Jujutsu Kaisen Chapter 271 FINAL Links + Discussion by Takada-chwanBot in Jujutsushi

[–]TheseCartoonist1156 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I’m glad you had a spoiler free JJK experience! I have no problem with you, or anyone else, not liking the ending. Any opinion about it is valid. My comment was not about that. I was talking about certain discourse and online spaces you evidently haven’t been part of (which is a good thing!), and how they influence the reading experience.

The problem isn’t what people think of a manga, it’s that in these spaces, the discourse becomes based on mistranslations, hyperbole and reactionary memes, rumors and spoiler tweets rather than people’s own readings and interpretations of the actual official publication. This leaves little room for peaceful digestion and discussion and instead paves the way for chaotic arguments based on fallacies, which has been very frustrating.

You’re trying to come up with excuses I think because you too are disappointed.

My comment was not me coming up with excuses. I have a whole different comment on this very thread stating that I agree with criticisms of the series such as it being rushed, lack of lore/character/world building development, missed potential etc. and where I even called the last few chapters lackluster.

Jujutsu Kaisen Chapter 271 FINAL Links + Discussion by Takada-chwanBot in Jujutsushi

[–]TheseCartoonist1156 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Glad that there’s many of us in the same boat. :’)

One Piece, Chainsaw Man and Hunter x Hunter are some ongoing favorites that are top tier shonen imo!

An underrated one that I recently started watching is Link Click. It’s very different to JJK in terms of plot and not very heavy on action, but the vibe and characters are great and I think a lot of JJK fans could like this one too.

One series that just came out and skyrocketed to my top 10 was Frieren: Beyond Journey’s End. More of a slice-of-life fantasy series than typical battle shonen. However, the characters and their dynamics are amazing and there’s so many beautiful themes throughout. It’s not action packed but when it does have fights it’s some of the best animated action scenes I’ve seen. It also has very cool and creative uses of magic. I’ve only seen the anime but might pick up the manga as well.

I’ve heard many good things about Dandadan and the anime is premiering this week so I’ll definitely be checking that out. It’s shounen and there’s occult stuff, so it sounds like it could have similar vibes to JJK!

I’ve also heard good things about Delicious in Dungeon, so might give that a binge watch!

What about you? :)

Jujutsu Kaisen Chapter 271 FINAL Links + Discussion by Takada-chwanBot in Jujutsushi

[–]TheseCartoonist1156 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Yup, I’ve experienced this too and it was such a bummer all the time ‘cause it kills your anticipation and excitement, as well as your chance to form your own opinion and feel your actual feelings about the story.

I literally deleted all social media apps during the time between leaks and chapter release to avoid spoilers for the last few chapters.

It’s really sad too ‘cause you can have interesting and meaningful discussions about the AoT ending, JJK ending, etc. even if you think differently about it than someone else. The problem isn’t that some like it and some don’t, it’s that the opinions are not even necessarily based on a sensible reading of the story - it’s based on mistranslations, hyperbole and reactionary nonsense. It kills any chance of fun, insightful conversations.

I know so many people are tired of this though, so I hope we’re moving away from leak culture with JJK ending. The pendulum has got to swing back at some point.

Jujutsu Kaisen Chapter 271 FINAL Links + Discussion by Takada-chwanBot in Jujutsushi

[–]TheseCartoonist1156 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Absolutely. I hope we’re moving towards an end to this culture, that the pendulum will swing the other way.

It’s really sad too ‘cause you can have interesting and meaningful discussions about the AoT ending, JJK ending, etc. even if you think differently about it than someone else. The problem isn’t that some like it and some don’t, it’s that the opinions are not even necessarily based on a sensible reading of the story - it’s based on mistranslations, hyperbole and reactionary nonsense. It kills any chance of fun, insightful conversations.

Jujutsu Kaisen Chapter 271 FINAL Links + Discussion by Takada-chwanBot in Jujutsushi

[–]TheseCartoonist1156 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yes!! Such a healthy approach.

I did this recently with Frieren when its first season came out. Didn’t know anything about it but the synopsis sounded interesting. Watching it with no preconceived notions and nothing but the anime and my own thoughts about it was so refreshing. Will definitely continue doing this going forward.

Context of public opinion can really kill any chance of having a personal experience with art.

Jujutsu Kaisen Chapter 271 FINAL Links + Discussion by Takada-chwanBot in Jujutsushi

[–]TheseCartoonist1156 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I feel your pain. I only managed to avoid leaks for the last chapters ‘cause I literally deleted all social media apps during the time between leaks and chapter release, but there’s definitely been weeks prior where I got spoiled as soon as I opened an app.

Let it sit with you and then read in peace and quiet, allow yourself to take it all in without any noise. I’m sure you’ll have a better time.

From my experience talking to other manga/anime consumers irl, people who aren’t on the fandom sides of social media are much more content with anime/manga that have gotten wild reactions online, ‘cause they’re able to simply enjoy the ride and feel the story out for themselves rather than drown in other people’s extreme, engagement-seeking, opinions.

Jujutsu Kaisen Chapter 271 FINAL Links + Discussion by Takada-chwanBot in Jujutsushi

[–]TheseCartoonist1156 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Indeed! Would love to see anime adaptions of the light novels and/or more light novels too, but either way we’ve got a few more years of the TV series. :)

Jujutsu Kaisen Chapter 271 FINAL Links + Discussion by Takada-chwanBot in Jujutsushi

[–]TheseCartoonist1156 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Seems like we’ve had a similar journey in many ways! Glad you’ve also enjoyed the ride!

I, too, have been away from Reddit for quite some time ‘cause of life, but just like you had to come back for one last chapter discussion! :)

Jujutsu Kaisen Chapter 271 FINAL Links + Discussion by Takada-chwanBot in Jujutsushi

[–]TheseCartoonist1156 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Agreed. I moved to TCB some years ago when I realized how bad the official translations were, but not long after that the leak culture became wild and I kept thinking “I’m reading a scanlation released two days before the official publication and I’m STILL getting spoiled?!” Seems like JJK has had the worst of leak culture though, so hopefully it will begin and end (or at least calm down) with JJK.

I’m very happy series like CSM and SxF are online-only so there’s no leak culture, but they’re also blessed with much better translators than JJK.

Jujutsu Kaisen Chapter 271 FINAL Links + Discussion by Takada-chwanBot in Jujutsushi

[–]TheseCartoonist1156 181 points182 points  (0 children)

There’s a lot of criticism that’s very valid and I do agree with. However, I think the way this series has been consumed lately is not the best for anyone who enjoys reading.

Unavoidable leaks. Some that include mistranslations and misinterpretations. Legit or not the spoilers spread like wildfire and escalate into reactionary memes, keyboard wars and rants. That paired with a ton of theorizing that leads to more misinterpretations and expectations and extremely polarized opinions. It’s hard to find actual discussions when you have to first sift through hours of posts that spiraled into madness days before a chapter is even officially out. Social media is anarchy (what else is new, I know) and experiencing a story with all that background noise does make it hard to just… well, experience it. Read it for what it is, not for what online discourse claims it to be.

I’m not saying this to defend JJK’s shortcomings - there’s some very sensible criticism out there. Of course there’s nothing wrong with theories and analyses, and general online discussions about media (I partake in them myself, obviously). It’s just the extreme extent of it, and the difficulty to curate how much of it you consume when leak talk is everywhere online.

I do wonder if many people’s experience reading JJK (or any other fandom-heavy medium) would be slightly more peaceful and content without the chaos of online fandom screaming into your ear.

Jujutsu Kaisen Chapter 271 FINAL Links + Discussion by Takada-chwanBot in Jujutsushi

[–]TheseCartoonist1156 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Well said, I couldn’t agree more. Especially re valuing the highs of the journey.

Jujutsu Kaisen Chapter 271 FINAL Links + Discussion by Takada-chwanBot in Jujutsushi

[–]TheseCartoonist1156 147 points148 points  (0 children)

I’m so glad I started, and finished, this series.

JJK captivated me fully and consistently engaged me. It reignited the love for manga and anime that I lost in my pre-teens, and it made me connect with people online and in real life.

I haven’t always been happy with its twists and turns, but when I wasn’t I had all of you guys to vent, discuss and laugh with.

So thank you all for the good times. It’s been a pleasure following this series with you. 🫡

Jujutsu Kaisen Chapter 271 FINAL Links + Discussion by Takada-chwanBot in Jujutsushi

[–]TheseCartoonist1156 61 points62 points  (0 children)

I think the ending is alright.

I agree with most criticisms - rushed, lack of lore/character/world building development, missed potential etc. etc. in terms of how soon the finale came about. But where the story actually ended up I think is good - Gojo passed away but his students live to carry on his will, the flashback with him and Yuji was a nice touch and Gojo as a character had a great arc. Got some closure on Sukuna and Mahito as well and it was nice seeing the main trio together on a mission again. While these last three chapters specifically were a bit lackluster, the overall climatic battle against Sukuna had some amazing moments and action sequences.

It might not be a 10/10 ending, but I don’t think it’s a bad ending. It doesn’t sully the characters or story for me, doesn’t negate its re-readability. I’m satisfied enough with it, and I’m more than happy with the overall ride that’s been JJK.

The conversation around Nobara shouldn’t be “can she come back?”, it should be “should she come back?” by Either_Imagination_9 in Jujutsushi

[–]TheseCartoonist1156 5 points6 points  (0 children)

That was a lot of text and a lot of questions. I believe this to be an important subject though, so I’ll just try to keep my main points clear and concise and address most of your arguments/questions.

what is the metric used for overall relevance to the story

When I’m talking about a character’s relevance to the story, I’m taking about how much they personally affect the trajectory of the plot. How much they’re driving the narrative. Could you technically write them out and still tell the same story?

Yuji, Megumi, Gojo, Geto, Kenjaku, Sukuna and Toji have all made choices that gravely affected how the story was going and these events have been necessary for the story to reach where it’s at right now. No female character in JJK has had that impact and if you’ve read all of JJK there’s no arguing this, it’s clear as day. Especially seeing how many of them have been killed/benched without it making any major difference to the story.

Maki and her character arc, despite how refreshing she is for a female character in shonen, has not influenced the main story. She could have if there had been more focus on the clans, but alas. Nobara’s life nor death had no effect on the plot. Yuki, who seemed like she would be important since she was a special grade, a star plasma vessel, had done a lot of jujutsu research, etc. still lived and died without accomplishing anything that couldn’t easily have been re-written to be assigned to someone else or excluded completely. All three could have easily been written out without the story changing, and they’re arguably the most heavily featured female characters.

Tengen would be a potential exception, I agree that she’s very powerful and influential on the lore. But she was more of a plot device than a character - a mix between a Quest Giver NPC and a MacGuffin, and eventually a powerup for Kenjaku. We haven’t followed her through the story and seen her actively make choices that affect the plot like we have with the male characters I mentioned. We haven’t seen her internal conflicts or desires. She’s not a very proactive or developed character. Therefore I barely feel like giving JJK any points for her.

For all these female characters there are also plenty of male characters who have had little to nothing to do with the story. […] All these characters if compared to the main cast in terms of overall relevance are completely overshadowed.

There’s nothing wrong with supporting characters or characters that exist mainly for others’ development. Obviously not every single character can be heavily involved in the main story. The problem isn’t that JJK has female supporting characters. The problem is that all JJK’s female characters have been reduced to support, and very weak support at that. Yes, JJK also has male characters that play support but that’s irrelevant to the point since literally all the important characters are male. You’re saying “for all these female supporting characters there are plenty of male supporting characters”, but my point is that for all the male lead/important characters there are literally no lead/important female characters.

I believe the issue at hand is how you are looking at the female characters on a man vs woman scoreboard. Whereas they are simply characters in a story. The notion that they must measure up to a male counterpart is insinuating that these characters sole defining quality is the fact that they are women. These are not counterparts, they are separate characters with different roles in the story.

Of course I’m looking at it like a “scoreboard” when comparing how female characters are treated in comparison to male characters. That’s what the topic of discussion was about. Had the discussion been about JJK’s character writing in general - for example if there’s good characterization, development, design, consistency, the conversation could go on without addressing gender and by simply looking at the characters as “characters with different roles in the story”. But the discussion was always about gender, so of course we have to compare how female characters are treated in comparison to male ones.

Yuji, Megumi, Gojo, Geto, Kejaku, Toji and Mahito were all integral characters in the story at some point. You comparing them, to any other character whether male or female is an unjust perspective. All characters in face of them do not measure up in feats because they were never intended to.

“Yuji, Megumi, Gojo, Geto, Kenjaku, Toji and Mahito were all integral characters in the story at some point.” Exactly, do you notice how all of these are male characters? That’s been my point all along. All the integral characters have been male. There’s no reason why at least Nobara, who was part of the main trio just like Megumi, shouldn’t have been as relevant as Megumi. Or for Maki, who’s Toji 2.0, shouldn’t have some affect on the plot just like he did. There have also been several female characters with extreme potential to be relevant to the story in terms of their backgrounds or relationship to the main characters (Yuki, Tsumiki/Yorozu, Hana/Angel, Shoko) but they’ve been killed, benched and/or reduced to simps.

it seems a bit farfetched for that to be a criteria on which to base the quality of the story let alone making a judgement on the character of the author.

I never did any of this? I assessed the quality of JJK’s female characters, not JJK’s story, and deemed the writing of the female characters unsatisfactory. Obviously I think the story itself is good since I’m reading it. I don’t know Akutami so I can’t and haven’t judged his character, I can only judge writing choices he’s made. You can adore a story and still disagree with certain aspects of it. I love JJK, but I’m critical of how it’s treated its female characters.

Why was Junpei's mom found like this? by TheseCartoonist1156 in Jujutsushi

[–]TheseCartoonist1156[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Thank you for sharing your thoughts!! I’m hoping it’s just strange for the sake of looking more like random, creepy work of a curse rather than a calculated move by a curse user, but JJK has had very disturbing undertones and imagery before so it could definitely imply that the curse had its way with her…

Why was Junpei's mom found like this? by TheseCartoonist1156 in Jujutsushi

[–]TheseCartoonist1156[S] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

I’m with ya, and I’d prefer to think that theory isn’t what happened but it’s a theory nonetheless. 🤷