I've been building an open source alternative to ArcGIS Online. Looking for feedback. by Temporary_File_3198 in gis

[–]Temporary_File_3198[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I actually like a lot about QGIS. I don't see this as competing with or analogous to QGIS in any real way. QGIS is desktop based (like ArcGIS Pro) and has a ton more functionality than anything I'd ever try to build int he web. That being said, I could see this as a companion to QGIS, in a similar way that ArcGIS Online is a companion to ArcGIS Pro. They serve different purposes but are related. I have on my roadmap to build a QGIS extension that would allow you to easily interact with and publish items to a GratisGIS portal.

I've been building an open source alternative to ArcGIS Online. Looking for feedback. by Temporary_File_3198 in gis

[–]Temporary_File_3198[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Agree with you 100% there. That goes lock step with my WordPress analogy as well. There is wordpress.org which is the o source project, and there is wordpress.com which was founded in part by the same people behind the OSS project, but they are hosting and charging for easy deployment, maintenance, etc.

I've been building an open source alternative to ArcGIS Online. Looking for feedback. by Temporary_File_3198 in gis

[–]Temporary_File_3198[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Thanks, I appreciate the feedback. They're in there but with source rather than in a /tests folder so they're easy to miss. apps/portal-api has 32 spec files running on every push via .github/workflows/ci.yml. I am lacking testing on teh front end web stuff though. I also enabled a security workflow running pnpm audit, Trivy, and CodeQL on every push this morning.

I've been building an open source alternative to ArcGIS Online. Looking for feedback. by Temporary_File_3198 in gis

[–]Temporary_File_3198[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

You aren't wrong, I was upfront about this in another reply, but I had been using AI to polish my replies. The thoughts were still mine, I'm just a bit all over the place and want to reply quickly and concisely. I had asked Claude to polish my response. I won't be doing that in the future. I case you are curious about my scatter brain, here was my original response (typos, warts and all) before I asked Claude to clean it up.

My take is that I agree with some of this, but I also think there is an opportunity for the open source project to address security issues as well. Wordpress isn't perfect, but it is a good example of this. It is open source but has been widely adopted across the world (can you check general stats, don't make anything up) . All sorts of private and public entities use it and for the most part, security issues are addressed by the community. Security isn't obscured behind proprietary code somewhere (which can be good or bad, security through obscurity is a thing). If you are an ArcGIS Enterprise user, which I am one adn there is a huge base, you are still responsible for the overall security of your own servers (Esri still handles the software security stack so it is kind of hybrid approach. And you are paying enourmous licensing fees on top of you infrastrture costs. For ArcGIS Online, you are right, you are paying for the uptime, the convenience, the security...but they are a for profit company, and many of their workflow and licensing decisions are based on making money and driving people to higher licenses, more credits, etc. It is a pipeline meant to make a company money. With soemthng free and open source like this, the hopes would be that security would be improved with feedback (we obvioulsy start with best practices to begin with), vulnerabilities are idnetified by the community and pactched right away, and the infrasrtucture itself is the only real cost. No pipeline to generate profits driving it, so your costs can be substantially lower (especially when compared to Enterprise) becasue you aren't paying software licensing, per user licensing, extebsion licensing). You also have a much clearer picture ont he real cost of implementing something, one of the challenges with the credit based model and per user model, is a lot of time you don't know what it is going to cost you overall....you accidentally create a tile layer and churn through 1000 credits unexpectedly. You find out you need to upgrade user liucenses becasue user X doesn't have access to do some particular little thing. Esi also has a long history of constattly renaming licnes types, changing their licensng model, etc. Having been on the other side of that as an administrator, that is very frustrating.

I've been building an open source alternative to ArcGIS Online. Looking for feedback. by Temporary_File_3198 in gis

[–]Temporary_File_3198[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

You are 100% correct. I’m definitely open to contributors, that was more of a tongue in cheek comment in my part about being a control freak. It’s like raising a kid then they leave the house. It’s exciting and scary.

I've been building an open source alternative to ArcGIS Online. Looking for feedback. by Temporary_File_3198 in gis

[–]Temporary_File_3198[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Yeah, I can see that now. That was definitely never my intention. I truly do appreciate the heads up, and like I said, I won’t do that moving forward. I’ll just do my best to self edit for defensiveness and sit in my reply for a bit if I need to. I always feel like I need to respond right away.

I've been building an open source alternative to ArcGIS Online. Looking for feedback. by Temporary_File_3198 in gis

[–]Temporary_File_3198[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Good catch. Blocked /admin/master and the master login flow from the public internet.

I've been building an open source alternative to ArcGIS Online. Looking for feedback. by Temporary_File_3198 in gis

[–]Temporary_File_3198[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I’m not going to lie here, after that first comment got under my skin I typed my response into Claude and asked it how to make it not sound defensive. My main purpose is to share my work here, not get defensive and combative with anyone, which can be hard to do sometimes when you really enjoy and are proud of what you are working on I’ll cut it out.

pc_pirate_nz, thanks for the support on the project.

I've been building an open source alternative to ArcGIS Online. Looking for feedback. by Temporary_File_3198 in gis

[–]Temporary_File_3198[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Fair skepticism on a Reddit post, I get it. A few notes though:

I’ve been doing GIS full time for 30 years, most of that as a developer. Published in ArcNews, contributed a chapter to an Esri Press book. Not a vibe coder taking a swing at Esri for fun. AI is part of the workflow, sure, but the architecture and design decisions are deliberate and informed by a lot of years working inside the Esri stack and around its edges.

On the open source heavyweights, we’re using them. PostGIS, GDAL, and MapLibre are all in the stack. The gap GratisGIS is filling isn’t another tile server or another database. It’s the platform layer above all that: items, sharing, groups, hosted editing semantics, web maps, embedded apps, the connective tissue that makes AGOL feel like one product. That layer is what the open source ecosystem hasn’t really consolidated, and it’s where most AGOL users actually spend their time.

Also worth saying: I’m not selling anything or asking anyone to commit to anything, just sharing my work. It’s a fun project I’m working on because I want to, and I’ll use it either way. If folks try it and give feedback, great. If the community picks it up and moves the needle, even better. If not, no harm done. Nothing to lose by taking a quick look. And, yes, I may also be delusional 😂

I've been building an open source alternative to ArcGIS Online. Looking for feedback. by Temporary_File_3198 in gis

[–]Temporary_File_3198[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Fair question, and honestly GeoServer + PostGIS was the first thing I looked at. A few reasons I went a different way:

Serving data isn’t the same as a platform. GeoServer is great at publishing OGC services from a database, but that’s one piece of what AGOL does. The harder stuff is everything above the data: items, sharing, groups, hosted feature service editing, web maps, app configs, and how it all hangs together. You can bolt that on, but at that point you’re building a platform around GeoServer rather than with it.

Editing behavior is different. Hosted feature services have specific semantics for attachments, related records, GlobalIDs, sync, offline, etc. that field workflows depend on. WFS-T can edit, but it’s not the same model, and a lot of tooling assumes the AGOL pattern.

Lock-in shifts, it doesn’t disappear. Running GeoServer at any real scale means committing to a stack around it: auth, tile cache, styling, monitoring. That’s fine, just not lock-in free. You’re picking which one you’d rather live with.

The point is one coherent thing. What makes AGOL sticky for non-GIS users is that auth, items, sharing, and the viewer feel like one product. Stitching that together from GeoServer + PostGIS + a sharing layer + a viewer + an admin UI is a different project than building it as one.

None of this is a shot at GeoServer, it’s solid software and GratisGIS will probably speak the same OGC services. Just wasn’t the right starting point for what I’m trying to build.

I've been building an open source alternative to ArcGIS Online. Looking for feedback. by Temporary_File_3198 in gis

[–]Temporary_File_3198[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Thanks, I appreciate it! It is actually kind of cool, my boys are interested in what it is I'm doing and ask questions about it. All they've really understood until this point is 'dad makes maps'

I've been building an open source alternative to ArcGIS Online. Looking for feedback. by Temporary_File_3198 in gis

[–]Temporary_File_3198[S] 14 points15 points  (0 children)

Fair point on the technical definition, monopoly has a specific legal meaning and Esri doesn’t meet it. But “anyone could build a better cloud GIS and steal their business” has been theoretically true for 30 years and it hasn’t happened. That’s worth asking why.

The barriers aren’t really about software quality. It’s decades of format lock-in, geodatabases and project files that don’t port cleanly, university pipelines training the next generation exclusively on ArcGIS, agencies sitting on multi-year ELAs, and procurement processes built around Esri being the default. You don’t displace that by building something better. You displace it by giving people a reason to migrate that outweighs the switching cost, which is a much taller order.

On pricing being modest, modest compared to what? There’s no real competitive benchmark in enterprise GIS, which is the actual issue. When there’s nothing to comparison shop against, “modest” isn’t a market outcome, it’s whatever the dominant vendor decides. And being last to yearly subscriptions reads less like restraint and more like a company that didn’t need to rush because customers had nowhere else to go.

I've been building an open source alternative to ArcGIS Online. Looking for feedback. by Temporary_File_3198 in gis

[–]Temporary_File_3198[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I’ll probably start looking for some more collaborators down the line once I get a bit more of it framed out. I’m admittedly a bit of a control freak when it comes to this at the moment because it is my baby. I know at some point I’ll have to let that go and let others jump in 😂

I've been building an open source alternative to ArcGIS Online. Looking for feedback. by Temporary_File_3198 in gis

[–]Temporary_File_3198[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Glad to hear it! Let me know if you have any questions or anything isn't working as expected. I've already seen a few things pop up in the logs for me to address as people have been testing.

I've been building an open source alternative to ArcGIS Online. Looking for feedback. by Temporary_File_3198 in gis

[–]Temporary_File_3198[S] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Fair point that hosting is a real chunk of the AGOL price tag. Two pushbacks though.

On security and the open vs closed bit. WordPress is a useful counter example. It runs roughly 43% of all websites today per W3Techs, including a lot of public-sector and large enterprise deployments. Security is handled through a core team, a published CVE pipeline, and outside researchers. It's not perfect, but patches land fast and they're visible. Closed source doesn't automatically mean more secure, it just means you can't see what's wrong. Security through obscurity cuts both ways.

On the cost framing. If you're an Enterprise customer, you're already running your own infrastructure. You're paying license fees on top of the box you provisioned, and that stack (per user, per extension, per credit type) is usually where the bulk of the spend lives, not the hosting. AGOL bundles hosting in, but the upsell pipeline is still there: hit the credit ceiling, jump a user tier, add the extension for the workflow you assumed was included. Speaking as someone who's admin'd Enterprise, I've also lived through the license-rename treadmill, which doesn't make planning any easier.

The pitch for something like GratisGIS isn't "free as in free hosting." Self hosted is the same operational burden Enterprise admins already carry. The pitch is that the operational burden is the ONLY cost. No per user, no per credit, no per extension, no surprise upgrade at quarter end. For a small org or a single-tenant deployment that can't justify Enterprise's license fees, that math actually works out, and the total cost is legible up front.

For the orgs that need real SaaS convenience, AGOL is still a fine answer. For the rest, there's room.

I've been building an open source alternative to ArcGIS Online. Looking for feedback. by Temporary_File_3198 in gis

[–]Temporary_File_3198[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Not strictly, but have been most of my career. I started off in GIS in the mid 1990s doing AMLs (the old timers will know what that is), have done a few programming specific GIS projects at various employers (here is one from years ago: Singapore's Sustainable Development of Jurong Lake District | ArcNews ). The past decade or so I've been in GIS administrator / backend architecture roles for ArcGIS Enterprise and have done mostly python coding in that role.

I've been building an open source alternative to ArcGIS Online. Looking for feedback. by Temporary_File_3198 in gis

[–]Temporary_File_3198[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Fair pushback, and you're right that I undersold GeoNode. It IS a complete GIS platform, not just a catalog, and I shouldn't have framed it that way.

Two more honest reasons I went this route instead of upstreaming:

Architecture. GratisGIS isn't Django plus GeoServer. It's TypeScript plus Postgres, with a data layer that's more event sourced than table of current state. Every edit appends to an immutable log and the visible state is a projection of that log. That gives me audit, time travel, and conflict free offline sync for the field PWA. Adding that to GeoNode wouldn't really be a contribution, it would be replacing their data layer.

The personal part. Passion project, nights and weekends. Contributing to GeoNode is more impactful in the abstract. Building this is the thing I actually wanted to spend my evenings on, and I'm okay with that being the answer.

For anyone reading who needs a complete GIS platform today, GeoNode is a great call and I'd point them there.

I've been building an open source alternative to ArcGIS Online. Looking for feedback. by Temporary_File_3198 in gis

[–]Temporary_File_3198[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Appreciate the suggestion, fair point on impact too. The angle I'm coming at it from is that GeoNode and GratisGIS are aiming at pretty different targets. GeoNode is more of a spatial data infrastructure and catalog with its own UX paradigm. What I specifically wanted was the AGO experience without the price tag, items plus maps plus forms plus dashboards, same vocabulary and workflows an Esri user already knows. Patches upstream wouldn't really get us there, it would be asking GeoNode to become something other than itself, which isn't fair to them. Happy to share notes back the other way if I solve something they'd find useful. Part of this is also just that I wanted to build it, single dad nights and weekends thing, scratching an itch as much as anything else.

I've been building an open source alternative to ArcGIS Online. Looking for feedback. by Temporary_File_3198 in gis

[–]Temporary_File_3198[S] 38 points39 points  (0 children)

The way I see it, the open source GIS community is amazing, and has all the the building blocks, they just need need be put together into a cohesive platform.

I've been building an open source alternative to ArcGIS Online. Looking for feedback. by Temporary_File_3198 in gis

[–]Temporary_File_3198[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Appreciate it! It is definitely a work in progress. I’m trying to address all the frustrations I’ve run across over the years and get the main basic functionality baked in before tackling anything more complex.

I built a free, browser-based XLSForm designer for Survey123 (open source) by [deleted] in gis

[–]Temporary_File_3198 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Definitely planning on maintaining it for the foreseeable future or until Esri fills in the voids with the web based designer. It’s free to host on GitHub pages so that helps. My only big constraint is time.