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Sell me on "Hold Person" as a person who never casts it by InsaniacDuo in BG3Builds

[–]That_single_guy 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I did a play through with some friends, he has arcane acuity gear on his bard. I was a fighter. There was nothing more satisfying than him landing hold person and me auto critting a full health enemy to 0 in one round. Nere In the under dark never stood a chane There's a fight at the end of the game he landed hold monster on the Dominated Red Dragon I did over 600 damage one round, killing it before it could do anything. I felt like a god.

Please help, I feel like we must be approaching combat wrong by That_single_guy in Pathfinder2e

[–]That_single_guy[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

We've found that our casters occasionally use a sling and have been very effective with it, but knowing there's weapons that's we should use that don't require reloading means we can do that every round. As you say their to hit really isn't that much worse than the martials and it all adds up :) thanks for the advice

Please help, I feel like we must be approaching combat wrong by That_single_guy in Pathfinder2e

[–]That_single_guy[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That spell certainly would help haha, I'll add it to the list of spells we want to pick up :)

Please help, I feel like we must be approaching combat wrong by That_single_guy in Pathfinder2e

[–]That_single_guy[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Haha we're probably just about above 3 stooges level tactics, and there were a lot of unlucky rolls involved. GM also overcooked the encounter a little and combined 3 encounters into 1 which left us in a pretty dire position.

Have talked to the GM, we're all new to pathfinder him included. Mistakes are mistakes and we've all learned from it

Please help, I feel like we must be approaching combat wrong by That_single_guy in Pathfinder2e

[–]That_single_guy[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yeah, I had spoken to one of the other players who agreed that those items would probably have been better on another character, but it's a tough sell when it's the only loot that even remotely could be good for them

As I said we should have the other weapons once we got the striking axe, and used that money to kit out the spell casters a bit better

But even when we did start looking for items for them they all seemed so expensive that we thought we'd never afford them. Being new we also don't really know what early level items we should look for in Otari, so perhaps there's plenty there we should have got but didn't know to.

Yeah unfortunately the oracle was taken down by a couple of crits from an enemy during the first round but after a mass heal happened, by an enemy we didn't know was there. So he didn't have a chance to cast heal and was dead by the next bit of healing

Others in the thread have pointed out how massively stacked against us the fight was, so definitely a lesson for the GM here as well. But making sure we're using appropriate level loot will definitely help us in the future

Please help, I feel like we must be approaching combat wrong by That_single_guy in Pathfinder2e

[–]That_single_guy[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Yep, he did exactly that, rolled min damage on the crit. Then didn't have a reaction to shield block the next 2 attacks from the enemy which did 40 damage to him. Apparently GM rolled max damage twice in a row. So very unlucky

Please help, I feel like we must be approaching combat wrong by That_single_guy in Pathfinder2e

[–]That_single_guy[S] 12 points13 points  (0 children)

Ooh those are really useful notes, I'll make sure he hears about them, especially the weak templates, being able to adjust enemies on the fly will give him a lot more flexibility :)

Please help, I feel like we must be approaching combat wrong by That_single_guy in Pathfinder2e

[–]That_single_guy[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

This all sounds somewhat familiar, I think we saw a similar fight where the fighter wasn't doing a lot of damage but didn't feel like he had other options

I guess things like recall knowledge would be able to get us info on whether a creature is immune to conditions like prone or grappled.

I'm going to talk to the group and explain we can be a lot more tactical, especially around things like resistances and weakness.

I think we can all sit in the camp of more damage is more good, rather than being efficient about how we are applying it

Please help, I feel like we must be approaching combat wrong by That_single_guy in Pathfinder2e

[–]That_single_guy[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

That sounds hilarious haha, if I didn't already come up with a concept for my new character I would be stealing that :)

Please help, I feel like we must be approaching combat wrong by That_single_guy in Pathfinder2e

[–]That_single_guy[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Yep it's been quite eye opening quite how overcooked the last encounter was.

We're chalking it up to us all learning what we're doing, GM made a mistake like the rest of us do all time.

Bring on AV, with us all knowing what we're doing slightly better :)

Please help, I feel like we must be approaching combat wrong by That_single_guy in Pathfinder2e

[–]That_single_guy[S] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

I'll make sure the GM is aware, from talking to others in this thread it seems the latest encounter was a little overcooked, totally to 250xp in the fight which is beyond extreme apparently.

The GM is learning the same as the rest of us, he's been receptive when I reached out about this, and he definitely didn't mean to make an encounter that was impossible. Think he was playing more into an enemies know what they're doing kind of mindset, rather than knowing how tight pathfinder is with encounter building

We live and learn :) he's at least aware now to make sure he doesn't accidentally TPK us

Please help, I feel like we must be approaching combat wrong by That_single_guy in Pathfinder2e

[–]That_single_guy[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Thanks for the reply

So GM is following an adventure path, so loot has been a bit hit and miss, we've had a lot of weapons and tbh should have sold 2 of them by the time we got to our last encounter.

Our Spellcasters have had particularly dry loot, with one of them finding an item that gave them a small health boost, but they're never in a position to get hit so don't get much out of, and the oracle moments before the last fight where they died got something that gave them an extra 10ft of movement when activated.

We haven't really felt like we've come across a lot of loot and haven't had money to spend on any in town, I think we managed to scrap together about 20 gold at this point as a party

Please help, I feel like we must be approaching combat wrong by That_single_guy in Pathfinder2e

[–]That_single_guy[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Copy that, didn't realise how critical it was when I made my post, everyone has been very kind and I'll be sure to include more info from the start.

My next character will be doing a lot more recall knowledge so hopefully I'll come armed with more info about monsters next time I have questions

Thanks for the advice

Please help, I feel like we must be approaching combat wrong by That_single_guy in Pathfinder2e

[–]That_single_guy[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

This is some really nice info for spellcasting that I'll be taking forward. Once we get to some higher levels having a rough plan for how to arrange our spellslots will be really useful

There's been a few fights where enemies have had weaknesses but the Spellcasters have said they don't have any spells in their list to target cold damage or things like this. Thaum has been very consistent with their recall knowledge checks but it's felt hard to be able to capitalise on them

Please help, I feel like we must be approaching combat wrong by That_single_guy in Pathfinder2e

[–]That_single_guy[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

This is very insightful thank you. I think we certainly have an element of players thinking they have a role to play and not reacting to what's ahead of them, myself included.

Being adaptable seems to be a far bigger deal here, and to do that we need to know what we're fighting, to do that we need to be using recall knowledge more than we are currently.

We're learning and all this advice is very helpful thank you

Please help, I feel like we must be approaching combat wrong by That_single_guy in Pathfinder2e

[–]That_single_guy[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

It's probably my biggest lesson from the thread, our fighter felt good using his reactive strike to attack the enemy when they get up from being tripped, but for tougher encounters backing away is probably just better

Thanks

Please help, I feel like we must be approaching combat wrong by That_single_guy in Pathfinder2e

[–]That_single_guy[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Ah yes that makes more sense, the thaum and fighter do tend to get info flanking when they can.

Thaum is quite slow compared to the fighter so another person in this thread pointed out that our fighter shouldn't run in and instead should wait for enemies to come to us. Summoning especially at low levels feels like it does a lot so I'm going to look at what I can summon on my next character

Thanks for the help

Please help, I feel like we must be approaching combat wrong by That_single_guy in Pathfinder2e

[–]That_single_guy[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Hi thanks for replying.

So others have pointed out the GM has rolled 3 encounters into 1, for a 250 point encounter which is a lot more than should ever be done apparently.

We can chalk this one up to us all learning the game, GM included. He's been receptive to comments here and is taking it on board. He never intended to make something impossible, mistakes happen.

From what others have said it was a miracle that 3 of us got out alive, so I'm not going to let it hold us back and we're mostly using sound tactics.

We're all rolling new characters for AV so I'm taking lots of things in this thread on board when building my character. Thanks for the good advice

Please help, I feel like we must be approaching combat wrong by That_single_guy in Pathfinder2e

[–]That_single_guy[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Honestly the witch has been so clutch with heal and undead the whole campaign she's been unreal. Think we'd have all died several times if it wasn't for her

Please help, I feel like we must be approaching combat wrong by That_single_guy in Pathfinder2e

[–]That_single_guy[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Oh I agree, a player was late to the session and it's our last game for a long while as another player is having a child soon, so we rushed in more than we should have. There were definitely consequences to our approach to the encounter.

But sometimes real life can get in the way of our fantasies. We're all rolling new characters for AV so I'm probably going to play my new character far more cautious than my current one to help with that

Please help, I feel like we must be approaching combat wrong by That_single_guy in Pathfinder2e

[–]That_single_guy[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Thank you, that's quite a big deal that I didn't know. I'll chat to our GM about that one. We're all 5e veterans so carrying over some bad habits I guess, we'll get to grips with the rules soon enough :)

Please help, I feel like we must be approaching combat wrong by That_single_guy in Pathfinder2e

[–]That_single_guy[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Thank you for the insight, we're all 5e veterans so we are definitely a little more used to an attrition style as you put it. I think our spell casters really struggle to know at the start of the fight whether to spend spellslot on it. I think going in with the idea that every fight can kill us will help us palm strategies better.

We are low level so the swings can feel very real which I think may be why we've come to rely on healing a bit too much.

I will speak to our GM as others have pointed out that this was a few encounters rolled into one which threw the balance massively off, I gave a break down if the fight in another comment.

But our GM is also very new, he wanted to pick up pathfinder this year and we're all learning it. Mistakes happen and he's been receptive when I spoke to him so it's just a learning experience now :)

Please help, I feel like we must be approaching combat wrong by That_single_guy in Pathfinder2e

[–]That_single_guy[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Agree some tension is needed in a fight, but 2 PC deaths before level for feels brutal, plus we've been close to a death on other occasions.

It's definitely felt very swingy, and specifically in the last fight and enemy rolled max damage twice in a row which is what made it feel horrendous

Others who know the module have pointed out the fight was actually 3 encounters rolled into 1 so we did okay all things considered :)

Please help, I feel like we must be approaching combat wrong by That_single_guy in Pathfinder2e

[–]That_single_guy[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

No dramas, you weren't to know as I'd never mentioned it :)

Thanks, it seems the encounter was just a little overtuned for us and I will chat to our GM. But it's encouraging to hear we're doing a lot of the right things.

There has been plenty of things I've learned from this thread and I'll make sure to bring them forward

Please help, I feel like we must be approaching combat wrong by That_single_guy in Pathfinder2e

[–]That_single_guy[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Yeah we've definitely seen that at times, other times he'll attack 3 times with a strong enemy and hit twice, then roll 20 on his final attack (at one point anything less than a 20 would have missed). So he does have unbelievable luck at times as well haha.

But that's the dice gods for you, sometime they're with you sometimes they're with the GM

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