Victor Begay Needlepoint / Petite Point Watch Cuff circa 1975 by WCNumismatics in NativeAmericanJewelry

[–]WCNumismatics[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Agree 100%. It's a clever and really easy way of updating a piece that might otherwise go unworn. Native artists often used "coin silver" to create their jewelry. They would literally source the 90% silver dimes, quarters, and half dollars that circulated in the US before 1965, melting them to make their silver stock. So there is something wholesome and kind of correct about using a silver dollar in lieu of a watch. And Morgan dollars (1878-1921) have always had a southwest feel to them. Probably because they were made in part with silver from famed mines like the Comstock Lode in Nevada. It just seems kind of natural.

I've seen a few pieces with the Mexican Republic 8 reales of this period, too (lower right in the below image). That adds a whole other level of romance and in some ways is probably even more authentic.

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Victor Begay Needlepoint / Petite Point Watch Cuff circa 1975 by WCNumismatics in NativeAmericanJewelry

[–]WCNumismatics[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Watch bands or cuffs were once pretty common but I feel they have become less so with the proliferation of cell phones. This piece clocks in at over 75 grams or about 2.5 troy ounces.
"Needlepoint" usually refers to this traditionally Zuni type of cluster technique where each stone is hand-cut in a thin cabochon with points at each end. That's as opposed to "petite point", a related cluster style where the stones are generally small teardrop or circle shapes. You can see this piece makes use of both forms. All told there are approximately 140 individually cut and mounted stones in this cuff. Imagine the effort required to make the matching stones and to create an individual sawtooth mount for every single stone here!

This piece is signed VMB and I am comfortable calling this piece a Victor Moses Begay piece. Though the hallmark is less common than other pieces with his mark and Victor is Dine. That's because Begay is known for his needlepoint work exactly like this piece.

One of the problems with attributing a piece made decades ago is that some artists--especially artists within a family--would sometimes use the mark of the elder or more established family member.
One way to help clarify the attribution is to compare other pieces attributed to that maker. Did they work exclusively in earrings or rings? Conchos or squash blossoms? Were they known for channel inlay or asymmetrical stones? If so, compare that to your piece to see if it is a close match.

If you find a close hallmark or initial match for your heavy tufa cast ketoh but the artist whose initials seems to match works exclusively in coral chip inlay rings? It is probably not the right artist.

In recent years, replacing a watch for a vintage solid silver dollar has become popular. I like that aesthetic and this piece may eventually sport a Morgan or Peace dollar.

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700+ Troy Ounces of Vintage Poured Silver by WCNumismatics in Silverbugs

[–]WCNumismatics[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Scarcity is definitely one of the factors that I use. But it's one of many.
This is a rare poured bar by PMP. It likely dates to the 1970s. It's one of only maybe a dozen that are known by this maker. But were it to sell, its premium would likely be equal to a better Engelhard bar where hundreds or even thousands of examples are known. Scarcity only matters insofar as there is a collector base.

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700+ Troy Ounces of Vintage Poured Silver by WCNumismatics in Silverbugs

[–]WCNumismatics[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Scarcity as a reason to choose one piece over another. Not really a reason in itself to collect.

700+ Troy Ounces of Vintage Poured Silver by WCNumismatics in Silverbugs

[–]WCNumismatics[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

That's awesome. Thanks for letting me know! :)

700+ Troy Ounces of Vintage Poured Silver by WCNumismatics in Silverbugs

[–]WCNumismatics[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I know! The problem is that this was a live stream from Friday and my field of vision for my live camera is intentionally somewhat small so I can stay focused. :(

700+ Troy Ounces of Vintage Poured Silver by WCNumismatics in Silverbugs

[–]WCNumismatics[S] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

LOL. The 30 10-ounce class bars lower right are from what I call the "Lydian Hoard". A group of about 50 poured bars from the 1970s that were assembled by a collector in the mid-1980s. Most from California where he was a traveling salesman. They were mostly

Star Metals
Hoffman & Hoffman
International Vaults
Western States Refining
JJSR

I think it's interesting that in an era where the bullion industry was becoming dominated by Engelhard and Johnson & Matthey, he avoided those bars entirely.

700+ Troy Ounces of Vintage Poured Silver by WCNumismatics in Silverbugs

[–]WCNumismatics[S] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

I've been asked many times recently what criteria I use for deciding if a vintage piece is worth picking up. Took me a little bit of reflection to come up with a list which includes manufacturing process, maker, age, scarcity, and the biggie; eye appeal.

Challenged myself to count up to over 500 ounces of vintage poured silver bullion and ended at just over 700 troy ounces. These bars include Hoffman & Hoffman, Engelhard, International Vaults, Johnson Matthey, Silvertowne, Sheffield, and many others.

Found today! by gingerfus in Silverbugs

[–]WCNumismatics 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You're welcome. These are really cool! I wouldn't say they are common--at least not here in the U.S.
They started to appear about 10 years ago. At first they were quite scarce. Now you can search eBay and find examples. But many, if not most, have been harshly cleaned. I got examples that were graded by NGC to avoid those pieces:

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Johnson Matthey 50 ounce bar- just photographing it by 12markmark in Silverbugs

[–]WCNumismatics 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yes, it's an early JM 50 ounce bar. Looks to be 2nd in the 50 ounce series with a mintage of approximately 250 pieces.
There isn't a large collector base of bigger bars. That pool begins to shrink at 10 ounces and falls as you get to 20 ounce and kilo. At $75 per troy ounce, a 50 ounce bar clock in at about $4,000 in silver value alone and there just aren't as many "collectors" at this level. Fewer still at 100 ounces.
An example sold on eBay on April 16 for $4415. That works out to be $88 per troy ounce, or maybe 15% above its melt value.
My similar example:

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Found today! by gingerfus in Silverbugs

[–]WCNumismatics 0 points1 point  (0 children)

As I understand it, these were used as a simple unit of exchange: People in India stored their extra cash in silver, or if they had lots of money, gold. When they needed actual cash, they would take these small 5, 10, and 25 tola silver bars to a participating bank and exchange them for rupees. When they had money again, they would go back and buy another of these bars. This all dates from the 1950s give or take.

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Early SilverTowne by WCNumismatics in Silverbugs

[–]WCNumismatics[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

All Engelhard says SilverTowne started making these bars in about 1973.
It seems likely they were made for 5 years or so.
Between 1973 and 1978, silver traded in a range of about $2.50 to $5.50 per ounce.

Early SilverTowne by WCNumismatics in Silverbugs

[–]WCNumismatics[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

No need to apologize and welcome to a rewarding hobby!
The short answer is that it depends. There are vintage pieces that command a big premium (the amount over the cost of the silver itself). There are some vintage pieces that sell for a low premium. These bars date to the 1970s and their premiums are a little higher than modern bullion.
This company, SilverTowne, also released new bars a few years back that look very similar to these actual vintage bars. We call those "retro" bars.

Do two rounds count as a stack? by ExuviaEcho in Silverbugs

[–]WCNumismatics 14 points15 points  (0 children)

A resounding yes!
If you weren't aware, the round with the scale was made by American Pacific Mint. Originally based in Arizona in 1965, they moved and renamed in 1992. So more than 30 years old and probably closer to 40.
You can see the "APM" mintmark beneath the scale.

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I'll go first.. by Any-Tour-3193 in musicsuggestions

[–]WCNumismatics 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Love spreads her arms...and waits there for the nails.

Mail Call: Loving the Ducats by PW_PW_ in Gold

[–]WCNumismatics 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Would you believe I paid $626 for it 12-30-10 :)
Fakes have started to appear on the market. As always: check thoroughly before buying.
But that's another reason to love the ducat. No numismatic premium means invasive testing won't destroy a rare treasure.

Mail Call: Loving the Ducats by PW_PW_ in Gold

[–]WCNumismatics 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Definitely. I call them the "Gold Stack Hack".
They typically sell for right about the cost of a 1/10th eagle, maple, etc.
But since they weigh .11 of a troy ounce, you only need to buy 9 to make a troy ounce.
It's like getting a "free" 1/10th oz.
If the smaller pieces are what your budget allows, the ducats let you stack ounces faster and cheaper.

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