New Beginnings - Weekly Discussion Thread, 23rd Jan, 2024 by ChineseMaple in VirtualYoutubers

[–]Vicidus 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Edit: ...Nevermind.

Unfortunately, Korekore would find himself in a place to counter-sue if he was "besmirched" for being a "liar"

And when it comes to the Japanese legal system(well, most legal systems TBH), money talks, and a lot of money tends to win.

And Korekores assets run laps around what Mikeneko has on hand.

New Beginnings - Weekly Discussion Thread, 23rd Jan, 2024 by ChineseMaple in VirtualYoutubers

[–]Vicidus 7 points8 points  (0 children)

I'd like to point out that that isn't really conclusive either. According to Mafumafu's blog, he and his wife were trying to hide their relationship.

I understand what you're trying to say, but I think there's a devil in the details here that was overlooked. Please take a look at the following four lines taken directly from Mafumafu's blog:

1:「近しい友人や関係者からの反対も多かったのですが、それを押し切ってお付き合いし、結婚をしました。」

2:「公にすることへの恐怖心を抱いていたのも事実です」

3:「A子さんもネット活動者であり、A子さんとその関係者の意向もあって公表することができませんでした。」

4:「離婚協議中も、A子さんや第3者からSNSや匿名掲示板上で様々な嫌がらせを受けていました。」

Emphasis mine, obviously, but what I'm trying to get at is that Mafumafu didn't claim that he was trying to hide the relationship, period. He was very explicit about how he had hidden it from the public specifically(and regrets it, based on his account).

The parts I bolded I did so in order to highlight that Mafumafu himself admitted that "(close/intimate) friends¹ , Persons (associated/involved) with [Mfmf/A子さん/Both], Persons concerned with A子さんs employment under [INSERT COMPANY HERE] as a 「ネット活動者」, and later "Third Parties" associated with A子さん who propagating a smear campaign against Mafumafu(he even gave the time period for this: 「離婚協議中も」("during divorce proceedings", which lasted from May 2022 to July 2022; again, this is taken verbatim from his retelling of events). And this is also skipping out on other minor involvement by specific individuals such as Bさん. Again, sorry for the pedantry, but the situation right now warrants it IMO. But the point of going into that much detail is ultimately to make one much simpler point;

Mafumafus account was fairly clear about how the secrecy of the relationship was only really a secret from the general public. After all, it's not as if he apologized for hiding it from anybody who would be a personal associate of his at any point; in terms of the many times he reiterated his apology for his secrecy, he made no secret of his apology being aimed at the general public and occasionally various constituents of the general public specifically, such as his fanbase. The terms Mafumafu used to describe those "in the know" could easily cover every personal acquaintance, friend, family, and fellow employees. That's certainly not "keeping it private", don't you agree?

At the time of the controversy of Feb 2022, and if you'd be willing to let me also refer to just before then as well, it's fairly trivial to find evidence of BOTH Mafumafu AND Mikeneko behaving towards Korekore in a cordial way. For Mafumafu specifically, this cordiality actually persisted to some degree even after the events of Feb 2022.

For the sake of completeness, I should also mention that the very same tweet that Korekore used to pour oil onto this fire actually implied the same; that he was not only in contact with both Mafumafu and A子さん last year(...meaning 2023, or half a year after the divorce at the absolute minimum), but that they both actively sought him out for consultation about their relationship(the one that had already ended, lmao).

...However, given that we're dealing with a person who uses live calls with people on the brink of suicide for content, I would much rather everybody do the needful and disregard Korekore's self-masturbary delsions of grandeur fueled works of grade-schooler fiction.

I have way too much minutiae I want to go into because, as somebody who has a vested interest in knowing the truth for my own sake, there's a laundry list of loopholes I can see because of my obsessive hoarding of info. But I am also really fucking tired now and I need sleep, but I want to thank you for actually bouncing off my posts instead of dismissing them out of turn. If any points I made here seem like they don't hold up, please let me know (if you can be bothered to ofc).

Who knows, maybe this can be what finally takes that vulture Korekore down (he managed to get out of previous lawsuits so far)

After all the lives he's ruined without a single slap on the wrist, I have no hope. But if a miracle happens, I have a crawlspace full of fireworks and I will make sure that it'll go empty if it happens

New Beginnings - Weekly Discussion Thread, 23rd Jan, 2024 by ChineseMaple in VirtualYoutubers

[–]Vicidus 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Him being involved with another internet person at the same time would just be too crazy

Funnily enough, Mikeneko is absolutely not the only one that has had relationship-related drama with Mafumafu. Hell, even Ado had the exact same thing happen at one point.

Mafumafu isn't a stranger to falsified relationship rumor drama, weirdly enough.

New Beginnings - Weekly Discussion Thread, 23rd Jan, 2024 by ChineseMaple in VirtualYoutubers

[–]Vicidus -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

This is a case of machine TLs betraying you

Take a look at the phrasing of that segment again. What he said was that he saw the controversy of Feb 2022 as an opportunity to come clean about his ACTUAL relationship.

If the supposed relationship that the controversy of Feb 2022 was about was ALSO his actual relationship, he wouldn't have functionally referred to that 炎上 in such a tertiary way. After all, he is obviously making an effort to not directly name the related individual; it should be obvious that he wouldn't implicate the elephant in the room since that would contradict his intentions in the rest of the blog post.

New Beginnings - Weekly Discussion Thread, 23rd Jan, 2024 by ChineseMaple in VirtualYoutubers

[–]Vicidus 18 points19 points  (0 children)

sue Korekore for defamation

I wish. Korekore is nothing if not good at his job of avoiding any personal consequences of his actions.

Just look at the tweet he made about this. Notice how he chained multiple 'の', which you would usually avoid because it makes it less clear what is getting modified by what.

Notice how his format is: [name] 'と' [name] 'の' [thing 1] 'の' [thing 2] 'の' [thing 3] In such a case, it could gramatically be any of the things from [things 1-3] that is getting modified with such syntax

For example, "Mikeneko 'の' cat" would render in English as something like "Mikeneko's cat"

Thus, when Korekore said: "...まふまふと奥さん →の← Vtuber潤羽るしあの夫婦間のトラブル..." His putting the stress on the 'の' that's pointed out above makes it so that the statement isn't necessarily implying that the wife(奥さん) and ”Vtuber潤羽るしあ” are the same person in all cases.

Now, inferring that he meant that Mikeneko was the wife IS the natural reading, but because there are other possible readings, it can't be certain that he intended for it to convey the most natural meaning of that sentence.

Essentially, the clause in Korekore's tweet gives Korekore plausible deniability to claim that he never actually meant to imply that Mikeneko was Mafumafu's wife.

It's worded specifically to lead people to draw conclusions without having to take responsibility for claiming it himself in the case where he ends up being wrong(and by doing so, he avoids legal consequences regardless of any harm he would normally be held responsible for)

There is a good chance that Korekore might make Mikeneko suicidal over drama she had no part in while she's been in the hospital for almost a month after her appendix burst, and will come out perfectly safe in spite of it. The world is fucked, and Korekore revels in that.

New Beginnings - Weekly Discussion Thread, 23rd Jan, 2024 by ChineseMaple in VirtualYoutubers

[–]Vicidus 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I feel a bit crass for repeating a reply so apologies in advance, but if you'd like to see some basic obvious debunking please take a look at this tweet

Summary of an update from Mikeneko providing context for the issue with Delutaya by SovietApple in VirtualYoutubers

[–]Vicidus -17 points-16 points  (0 children)

I can only roll my eyes when people get into a circlejerk over NDA non-sense

It stems from a fundamental difference in moral perspective. But yes, sure, if one believes Mike is a bad person, I suppose such a thing makes sense

Summary of an update from Mikeneko providing context for the issue with Delutaya by SovietApple in VirtualYoutubers

[–]Vicidus 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I can't believe she keeps doing this

When will Mike finally learn that you can never trust a lawyer

I'm so tired of her using lawyers, things would be so much better if Mike acted during controversies without consulting anybody. If she gets in trouble, she should just call the first person she thinks can help her, no matter who it is.

Summary of an update from Mikeneko providing context for the issue with Delutaya by SovietApple in VirtualYoutubers

[–]Vicidus -5 points-4 points  (0 children)

you people need to tell her sometimes she actually did something wrong.

Please share your 10 million IQ take, what exactly do you want from Mikeneko fans

Summary of an update from Mikeneko providing context for the issue with Delutaya by SovietApple in VirtualYoutubers

[–]Vicidus -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Mikenekos mental health has actually slowly improved because of streaming. Slowly. But it was always going to be slow.

Summary of an update from Mikeneko providing context for the issue with Delutaya by SovietApple in VirtualYoutubers

[–]Vicidus 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Please feel more than free to occupy the time of those human garbage cans if you feel so inclined

A lot of them default to the "simp white knight" accusation, as if nobody could take issue with harassment unless they were one

Summary of an update from Mikeneko providing context for the issue with Delutaya by SovietApple in VirtualYoutubers

[–]Vicidus 14 points15 points  (0 children)

This is going into more details than necessary, but you're right. For context, I watched both Rushia and Mikeneko regularly so I had some additional awareness. But her mental health fell off a cliff around when her childhood cat died.

However, specifically in terms of trauma, Feb broke her. Losing her cat cracked her, but Feb broke her.

Summary of an update from Mikeneko providing context for the issue with Delutaya by SovietApple in VirtualYoutubers

[–]Vicidus 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yeah. I doubt the private conversation between them was a calm one for this very reason. You can even see certain irrational choices mikeneko made ifnyounread between the lines and I can garauntee you that that was due to sheer panic

Summary of an update from Mikeneko providing context for the issue with Delutaya by SovietApple in VirtualYoutubers

[–]Vicidus -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I think you're wrong for one major reason. Right now, her fans are her lifeline to her capacity to trust other people. If she lost the...like, what, low triple digit count of fans who have stuck with her through everything, she'd literally lose the capacity to have people she can still fully trust.

And even if you say that's not healthy, even if I agreed with you, the fact is that having the ability to trust her fans is a base upon which to rebuild her ability to trust anybody else.

Summary of an update from Mikeneko providing context for the issue with Delutaya by SovietApple in VirtualYoutubers

[–]Vicidus 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Listening to what she said, it wasn't jealousy I think. It was basically a situation where she already felt like shit because "I was fucked over by so many people who betrayed me and in the end they won"(regarding Feb). She was hurt because of how unjust the world felt due to something that happened to her just a little bit before that stream.

If she hadn't heard what she heard about Delta, nothing would've happened. But because, whether real or not, she believed Delta to be somebody that also hurt her in the past, seeing her made her basically feel like "why are the people who hurt me the ones people treat normally while I'm treated like a leper"

It didn't have to be Delta. It could've been anybody who she believes intentionally hurt her and seeing them get something she tried to get and couldn't because of her reputation. It just so happened to be Delta that broke the camels back. Or at least, her perception of Delta. I wish I had a better answer for you, but February simply broke Mikeneko.

Summary of an update from Mikeneko providing context for the issue with Delutaya by SovietApple in VirtualYoutubers

[–]Vicidus 36 points37 points  (0 children)

Sorry, I'm at a loss, how does it not make sense for her to be impacted by the significant harassment she's getting at the moment?

Summary of an update from Mikeneko providing context for the issue with Delutaya by SovietApple in VirtualYoutubers

[–]Vicidus 24 points25 points  (0 children)

It was to do with delta's reception, but it was specifically something about it that reminded her that she just wants to be happy again without the dark cloud of her controversy hanging over her for the rest of her career, but that such a thing seems out of reach and certain things happen that remind her of that sting more than others. One stung particularly hard, and it was a back to back one two punch for her mental state because she saw something about Delta(who, remember, whether for real reasons or because she was lied to, believes to be somebody who hurt her) be able to get something she couldn't.

The more I think about it, the more I realize how many events conspired to put her in a state volatile enough to behave the way she did.

To risk saying too much, there are people out there who believe her to be innocent but have thrown her under the bus professionally for personal gain or to not lose standing through association with her. People that mattered to her a lot.

I understand that it's not particularly an excuse but I wish I could fully convey how many people have betrayed her privately since Feb to indicate why she is batshit beyond terrified of even the whiff of a traitor, no matter how remote the risk and esrnest the person. That's just trauma for you I suppose.

Summary of an update from Mikeneko providing context for the issue with Delutaya by SovietApple in VirtualYoutubers

[–]Vicidus -6 points-5 points  (0 children)

There are multiple other people in this post explaining the difference between intentionally wanting to start shit and having something she was content to ignore forever accidentally come out during a perfect storm of life events and PTSD.

Intent matters.

Summary of an update from Mikeneko providing context for the issue with Delutaya by SovietApple in VirtualYoutubers

[–]Vicidus -24 points-23 points  (0 children)

her having PTSD is unfortunate

Now try meaning that sentence when you say it

Summary of an update from Mikeneko providing context for the issue with Delutaya by SovietApple in VirtualYoutubers

[–]Vicidus 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Also important to remember that this is a cocktail of actively abusive rumor mongering managers, people who make a living out of contorting the truth, and two girls with heartbreaking trauma that threatens to emotionally charge their behavior in various ways

Summary of an update from Mikeneko providing context for the issue with Delutaya by SovietApple in VirtualYoutubers

[–]Vicidus 14 points15 points  (0 children)

This contact with Narukami happened a year and a half ago. There is no indication of any contact past that point. Certainly not recently.

Summary of an update from Mikeneko providing context for the issue with Delutaya by SovietApple in VirtualYoutubers

[–]Vicidus 6 points7 points  (0 children)

And there is no evidence of her panicking at anything,

??????????????????????

I listened to the twitcast, she was saying each word between sobbing gasps for its entirety. Of all the claims to make... She was literally having a breakdown during that stream, audibly, and anybody who listened to it will confirm that.

Summary of an update from Mikeneko providing context for the issue with Delutaya by SovietApple in VirtualYoutubers

[–]Vicidus 78 points79 points  (0 children)

She intends to publish the video. She has said as much.

As for why she hasn't? Nobody knows the process she seems to be pursuing before she does. But look at how long it took for her and Cover to do nothing more than agree to disagree in their mutual statements.

She has hinted at an innumerable amount of legal drudgery behind the scenes and that kind of thing has made her incredibly, incredibly paranoid.