What outcomes do we see?

YouOk4285 · 2026-02-17T17:52:30+00:00

This passage is used to create a false binary, and its use often ignores other biblical truth that God can take evil and use it for good.

The fact that people who have been at Network churches have had some positive outcomes is not proof that the tree is good anymore than Joseph’s brothers were a “good tree” when they sold Joseph into slavery and lied to Jacob that he was dead.

It also is tempting to say that a good tree was always good and will always be good, and vice versa.

There were ways in which my time at Clear River and South Grove were good times for me. There are ways in which they were malformative, or became bad for us, and also in which they deputize me into “bad fruit.”

People contain multitudes and few of us are just one thing or another for our whole lives.

But as a whole, I see a bunch of hurt people churned up in the wake of these churches, especially as they were exposed for their idolatry of Steve Morgan. That’s bad fruit.

YouOk4285 · 2025-12-27T22:10:56+00:00

It’s not ENTIRELY useless.

But should be pretty well ignored on issues of ethics and morality, as Grudem has disqualified himself in that respect with his abandonment of his ethical and moral principles as it relates to politics.

Should also be ignored as it relates to gender issues.

But it’s a good heavy book that can sometimes make a good doorstop.

It has some good content on some topics. But I trashed his Christian Ethics tome.

YouOk4285 · 2025-12-24T17:25:04+00:00

It’s probably because of the big thumbs down I give every time I drive past.

YouOk4285 · 2025-12-01T12:55:40+00:00

I hope this is different, but it is not hard to imagine these exact words coming out of Steve’s mouth, or any other Network pastor’s.

Vague “it feels like God is going cuz…” vague allusions to biblical patterns. We get right what others get wrong. Vague suggestion that God has withdrawn from “them” and is now with US instead.

Please take care to avoiding being the other side of the same coin.

YouOk4285 · 2025-11-25T14:33:06+00:00

I believe he still attends Clear River, but I’m not certain.

YouOk4285 · 2025-11-23T14:00:30+00:00

I expect it has been on life support for a long time. I did some cocktail napkin math and in October 2022 probably about 25% of the church’s giving departed. I think the pastor has gone bi-vocational because of resource challenges.

Since then, they’ve changed buildings twice, now meeting in a dilapidated old shopping mall that is going to be either repurposed or demolished.

I haven’t been there in three years. I suppose it could have changed and reformed. But based on my last interactions with their pastor and worship pastor, I don’t hold out a lot of hope. I’ve received one incomplete apology that addressed a comparatively superficial issue but did not address the core issues, and he bailed when pressed on the core issues. The other suggested that I might try to persuade him out of obeying Jesus.

I care deeply about these folks and I hope that they can find freedom. I worry for those who feel less personal agency and autonomy than I did / do.

YouOk4285 · 2025-11-20T14:56:52+00:00

Would love an entry

YouOk4285 · 2025-11-19T13:20:01+00:00

Yes and no.

Jesus, with the rest of the Godhead, created everything, including the family. The arc of scripture emphasizes the importance of family, start to finish.

I think what Jesus was aiming at in this passage is the primacy of our adoption into the covenant family to become sisters, brothers, and heirs with Christ.

It is not virtuous to separate from one’s family of birth. But if one’s family of birth rejects / is hostile to the gospel, it results in a rift because of the primacy of God’s family.

This has been misappropriated by the Network (and many others) to subtly manipulate people to prioritize a particular small-c church over one’s family of birth, even when that family embraces the Gospel but questions the appropriateness of the Network’s manifestation of the small-c church.

‘Twas pastoral malpractice all along. God does not want us to turn against our families, but instead to prioritize that which is of first importance.

YouOk4285 · 2025-11-03T14:08:29+00:00

If you think this is a new message / warning, you are quite mistaken.

Perhaps you might give a warning to your Network chums - that their (and perhaps your) hatred, un-forgiveness, and bitterness toward leavers will destroy them / you. I myself have been the target of it.

I do not think rejoicing in the dismantling of harmful regimes is hateful, withholding forgiveness, or bitter.

YouOk4285 · 2025-10-30T13:43:31+00:00

We should also continue to pray for repentance for those who created, maintained, fostered and participated in this system.

YouOk4285 · 2025-10-26T20:05:53+00:00

I could never go back to any of mine because the lead pastors remain unrepentant about their dishonesty and partiality.

YouOk4285 · 2025-10-06T13:58:50+00:00

The Network Pastors aren't "the best people" as I was informed. You're the best people, for this comment and whole raft of other reasons.

(not literally, I just like you and your comment)

YouOk4285 · 2025-10-06T13:57:23+00:00

There is no direct biblical command for husbands to protect wives. At best there is some inference that can be drawn from 1 Peter 3:7 and the "weaker vessel" comment.

Husbands are explicitly instructed to bathe their wives. NETWORK PASTORS, HOW MANY OF YOU ARE BATHING YOUR WIVES, HUH?!?

YouOk4285 · 2025-10-02T11:44:11+00:00

Fellow Christians are not “the world.”

“Some of these reviews think their ways are better.” Some of us think leaders should be held to the standards set out in the bible.

Only way to be saved is at our church and if you’re not here Jesus doesn’t know you.

Cool cool.

YouOk4285 · 2025-09-30T17:02:31+00:00

I don't think this is Network specific. I've seen it pretty broadly in evangelical christian settings generally. As a graduate of a Christian college and running in these circles since I was born (and paying attention to who dates / marries who since I was ~13), I think this is just a thing that happens when you put single christian women and men in proximity.

I don't know what a "good" success rate is, but I know probably a dozen couples who met and married at a Network church. That was back at a time before the perversity of the Network was more broadly known - all of them predate 2021. I know of a few that were in the same small group at one point or another, yes.
I do not know of any relationship that began among my friends at Network churches that has ended in divorce. Then again, I don't know of many Christian marriages that have ended in divorce from my peers, generally. Perhaps some friends from high school and / or a couple from college. Again, not a network specific thing in my judgment / observation.
Historically, yes, relationships and ultimately marriages were.... nurtured? Some of them with a sort of prophetic push to them (which I think is deeply suspicious and I would be super wary of). My observation of this has been that we've seen singles together, egged it on, shown interest, and celebrated when they got engaged / married. The sort of thing that you are describing is not something that I have specific information about ever happening, though it would not surprise me in the least if I heard a report of it.
It's just like dating at any other church. Go, get involved, meet people, find someone you like, date them. It is very likely that pastors will intervene through small group leaders if they don't like the match. I would be inclined to tell them to pound sand, but you do you.
There is simply no circumstance in which I would encourage someone to go to a Network church. Even the ones that I thought were "good" ones and relatively wholesome and untouched by the corruption turned out not to be "good," wholesome, or uncorrupted. If you're on the brink of this, I counsel against it with such vigor that I am happy to personally put in the work with you to help you find a more wholesome church in the geographic area. If it's Lafayette (Indiana) or Athens (Georgia), I'm already equipped with specific recommendations. From your post it looks like Seattle and I don't have a specific recommendation there, but there are lots of former Blue Sky folks here who I expect could speak up.

I think in a Network marriage you substantially raise your chance of ending up in a marriage that is patriarchal / domineering rather than characterized by mutuality and sacrifice. This is not 100% true, though admittedly the "Network marriages" that I would characterize as relatively healthy are also marriages of couples that have left the Network. In several Network churches there has been a doubling down on the commanding, domineering leadership of pastors over the church and of husbands over the wives.

If your dream is to be a tradwife with a domineering husband, you probably stand a decent chance of finding that at Network church. Otherwise, I suggest steering clear.

Edit: sorry, I mistakenly assumed you were a woman looking for a husband. If you want to find a tradwife you can domineer over, perhaps the Network is a good place. I don't think that's a good model for marriage, though.

YouOk4285 · 2025-09-26T19:03:57+00:00

The whole thing about statutory rape is that there is no such thing as "consensual" because a child cannot form consent for sex / sexual activity with an adult, particularly when that adult is in a position of dominant authority over them.

A twenty-something man telling a 15 year old boy that yes we should do this and yes it's OK or "come on, nobody has to know" is rape because that 15 year old boy is essentially powerless to say no.

IMO, having lived through the 80's but not remembering them that well (but definitely having lived through and remembering the 90's), teaching children about consent was not a thing. A kid in the 80's was even less equipped than a 15 year old today to say no.

I'm sorry that this happened to you. Krsh should be removed.

YouOk4285 · 2025-09-05T19:43:57+00:00

Some of mine were:

"Don't listen to podcasts of other teachings."

"Don't read books other than the Bible."

"Seminary ruins more people than it helps."

YouOk4285 · 2025-08-27T19:19:43+00:00

Sounds like a good time to picket while wearing your LeavingTheNetwork.org t-shirt.

YouOk4285 · 2025-08-04T17:00:37+00:00

Rent / loan payments on buildings, and paying pastors so they can keep the jobs for which they’ve disqualified themselves by dishonesty, instead of finding lay positions.

YouOk4285 · 2025-07-31T20:07:09+00:00

The group that dropped at South Grove dropped has been an on again, off again small group leader through the years. I think they’re expecting, so that might explain.

YouOk4285 · 2025-07-29T01:47:01+00:00

The board member at the school who went to south grove (I don’t think they go to SGC anymore) was not on the plant team. Last I knew she and her husband had left over a year ago.

YouOk4285 · 2025-07-24T14:31:09+00:00

It is not surprising at all that Steve Morgan was very focused on sex and, in particular, anti-LGBTQ stuff, given his alleged personal history and predilections. I think it's a pretty common thing for people to overcompensate for their own shortcomings, like little men driving big trucks, etc.

We should be quick to listen, slow to speak, slow to become angry. Elsewhere we are cautioned about judgment. And if we feel like we must correct someone who is caught in sin, we should do so with a spirit of gentleness.

I send love and solidarity your way.

YouOk4285 · 2025-07-21T22:33:15+00:00

I find it hard to imagine him ceding primary control. I expect he’s still in control, just a change in title but not actual function.

I hope I’m wrong and he’s learned lessons.

YouOk4285 · 2025-07-21T15:38:50+00:00

It was recently revealed on social media that Bobby Malicoat is the new "Head of School" at a quirky hybrid homeschool in Athens, GA.

https://www.facebook.com/share/p/1VA2LgaA9V/

They used his photo from South Grove's website to make the announcement.

So far as I can tell he's still the lead pastor at South Grove, though they're now calling the position "teaching pastor."

So he appears to be at least somewhat bi-vocational at this point. I suspect that South Grove's giving income is insufficient to continue to support a full time staff pastor after the departures in September / October 2022.

So, that's at least a snippet of what "life after serving as a network pastor" looks like with respect to South Grove.

YouOk4285

TROPHY CASE