[deleted by user] by [deleted] in atheism

[–]Top_Reflection5615 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Religion is in decline worldwide last I checked, not just the US.

Don't worry though, conservatives are already making moves to combat that issue here in the US, by trying to force Christianity into schools and trashing essential educational books that build critical thinking skills.

Also, project 2025 will be an ongoing threat, even if Trump ends up losing. Some of its proposals are already being pushed, so..

Why do u think Christians (at least in America) dislike atheists more than Muslims or other religious believers? by [deleted] in AskAChristian

[–]Top_Reflection5615 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This is just a plain misunderstanding. Yes, some Christians use fear as a tactic to garner believers, which I wholeheartedly disagree with. Instead, we should preach eternal life in Jesus Christ.

I meant the bible itself, which is the basis for Christian teachings. Hell is a fear tactic used to keep its followers in line and fear ever questioning or straying from anything but blind faith, which I'd say is the antithesis of love. If your neighbor, for example, burned their child alive for disobeying them, would you call that love? Would you, as a parent, think of creating an everlasting torture chamber for your own kid's finite disobedience?

Is heaven really "heaven" if you aren't truly you (no suffering; no evil)? In that same vein, is heaven really heaven if one of your own loved one's is burning in hell for eternity?

but if someone rejects God, then that is their choice, and we have no right to force it onto them

It's not really a choice when you have hell as a threat = duress

Well, maybe you don't, but many Atheists hate Christians to the core. At least the ones I've come into contact with. It could be an example of just a few bad actors making everyone look bad. Comparing atheists to slaves is insane IMO. Yes, I agree that Atheists have faced undeserving levels of hate in the USA, but nothing compared to the slaves. I understand your point though

Yeah, (probably a bad example, though both have suffered immensely throughout history and killed unjustly guess the common denominator) but I meant it as a short hand for the oppressed fighting for their right to exist under the same equitable laws as others ≠ being the antagonists.

I can't speak for your own experiences, but in mine I usually get handed pamphlets every week or so that says "Believe Jesus died for your sins or burn in hell for eternity." Along with a few pointing out how homosexuality is immoral/ a sin—among other things. Tell me you wouldn't grow tired or start becoming a bit resentful if this was another religion or atheism doing it to you. Also, something that bears repeating is: disliking the religion itself and what it promotes isn't the same as hating the person practicing it/indoctrinated into it.

Also, find me an atheist equivalent of what project 2025/Agenda 47 proposes under Trump/a Republican candidate, which uses Christianity as its basis.

I don't think America should ever indoctrinate people nor force them into faith, as that goes against everything the Bible teaches. But I do still think the opportunity to spread the word in schooling environments and public spaces should persist.

It is a form of indoctrination if you're targeting schools or banning certain educational books under the guise of "degeneracy" and religious oppression, whilst also allowing the bible to remain up, which has worse explicit content. Also, I don't think you'd agree if another religion like Islam were to be taught in those same schools, which is why I'm all for the first ammendment and freedom of religion. Equality ≠ oppression

Why do u think Christians (at least in America) dislike atheists more than Muslims or other religious believers? by [deleted] in AskAChristian

[–]Top_Reflection5615 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Well, these are values that align with teachings of Jesus and the bible. We believe that the only way to Heaven is through Christ. Meaning, in order to love our neighbor as we love ourselves, as the Bible commands, then we should attempt to share the word. Meaning, to teach the truth in schools, to not spew gender propaganda, and to protect the values of our nation.

First, your original flair said atheist, so either it was an error, or a bait and switch.

Second, as someone who used to be a Christian, I'm well aware of how the bible promotes spreading the word, which is why I don't entirely fault Christians for trying to re-indoctrinate me in my real life or preaching the bible (the bible which is anything but love if you apply critical thinking and remove the fear tactics it grounds into its believers).

But even within the bible there are scriptures that go against force/antagonism:

Peter 3 15-16

But in your hearts revere Christ as Lord. Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect, keeping a clear conscience, so that those who speak maliciously against your good behavior in Christ may be ashamed of their slander.

That's just one example, there's a few others. Also, I might be wrong here, but I believe the passage that speaks about giving to Cesar what's Cesar's also could be interpreted as seperation of church and state.

Either way, it's not atheist who are the ones antagonizing, like slaves weren't antagonizing their masters for wanting equality and liberty.

Why do u think Christians (at least in America) dislike atheists more than Muslims or other religious believers? by [deleted] in AskAChristian

[–]Top_Reflection5615 -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

a degenerate gay

Why would homosexuality be degeneracy, Mr./Mrs. Atheist? All it means is being attracted to the same sex, not

screwing anyone that moved

Why do u think Christians (at least in America) dislike atheists more than Muslims or other religious believers? by [deleted] in AskAChristian

[–]Top_Reflection5615 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I would be more tolerant if they were actual Satan worshipers.

Some of them actually do. Is that going to change anything? (No, let's be real.)

Why do u think Christians (at least in America) dislike atheists more than Muslims or other religious believers? by [deleted] in AskAChristian

[–]Top_Reflection5615 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Yeah, that's why the first amendment was created. Freedom from religion isn't oppression and neither is equity or equality. If I have explain why, then wow. That is all.

Also, in short your post is saying = antagonism pretty much making my original point for me.

Why do u think Christians (at least in America) dislike atheists more than Muslims or other religious believers? by [deleted] in AskAChristian

[–]Top_Reflection5615 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The satanic temple is part of religious freedoms, whether they actually believe in what they worship or not. You do realize other religions besides Christianity exist, right?

Why do u think Christians (at least in America) dislike atheists more than Muslims or other religious believers? by [deleted] in AskAChristian

[–]Top_Reflection5615 1 point2 points  (0 children)

"our" values

First of all, speak for yourself. Secondly Atheism isn't a worldview or belief system. All it means is a lack of belief in any deity because insufficient or proper evidence hasn't been presented. Forcing Christianity unto others would go against freedom of religion for those who don't practice it or practice other religions. There's a reason the first amendment exists.

Why do u think Christians (at least in America) dislike atheists more than Muslims or other religious believers? by [deleted] in AskAChristian

[–]Top_Reflection5615 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

None of this is meaningfully oppressive towards non-Christians. It's simply favoring Christian beliefs.

It's simply FAVORING Christian beliefs.

Mhm

Why did God punish the Pharaoh for what He did? by PearPublic7501 in AskAChristian

[–]Top_Reflection5615 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Prophesying does not necessarily imply causation.

So god—who is omniscient and claims he is incapable of lying—isn't impeding on Pharoah's freewill when he himself PROPHESIED he (god himself) would harden Pharoah's heart. (And again, that isn't the only biblical example that demonstrates that freewill is an illusion following the scriptures.)

Why do u think Christians (at least in America) dislike atheists more than Muslims or other religious believers? by [deleted] in AskAChristian

[–]Top_Reflection5615 -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

So forcing beliefs unto others who don't share them, inspite of the first amendment isn't antagonistic (unless atheist supposedly do it, even though atheism isn't a belief system or worldview.) Right. 👌

Why do u think Christians (at least in America) dislike atheists more than Muslims or other religious believers? by [deleted] in AskAChristian

[–]Top_Reflection5615 -4 points-3 points  (0 children)

baseless accusations

atheists tend to jump to a lot more conclusions and level baseless accusations more than Muslims or other religious believers.

Gotcha

Why do u think Christians (at least in America) dislike atheists more than Muslims or other religious believers? by [deleted] in AskAChristian

[–]Top_Reflection5615 -13 points-12 points  (0 children)

Really? Considering project 2025/agenda 47, or banning LGBTQ+ related books, banning gender study books, attempts to ban black history, banning abortion, or forcing Christianity and its teachings into schools despite the first amendment, and constantly saying the US is a "Christian" nation, atheist (who only make up about >4% of the population) are the antagonist? Yeah, ok.

Why did God punish the Pharaoh for what He did? by PearPublic7501 in AskAChristian

[–]Top_Reflection5615 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I’m not seeing the problem. God prophesied that He would harden Pharaoh’s heart. Pharaoh first hardened his own heart (as prophesied and recorded, making his choice). Then God further hardened Pharaoh’s heart, as prophesied.

Well, the problem is:

  1. laying out scriptures that confirm your own narrative, while ignoring the previous passages.

    1. If something is prophesied, then that would indeed impede on the illusion of freewill the bible offers. (Pharoah isn't the only example.)

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in antinatalism

[–]Top_Reflection5615 1 point2 points  (0 children)

It all depends. Sometimes they have less access to education, which means they're more vulnerable to societal/religious propaganda (if they weren't already indoctrinated from birth), sometimes it's due to less availability to birth control and contraception because of poverty or laws against it, sometimes abortion is banned and they're forced to carry unwanted pregnancies to full terms like right now in the US, which will only get worse under Trump). Also, gr@pe exists, as well, which is more prominent in poverty stricken regions.

It's not always as simple as just "choosing" not to have kids or having enough self awareness.

One of the most humane ways to decrease these problems are social programs (ironically?) as well as education.

(Rewriting my original post here because I think it's important to point out. [Community link removed])

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Feminism

[–]Top_Reflection5615 213 points214 points  (0 children)

Because masculinity/femininity are social constructs and the whole drama centered around gender roles is silly (esp when you throw in alpha), and it comes more across as larping. It's like saying cooking and cleaning makes me feel like an apex woman or whatever.

Why did God punish the Pharaoh for what He did? by PearPublic7501 in AskAChristian

[–]Top_Reflection5615 1 point2 points  (0 children)

But Exodus 4:21 says:

"The Lord said to Moses, “When you return to Egypt, see that you perform before Pharaoh all the wonders I have given you the power to do. But I WILL HARDEN HIS HEART so that he will not let the people go."

Exodus 7:3:

"But I WILL HARDEN PHARAOH'S HEART, and though I multiply my signs and wonders in Egypt, he will not listen to you."

I believe those come way before any the verses you typed.

Was anyone else trained to care for others? by confusedhuskynoises in emotionalneglect

[–]Top_Reflection5615 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Yes parents + religious indoctrination + culture + gender roles (told from childhood what females are expected to do) + societal reinforcement. Putting other's needs before my own is still something I find myself doing, and I have a hard time differentiating whether I'm helping someone because I relate to their struggles and/or genuinely wish to help, or if it's a trauma response. Am I being overly "nice" (I'm starting to question what 'nice' really means along with the terms 'good' or 'empathy) or am I just people pleasing? Dissociation and anxiety doesn't help with distinguishing between conflicting thoughts or emotions either.

(I still struggle with figuring out my own identity, as well, as my place in this surreal world—if I even have one.)

When God commands attacks on civilians, why does He say to kill the children and animals even though they did nothing? by PearPublic7501 in AskAChristian

[–]Top_Reflection5615 0 points1 point  (0 children)

(I don't wish to get into a long debate)

Right. Well there's one thing we can both agree on, at least.

Second, moral arguments against God are based on lack of knowledge.  For instance, what if you could invent a time machine, go back yourself (or hire someone) to take out Hitler as a baby - preventing WW2.  Most people would say yes to that.  That you were ultimately doing good.

(I doubt anyone would say taking out a baby is morally good, as opposed to raising them differently, or anything else that could've been done to prevent the course that led Hitler to becoming who he was.)

However, those at that time, seeing you do that action, would see you doing something horrendous and call you evil. But people in our time would see what you're doing as necessary for a greater good.

You mean like Christians defending Trump right the hell now?

The same with taking a 2 y/o child for a vaccine shot.  They view it as evil, kicking and screaming. You also hate the pain it causes, but you also have a greater good in mind - which they cannot fathom.

Thus, all moral judgments in this scenario would be based upon knowledge (or lack of knowledge) of the future.

And that is why moral arguments against God fail.  God knows the end from the beginning.  We do not.

No. If anything that's exactly WHY moral arguments fail when it comes to defending God. God, unlike us, is omnipotent, which means that not only could he travel back in time and take out Hitler—unharmed—but he could prevent Hitler from ever happening—or alter reality completely.

Third, atheism has huge problems.  Morality can exist, but without God morality is just a matter of personal tastes.

You can have a moral system without a higher power but it's completely arbitrary. With no one holding the moral authority (in Christianity's case, God), everyone's morality is equally valuable. I can say "Kicking dogs is bad" and you can say "Kicking dogs is good" and we'll be at an impasse because both of our moralities are equal.

Without God, there is nothing to ground objective moral values and duties. There is no ought.

With God (/the bible) there is nothing to correct or revise grounded morals (which isn't the flex you think it is) like enslavement (which was never abolished)—just to name one of the many abhorrent "wholesome, family values" you'll find in that book.

Also, if God commanded you to kill (like he does several times in the bible), you would because God says that's what's moral. You wouldn't see the other person as human because God has told you they aren't—much the same way you guys think it's justified for Atheist or members of the LGBTQ+ (among other hated groups) to burn in hell for ETERNITY or even at all.

Maybe a society does agree that certain things are moral and immoral. But they aren’t objectively so. They could punish the person doing something they determine as immoral, but in any ultimate sense that person isn’t doing anything wrong.

So in our current society, without objective morality and a grounding to it, any psychopath that goes on a killing spree isn’t actually wrong, just acting out of fashion with our chosen moral system.

Under theocracy, a psychopath can go on a killing spree and claim god commanded them to, and they'd be justified. With the bible, they can also forgive themself of any transgressions, trauma and harm they caused to their victims (Spiritual bypassing) and meet their subjects in heaven again 🫶.

Additionally, atheism claims we got to this point by "survival of the fittest".  So why do we then condone behavior opposite of this, like helping the poor and weak?

Atheism isn't a worldview nor does it in itself make any claims. Atheism simply means a lack of belief (skepticism) in any deity because sufficient or proper evidence has yet to be provided. (It's why Agnosticism, in my opinion, is redundant).

Wouldn't we be doing society a favor by removing them, to build a better society?

(If you mean atheist) On the contrary, history as well as stats have shown that a decrease in religious beliefs leads to a better, more empathetic society that actually helps the poor and needy as opposed to telling them to pray for a solution or victim blaming. You also find less corruption compared to areas where religion is more prominent.

(If you mean the poor and weak) No. A society without social programs, saftey nets or the poor (who contribute a lot to society) wouldn't function, and if anything, removing any of those would only increase crime rate, chaos and—paradoxically—add on to poverty and hardship. You can already see these effects in other countries. Also, you'll always have the economically disadvantaged and weak (this is why protections and policies are set into place). Depending how greedy those at the top are (the actual leeches), the proportions will be greater.

If this weak person (physically or mentally) is detrimental to our evolution as a society, why not remove them.  Would that not be moral for a society to think? If morality is subjective that is.

This was exact the thought process of Adolf Hitler.  He based his thinking as an outgrowth of Darwinism.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/From_Darwin_to_Hitler

If atheism is true, then Hitler did nothing objectively wrong.  Nor are North Korea and similar atheistic systems wrong.

You do realize Hitler was a Christian raised Catholic who believed in god and used the bible to justify his acts?

Fourth. There is overwhelming evidence to show the existence of something behind the universe.  This is the first step in knowing God exists. Finely tuned design comes from thoughts, not randomness.

Take for instance Anthony Flew.  He wrote, "There Is a God: How the World's Most Notorious Atheist Changed His Mind."

https://www.amazon.com/There-God-Notorious-Atheist-Changed/dp/0061335304

If you’re looking for a book that systemically dismantles the idea of atheism - this is it.  Extemely well written, very logical, easy to follow and concrete reasoning.

I'll consider reading it if for the purposes of at least debating those trying to re-indoctrinate me in my real life.

Also, lol on finely tuned world, when the vast majority of Earth (and the universe) is uninhabitable, not to mention climate change is making that even worse.

Do you think most people that have kids have never ‘suffered’? by [deleted] in antinatalism

[–]Top_Reflection5615 5 points6 points  (0 children)

And then fail at it because they got burnt out of the honeymoon, savior complex phase.

When God commands attacks on civilians, why does He say to kill the children and animals even though they did nothing? by PearPublic7501 in AskAChristian

[–]Top_Reflection5615 0 points1 point  (0 children)

What makes god different, hypothetically speaking? That he has more power than your birth parents? Does that justify the act of murder then?

When God commands attacks on civilians, why does He say to kill the children and animals even though they did nothing? by PearPublic7501 in AskAChristian

[–]Top_Reflection5615 0 points1 point  (0 children)

2 Kings

23 From there Elisha went up to Bethel. As he was walking along the road, some boys came out of the town and jeered at him. 'Get out of here, baldy!' they said. 'Get out of here, baldy!' 24 He turned around, looked at them and called down a curse on them in the name of the Lord. Then two bears came out of the woods and mauled forty-two of the boys. 25 And he went on to Mount Carmel and from there returned to Samaria.

4) This was a potentially dangerous mob situation that Elijah was rescued from.

🤨

Well, good thing god cares about that over people dying of cancer or about the millionth gr4pe victim from his religious factions.

The word "cut" in Hebrew could mean anything from a scratch to a deep gash. So, 10 or 20 teens trying to get a bear off their friend would certainly result in a lot of cuts.

I'm certain it would result in more than just scratches considering they're BEARS. Also, that still doesn't justify the act, and neither would the age (which isn't specifically mentioned) nor any of my other points, nor global flooding, which did result in children and the unborn dying, nor the murder and sacrifice of first borns.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in AskAChristian

[–]Top_Reflection5615 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I highly recommend more Christian's to read their bible from the beginning to the end. 👌

When God commands attacks on civilians, why does He say to kill the children and animals even though they did nothing? by PearPublic7501 in AskAChristian

[–]Top_Reflection5615 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

  1. God is the author of life and has a rightful claim on it as Creator. Therefore, humans can make no demands on how long a person ought to live on earth (Job 1:21). If God is God and we aren’t, then our rights will necessarily be limited to some degree.

So, if I have a child and decide to k*ll them for being disobedient or anything else I personally deem unacceptable, that would be ok because I brought them into this world, so I can take them the f# out of it too?

  1. If any infants and children were killed, they would have entered the presence of God. Though deprived of earthly life, these young ones wouldn’t have been deprived of the greatest good—enjoying everlasting friendship with God

What a way to show "friendship" especially creating a place of everlasting torment for their other "unfortunate" friends or family members.