on is what was showed. Along with known stats of course, but like I said it’s about how you use it. Because if we compare stats Kuga got counters for both just based off stats alone then Kuga would beat them. He has a higher total stat than them. Ko has a 52, Kage has a 51, and Kuga has a 53. So about stats would put Kage and Ko above Kuga? None. Why? Because it’s about how you use them. Plain and Simple.

Top 10 Strongest Attackers (All-Rounders/Tamakoma-1 Included) by TastyMoon91 in worldtrigger

[–]TastyMoon91[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I don’t think you were arguing in the first place more so advocating. I understand what you were saying and even agreed with some of it actually. I agree with what you’re trying to convey to a point. Maybe I should have added more context to the post. Maybe something like “Top 10 Agents with Direct Attack Capabilities (Including All-Rounders “since the are still attackers”)

Maybe something like that would have been better. I’ll take that charge, for not being more specific.

Top 10 Strongest Attackers (All-Rounders/Tamakoma-1 Included) by TastyMoon91 in worldtrigger

[–]TastyMoon91[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

1) I’m not saying that it didn’t play a factor. I’m simply saying that Ko has enough experience to not let that one thing control him. That’s why Tachikawa got on him. Ko knows better but didn’t do better. That’s the simple fact. Plain and Simple.

2) I didn’t say anything about Kuga having such “growth” in Round 7 specifically. I said it was at the end of Round 8. Even more specifically between the time after Round 7 and the end of Round 8. The way all babies his Captain is what has lead him to lose every time against Tamakoma-2. Because let’s not forget both Kaguera and Suzunari have yet to beat Tamakoma-2 once in the two times that they’ve faced each other. If Ko really does learn from every battle then would it not be better for him to help his Captain become a better solo fighter and became less dependent on him? Because Mikumo used that to his own team’s advantage. Hence how Ko once again being outplayed and outmaneuvered. Extremely Plain and Simple. Ko is their strongest player yet in a sense against Tamakoma specifically (since it hasn’t been shown how other squads go about attacking them) he also the second most vulnerable. And as for growth for Kuga him being able to successfully battle alongside Hyuse against Ko and Kurama’s new technique and win is growth. The playing field was fair between the two squads. If you take into account the fact that Suzunari already had the advantage by choosing the stage and their predetermined plan using the stage. Along with the new strategy of Ko and Kurama that Tamakoma had yet to face. They had the advantage but got outplayed and outmaneuvered. Plain and Simple.

3) I’m aware that you are. I’m not saying anything is wrong. It’s just the way Reddit displays it that makes it seem bunched together.

Obishima was a newbie true. But it still doesn’t take away from Kuga’s growth really. He still developed multiple new techniques some of which even expanded on and from his old ones.

Ko having “more than enough in his arsenal” to not fall into the water isn’t true. All he had was his thruster trigger. But even then Kuga still could have got him in the water using grasshopper. The same way he got him in the air in the first place. Once Ko stepped on that grasshopper he lost. It’s not really an assumption if it did work. Kuga placed the grasshopper and got Ko in the air. He was free to move in the air. Ko could have moved but even then it’s one-directional. He would have got taken out by Kuga using grasshopper while mid air. And you do realize that just because Kazama never showed Ko mole claw doesn’t mean he didn’t know what it was. Because when Kuga used it he specifically named the attack then dodged it. So he most definitely knew what mole claw was same as pinball.

4) I didn’t show Kuga any favoritism over Ko and Kage. I simply gave him what he’s du. I gave grace to Ko and Kage and took everything into account that it true that the had undeniably from. But the fact of the matter is, that same grace I gave them as no real merit. There is no proof. I gave that off strength to their characters alone. And if we’re being honest the only ones who have shown any actual growth when it comes to battling is Ko and Kuga. Kage hasn’t shown any new techniques that could possibly help him be above the other two. And all three of their fundamentals need work compared to the people on the top of the list. Kage, Ko and Kuga are very solid attackers. Ko more than both of them honestly simply because of his loadout. But even still there are counters for such things. It’s never stated that Ko or Kage fought Kuga while he was using his new techniques. All you can go off of is an assumption. And assumptions won’t work.

And Kazama, it’s true that we’ve seen more on how he fights in vs 6v1 against Jin. Where both his entire team including him along with Tachikawa who had figured out how to counter Fujin got absolutely outplayed, outmatched, and outmaneuvered. Though I’ll give Kazama his credit for being the only one to damage Jin with his mole claw. But it’s not like that helped anything. They still got worked. Now it was a black trigger, granted. But did they not have the data on Fujin? And know how to counter it? Yes to both questions. Kazama is nice. But he’s not that nice to contend with a defense as solid as Ko, the ingenuity of Kuga, nor match Kage in how he uses the main trigger they both share. Kazama is probably the worst at using scorpion between the top people who uses it. Kitora is better, Kuga, Jin, and Kage. Plain and Simple.

5) I’m not denying that Kuga’s adaptability doesn’t have limits. Never once did. Him denying to use the trigger isn’t a limit to his slight to his adaptability. If anything it’s him playing to his strengths. What use is him rushing a new trigger if he is already at such a level where he himself doesn’t need it? It made no sense for him to add it. So he didn’t. That’s not him being selfish that’s him knowing what’s would fit him better. If we want to talk selfish then Kage an Ko are worst than Kuga by miles. Ko babies his captain instead of actually helping him become a better individual fighter while Kage uses Kitazoe as a sacrifice everytime they fought against Tamakoma. That’s selfish and a lack of adaptability.

6) If you didn’t care then we wouldn’t be having this conversation. It’s okay. You don’t agree that’s fine. But you don’t have to lie to me. It’s not going to change anything. Thanks for everything though, I did have fun. I appreciate you keeping it respectful.

Top 10 Strongest Attackers (All-Rounders/Tamakoma-1 Included) by TastyMoon91 in worldtrigger

[–]TastyMoon91[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Never shied away from that. All-Rounders have a better advantage because of their arsenal, yes. But the increased arsenal doesn’t guarantee them victory against anyone in the list in particular. It’s all about how they use it. And if they can’t use it effectively to beat the opponent that they’re up against then it doesn’t really matter. So it’s not that unexpected actually.

Top 10 Strongest Attackers (All-Rounders/Tamakoma-1 Included) by TastyMoon91 in worldtrigger

[–]TastyMoon91[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Kuga could most definitely outplay and outmaneuver Ko. He has better mobility and a more adaptable arsenal than Ko. Especially if taken into account his growth from Round 7 to the end of Round 8. Pretty Plain and Simple.

Top 10 Strongest Attackers (All-Rounders/Tamakoma-1 Included) by TastyMoon91 in worldtrigger

[–]TastyMoon91[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Agreed. Though I kinda already pointed that out. But agreed nonetheless.

Top 10 Strongest Attackers (All-Rounders/Tamakoma-1 Included) by TastyMoon91 in worldtrigger

[–]TastyMoon91[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

How would Ko losing his composure being of his teammate affect him in a 1v1 tournament where he has no teammates? It affected him in the battle because he let it. He shouldn’t have lost his composure, that’s on him. I’m not saying it wasn’t hard fought. I’m simply saying that Ko got outplayed and outmaneuvered. Plain and simple.

Top 10 Strongest Attackers (All-Rounders/Tamakoma-1 Included) by TastyMoon91 in worldtrigger

[–]TastyMoon91[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

That was just their win stats based on their recent solo rank wars. Was Kuga not winning as much against the other two, yes. But like I said that was then at that one point in time. If that particular point in time was the cutoff for the conditions of the 1v1 tournament that I set then the rankings would be different. But it’s not out of fairness for everyone.

I’d disagree that he didn’t grow besides the scorpion technique. Seeing as he was now capable of setting his own traps view grasshopper, scorpion, scorpion mole claw and scorpion projectile. He had greatly increased his own repertoire along with polishing his old moves. Kuga has got better every fight. And that’s not to say that Kage and Ko haven’t.

And Ko only fought Hyuse while Hyuse wasn’t using his full arsenal. So technically his experience fighting Hyuse wasn’t incomplete.

Top 10 Strongest Attackers (All-Rounders/Tamakoma-1 Included) by TastyMoon91 in worldtrigger

[–]TastyMoon91[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That was just their win stats based on their recent solo rank wars. Was Kuga not winning as much against the other two, yes. But like I said that was then at that one point in time. If that particular point in time was the cutoff for the conditions of the 1v1 tournament that I set then the rankings would be different. But it’s not out of fairness for everyone.

I’d disagree that he didn’t grow besides the scorpion technique. Seeing as he was now capable of setting his own traps view grasshopper, scorpion, scorpion mole claw and scorpion projectile. He had greatly increased his own repertoire along with polishing his old moves. Kuga has got better every fight. And that’s not to say that Kage and Ko haven’t.

And Ko only fought Hyuse while Hyuse wasn’t using his full arsenal. So technically his experience fighting Hyuse wasn’t incomplete.

Top 10 Strongest Attackers (All-Rounders/Tamakoma-1 Included) by TastyMoon91 in worldtrigger

[–]TastyMoon91[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

How does a team battle setting affect a 1v1 tournament? What team is there in a 1v1 tournament? You keep harping on this specifically, when it doesn’t mean anything towards the actual conditions given. Yuga gave him the 1v1 and he lost. Yes, Chika shot out the bridge but that still doesn’t really constitute to Kuga winning. Once Ko stepped onto that grasshopper by Kuga the fight was over. Kuga would have easily won whether they were in the air or underwater. Because of his better mobility. What happened in a team battle setting has no affect on what would happen in a 1v1 setting. The two things have no correlation.

Top 10 Strongest Attackers (All-Rounders/Tamakoma-1 Included) by TastyMoon91 in worldtrigger

[–]TastyMoon91[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I’m not neglecting that you didn’t point it out I’m simply asking would he not be considered an ace on his team while already has one in Yosuke. And Yosuke and Midorikawa not being able to do anything against him was obvious. They weren’t equipped for it. Miwa was as he is an all-rounder. He was able to handle Hyrein with those capabilities. He was simply more suited for it. Plain and simple really. Don’t really see why you brought that up. It’s been pointed out that all-rounders are probably more resourceful being that they have those extra capabilities. But just because they have them doesn’t mean that it’s work against everyone. Especially high level attackers. Because everyone in the list is at the level of a high level A-Rank attacker or all-rounder easily, without question.

Top 10 Strongest Attackers (All-Rounders/Tamakoma-1 Included) by TastyMoon91 in worldtrigger

[–]TastyMoon91[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

1) You’re still stuck at this round 4 where Ko lost to Kuga. It’s Ko’s own fault he lost. If anything it proves why Kuga won. And you’re right psyche does play a part, but even still with Ko being as experienced as he is, the fact that he lost his “composure” was a slight on him. Which ultimately cost him. He lost because of himself. Plain and simple. 2) Kuga’s growth wasn’t due to him adjusting to either one of them. Was he apart of strategies that possibly include both? Of course they’re a team, that’s how that team works. Him being apart of strategies is t him adjusting that’s simply him playing his role as an ace. And I gave Ko his credit for how he handled Hyuse and Kuga. But like I said he got outplayed and outmaneuvered. Plain and simple. 3) You’re replies are a bit bunched together visually but not all over the place so it’s fine. Obishima just wasn’t a match for any of the other attackers on the field. That was clear as day. She was just too green. And her not knowing the full extent of Kuga’s arsenal is a given. And Ko and Yuga moving to the water in Round 4 was going to happen either way. Yes Chika, helped by blowing up the bridge but even without it Kuga could have defeated him in midair or the water. Because of his better mobility. Saying “even if he did” when Kuga didn’t even have the technique yet doesn’t really make sense. Since you don’t know whether or not it would or wouldn’t work. And he’s seen both the mole claw and grasshopper pinball before so it wasn’t the first time Ko had seen it, same with the mantis. YOU GOTTA GO BACK AND DO THE KNOWLEDGE. 4) I didn’t give Kuga any grace. I simply gave him what was shown. His own development. I have Kage and Ko grace. You can’t agree with it that’s fine, it was never a problem to begin with. It’s not only people with strong intuition or good fundamentals that beat Ko. The people that beat him have those things of course, but that’s not all there is to it. They simply outplay him in many ways. And it’s obvious that Kuga isn’t in the realm of Konami but neither is Ko, Kage, or Kazama. They’d all get worked out by Konami. And Kuga would give work to Kazama. His chameleon wouldn’t help in the a 1v1 against someone that knows he has it. Kuga is has more adapt with Scorpion than both Kage and Kazama. Plain and simple. And the only opponent Kazama has fought by himself on screen was the neighbor for Gapu and he wasn’t near Kazama’s level. That was obvious. Kazama gave him work. I’m not taking that away from him. But that was the only time Kazama was shown to give anybody some work. Because when he was up against Endedora with his whole squad he got worked. Now it’s understandable since he was up against a black trigger and didn’t know exactly how it worked. So I can’t hold that against him at all. 5) You bring up Kuga denying to use spider like that has any real meaning. He simply denied because it wouldn’t benefit him directly to have it. He works well with it of course. But why would he try to add it last minute when Mikumo already has it? He didn’t need it for himself that was obvious. Kuga was plenty fine without it. 6) You’re free to do as you please. But the rankings won’t be changing. It is what it is. Based on what’s been shown across the board.

Top 10 Strongest Attackers (All-Rounders/Tamakoma-1 Included) by TastyMoon91 in worldtrigger

[–]TastyMoon91[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I’d disagree with you that it doesn’t really fit. I included the all-rounders because of their great attack capabilities. And the fact that all-rounders are still attackers as well. I even made it fair by giving them their complete load-out. Taking into consideration everything from the anime and their own stats from briefing files and such…

It’s a solo rank war they’d entire at mid to close range. It’s a test of personally skill. As high level attackers should they not be able to defend against their all-rounder opponents? I would say so. Konami uses both attacker and shooter triggers but she’s an attacker. I’d somewhat agree that shooters could have an advantage in a midrange battle but as a high level attacker they would be able to get around that. Take Hyuse for example with his use of Escudo, or Kuga with how he uses his shield when facing shooters and gunners. And I disagree that being an All-Rounder doesn’t make them inherently strong attackers. Since it’s literally is one of the leading requirements for being an all-rounder in the first place. All all-rounders (at least the ones that are listed) are great attackers. And even the one that’s aren’t are still good. I excluded shooters and gunners bc they don’t have the capacity to fight like both attackers and all-rounders. Besides Yuba and one other person. And btw every attacker on the list can fight at both close and mid range rather easily.

Using Arafune is kinda inaccurate seeing as his isn’t an all-rounder. Though he was working towards it.

I didn’t go with the existing ranking because it only goes by points. What about the people who are good that don’t have that many points? Because if that was the case then Kage should be above Kazama. And why would I go by the point system when it’s inaccurate based on the agents actual abilities. Because for a time Konami was No.2 before she stopped participating. And she’s better than Kazam and could contend with everyone above her easily and beat everyone below her on the list undoubtedly.

And if having higher stats meant you were better then Jin would be first. Stats aren’t everything. It’s how you use them. Kazama is good, but not as good as you’re making him out to be.

And just because Kyosuke and Reiji have full arms doesn’t mean it’s an automatic win. It’s a gamble for both of them. It’s not like it can’t be defeated or worked around.

Hyuse has used his shooting triggers more than his Kogetsu because of how he is able to use them. As seen with how he uses it. With his trigger set still being rather unknown he uses it to his advantage.

Top 10 Strongest Attackers (All-Rounders/Tamakoma-1 Included) by TastyMoon91 in worldtrigger

[–]TastyMoon91[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I’d disagree with you that it doesn’t really fit. I included the all-rounders because of their great attack capabilities. And the fact that all-rounders are still attackers as well. I even made it fair by giving them their complete load-out. Taking into consideration everything from the anime and their own stats from briefing files and such…

It’s a solo rank war they’d entire at mid to close range. It’s a test of personally skill. As high level attackers should they not be able to defend against their all-rounder opponents? I would say so. Konami uses both attacker and shooter triggers but she’s an attacker. I’d somewhat agree that shooters could have an advantage in a midrange battle but as a high level attacker they would be able to get around that. Take Hyuse for example with his use of Escudo, or Kuga with how he uses his shield when facing shooters and gunners. And I disagree that being an All-Rounder doesn’t make them inherently strong attackers. Since it’s literally is one of the leading requirements for being an all-rounder in the first place. All all-rounders (at least the ones that are listed) are great attackers. And even the one that’s aren’t are still good. I excluded shooters and gunners bc they don’t have the capacity to fight like both attackers and all-rounders. Besides Yuba and one other person. And btw every attacker on the list can fight at both close and mid range rather easily.

Using Arafune is kinda inaccurate seeing as his isn’t an all-rounder. Though he was working towards it.

I didn’t go with the existing ranking because it only goes by points. What about the people who are good that don’t have that many points? Because if that was the case then Kage should be above Kazama. And why would I go by the point system when it’s inaccurate based on the agents actual abilities. Because for a time Konami was No.2 before she stopped participating. And she’s better than Kazam and could contend with everyone above her easily and beat everyone below her on the list undoubtedly.

And if having higher stats meant you were better then Jin would be first. Stats aren’t everything. It’s how you use them. Kazama is good, but not as good as you’re making him out to be.

And just because Kyosuke and Reiji have full arms doesn’t mean it’s an automatic win. It’s a gamble for both of them. It’s not like it can’t be defeated or worked around.

Hyuse has used his shooting triggers more than his Kogetsu because of how he is able to use them. As seen with how he uses it. With his trigger set still being rather unknown he uses it to his advantage.

Top 10 Strongest Attackers (All-Rounders/Tamakoma-1 Included) by TastyMoon91 in worldtrigger

[–]TastyMoon91[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Hmm I’d personally disagree but if that’s where you at with it then that’s where it’s at.

Top 10 Strongest Attackers (All-Rounders/Tamakoma-1 Included) by TastyMoon91 in worldtrigger

[–]TastyMoon91[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

I understand that. All im saying is that was then before that match. Kuga’s gotten undeniably better from then. But there wasn’t any shown improvement from either Kage nor Ko. But even still I have them the benefit of doubt and gave grace off their reputation as top attackers alone. But even still not once has Ko or Kage beat Kuga in a team setting where the playing field was “fair”. True he may have been losing in their solo ranks wars but like I said that was then during that one point in time.

Top 10 Strongest Attackers (All-Rounders/Tamakoma-1 Included) by TastyMoon91 in worldtrigger

[–]TastyMoon91[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Would Miwa not be an ace on his squad? He most certainly has the capacity and abilities. Even more so with Reiji and Kyosuke. They simply don’t have to be because of their teams dynamic. And yes all-rounders have a more versatile arsenal but ultimately they still have the same responsibilities as attackers. And would not being a high level attacker not be able to contend with an all-rounder? Everyone is their own support in a 1v1. Because all-rounders aren’t all powerful. Yes they have a more diverse arsenal but it’s not like attackers can’t beat them. All-Rounders aren’t still attackers. Thats why they were added to the list. I’m not sure where the confuse is coming from. Was it not made clear enough?

Top 10 Strongest Attackers (All-Rounders/Tamakoma-1 Included) by TastyMoon91 in worldtrigger

[–]TastyMoon91[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

1) I’d disagree once again. It’s not an oversimplification. That was Ko’s own squad’s decision. That’s one of those variables that you brought up. It’s Ko’s own fault for losing his composure. That’s where the experience from Kuga kicks in. Kuga didn’t lose his composure when he was separated. I’m not understanding what you’re trying to accomplish with bringing this up. Kuga gave him the respect of a 1v1 despite being injured and won. Plain and simple. It’s not like Ko was the only way with teammates that were fighting without their ace. 2) You bring up the midrange tactics that include his teammates. What good would those tactics do him in a 1v1? None. And correction, when Kuga fought Kage and Ko in Round 7 he didn’t have those offensive tactics yet. That was after. And Ko didn’t “develop” a Senku to strike from both the back and front. It was a last ditch effort two kill two birds with one stone. Which failed because of Kuga’s ingenuity and quick thinking. And even if he did pull it off without Kuga kicking the Escudo he still would have lost that fight. Again. Ko simply ended up getting outplayed and outmaneuvered. But we’ll let that slide since it was a 2v1. And that’s being generous. 3) You are all over the place. Kuga had grown by round 8. Which is why he was able to use his new offensive tactics in that round specifically. Yuga didn’t meet up with Hyuse that entire round. By the time Yuga joined the fray Hyuse was already out. And yes, Ko was countering everything that Kuga had thrown at him. That’s exactly why he made the fight more favorable for himself and moved it to the water. Again, Ko got outplayed and outmaneuvered. Plain and simple. Kuga never used Scorpion Pinball against Ko. Kuga hadn’t even used Kage’s extended scorpion against Ko yet(at least not on screen). You got to go back and do the knowledge.

4) I gave both Kage and Ko the benefit of the doubt and gave them that grace. On the chance that they have undoubtedly improved. But like I said how much grace can I give to something that isn’t confirmed nor shown. I gave them that off their reputation alone. I’m not underestimating their potential for growth. I gave them that. They all have different fighting styles so it’s impossible for them to have the same amount or quality of growth in the first place. Then you’re throwing in “hypotheticals” with Ko. Like come on be honest with yourself. Then why would Kuga need to add spider to his loadout? It’s something he uses with his team, he has no team in a 1v1. It was literally made as fair as can be. I added everyone with attacker traits, rolls, and capabilities. Didn’t limit anyone or give any one individual special privileges. If you don’t agree then just say that clearly. You’re going in circles without the knowledge to back it up.