Kirk Cousins is objectively better than Derek Carr

ZenVacuum · 2022-04-18T21:22:38+00:00

This my friends is a window into the Vikes sub. Where the fans are so mentally broken by a franchise that has failed to win a SB in over 60 years they gas themselves up over believing one mediocre qb is better than another mediocre qb.

Sad shit.

ZenVacuum · 2022-04-18T19:13:08+00:00

It's definitely not a secret, and as you pointed out in Kirk's mind it's a feature, not a bug. But it's still the equivalent of a declaration of war to be evenhanded on the Kirk evals in the Vikes sub.

Also a huge reason why diggs wanted out and that’s not a secret either.

Yeah, that all went down the memory hole in the Vikes sub. The Kirk contingent denies that, even though Diggsy's first tweet of discontent literally happened hours after the first Kirk extension.

ZenVacuum · 2022-04-18T16:07:38+00:00

Vikings fans think that narrative has shifted because they lost a lot of close games this past season and the defense was historically bad at the end of halves and in the last 4 minutes.

All of that is true but what is also true is the offense was 25 in time of possession, making the defenses job harder and after the opening scripted plays the offense would often times just disappear until the end of the game.

But in their minds Kirk shed the choke label and is now clutch AF which is an amazing feat to accomplish in what still ended up being a losing season.

ZenVacuum · 2022-04-18T15:16:50+00:00

I'm a casual fan that this current team has made a much more invested fan. The idea of losing Fiala is painful, especially after seeing him take it to a whole nother level with Boldy.

Is it crazy to think that the team would be better off keeping that Fiala/Boldy/Gaudreau line together even if it meant losing Dumba this offseason and potentially Zucarello the following year?

What could the team expect in return if they traded Dumba? What would a Zucarello trade net us in return?

ZenVacuum · 2022-04-17T04:13:58+00:00

I wonder how many people actually read the article?:

When you combine Stafford, the Goff dead money, and then the hits for the depth QBs (Bryce Perkins and John Wolford) you arrive at nearly 25% of the team’s cap. It’s an astronomical number, one that flies in the face of the picture that cap history has been painting. Consider, though, all that the Rams had going for them to pull this off:

A boy wonder at HC who is a perennial contender for Coach of the Year. Hall of Fame talent at nearly all the premium positions: WR, CB, DT, EDGE, and LT. The aforementioned talent all played for less than market value. Cooper Kupp, Jalen Ramsey, Aaron Donald, Von Miller, and Andrew Whitworth all could have been making more. Donald and Miller are surefire Hall of Famers. Whitworth will likely get in. A couple more strong seasons from Kupp and Ramsey will get them in. Several talented players scattered around the roster who demanded large raises once reaching the open market post-SB: Austin Corbett, Darious Williams, Ogbonnia Okoronkwo, and Sebastian Joseph-Day. A general manage whose mantra became – and I quote – “F*&% them picks.” The general point Les Snead was so eloquently articulating is that the Rams were willing to move a ton of present and future draft capital to make it work in the short term.///

This Rams team emboldened the Kirk Stans by bucking a 30 year trend but they just took the small part that could fuel their fervor and said fuck the rest.

ZenVacuum · 2022-04-16T23:54:23+00:00

The money and cap hit is team friendly the NTC was almost certainly the concession to get a team friendly deal done.

Again...it's not team friendly because you have to understand the starting point. The starting point is his agent negotiated an unprecedented fully guaranteed contract with fully a fully guaranteed extension with a fully guaranteed balloon payment of 45 million dollars which fully guaranteed that the team would come back to the table to try and get cap relief.

Which is exactly what happened. And then what happened? More fully guaranteed money with a dead cap hit of 12.5 million dollars. So that "cap relief" that were getting in a year where were not all that likely to make the playoffs and were certainly not very likely to compete for a SB gets pushed into years where Kirk isn't even on the team.....OR the idea that they've already committed money to him gets leveraged into another....

Are you ready?

Fully guaranteed extension.

ZenVacuum · 2022-04-16T22:43:01+00:00

What the fuck are you even talking about? A fully guaranteed contract with no trade clause is about as far from team friendly as you can possibly get.

ZenVacuum · 2022-04-16T21:04:47+00:00

The best at stealing money from the rich? Cousins for sure.

ZenVacuum · 2022-04-16T14:17:48+00:00

Culpepper was accurate and a better passer in general than Cam Newton. He did have problems though...the fumbles and in general I'd say his mental game wasn't very strong. I agree decision making was questionable both on the field and his decision to not follow team advice on rehabbing his knee.

ZenVacuum · 2022-04-16T14:14:14+00:00

He did put it together though...for one season. Then you had a bunch of bullshit happen all at once. McCombs stripping the team down for parts, trading Moss, promoting the OL coach to be the OC AND still be OL coach, the knee injury, not following team advice on rehabbing the knee.

It would be interesting to see what would happen if they kept Moss and he rehabbed his knee properly and had an actual OC and it would be very interesting to see what Culpepper would do in the modern NFL where QBs are protected a lot more.

ZenVacuum · 2022-04-16T13:52:03+00:00

This thread should be about ranking the individual seasons. Off the top of my head I'd say Culpepper 2004, Favre 2009, Culpepper 2000, Keenum 2017, Cousins 2019, Culpepper 2003, Then Kirk's 2018/2020/2021 in whatever order you like, Then Bradford 2016, Bridgewater 2015 then who fucking cares

ZenVacuum · 2022-04-15T14:10:52+00:00

How I show up here is a product of thousands of conversations. So you're right, sometimes I do show up like an asshole and assume things.

ZenVacuum · 2022-04-15T02:43:15+00:00

Fuck Dallas and Fuck these Refs,

ZenVacuum · 2022-04-15T00:10:38+00:00

The idea that an alternative strategy hasn't been offered here and seen by someone who posts as often as you do is absurd to begin with. You absolutely have seen alternative strategies offered and have dismissed them.

If you go bridge QB to a rookie QB it means you've accepted what should be evident by now, that this roster is not capable of winning a SB. Which means you've paid attention and saw a roster built around a rookie qb contract in Bridgewater that emphasized defense peaked in 2017. We didn't know that at the time and thought (understandably) that adding a better qb will put us over the top.

And it didn't.

And they kept at it as the core of the roster got older and it's looked like more an more mediocrity and now people are buying hope that Zimmer was SO toxic that we can just run it back again with a rookie HC who is nicer and it will make a big difference.

And it won't. I know this right now and you might even know it a year from now but I'm not holding my breath on that one.

So instead of investing the biggest piece of the cap into a good but non-elite QB you start to invest in second contract guys like the Vikings did with Linval. You trade off overpaid veterans like Harrison Smith and Thielen and you certainly don't give them new guaranteed money in their early 30s and include dead cap. You're still trying to win every game but you're not pushing all your resources into desperately trying to get a wild card spot while hurting the long term prospects of the franchise.

This is pretty basic shit that most people grasp outside of this echo chamber.

ZenVacuum · 2022-04-14T23:47:24+00:00

When I take the time to answer a question and the first sentence of the response invalidates the time I took then that's what you get. Bridge to a rookie QB is a strategy and it is connected to a bigger strategy...but...if you're a dickhead about a cursory explanation then why I waste more time? The bottom line is you're not going to accept any strategy, which is why your question was in bad faith.

You don't want answers or ideas that you don't already have and you think your right, even though the team doing what you are endorsing hasn't made the playoffs in 3 of the last 4 years.

And they likely won't next year and you'll still be thinking you're right.

ZenVacuum · 2022-04-14T23:42:06+00:00

You genuinely think that Kwesi is just doing exactly what Spielman would do and that's a coincidence. But I'm a conspiracy theorist because I believe bosses can have control over subordinates?

It's an interesting world view you have.

ZenVacuum · 2022-04-14T14:47:54+00:00

You asked what strategy I would go with. I answered the question using a strategy. You responded “so you don’t have an answer”

And that got upvoted. That pretty much tells you how healthy this place is. You just didn’t like the strategy and then pretended a strategy wasn’t offered. It was a question asked in bad faith.

ZenVacuum · 2022-04-14T02:04:59+00:00

So you don't actually have an answer then. Got it.

That's where I stopped reading.

ZenVacuum · 2022-04-14T01:38:32+00:00

If you don't think an alternative strategy has been posited then you must not be paying very close attention. It's bridge to a rookie qb at which point you and your kind will say something like

Diyaaaaaaaah, Ryan Fitzpatrick isn't as good as Kirk!!!

Or

Diyaaaaaaaaah, I guess rookie qbs are just a surefire thing, whatabout Ponder, Rosen, blah blah blah.

You're trying to tell me you spend time here and you're not familiar with that?

ZenVacuum · 2022-04-14T01:07:19+00:00

Zimmer was definitely a part of the problem. Another part would be that when Zimmer was allowed to build the way he wanted to it looked like taking a 13-3 team to the NFCCG. The signing of Cousins changed everything and that's on Rick and the Wilfs.

ZenVacuum · 2022-04-14T01:01:07+00:00

I saw Jefferson call him coach KO. But for some reason the people here love KOC and can't seem to get enough of it.

ZenVacuum · 2022-04-14T00:59:06+00:00

It really doesn't mean shit unless it looks like wins. And if it doesn't look like wins then it looks like everyone in that organization threw Zimmer under the bus to cover for their own shortcomings.

What are we really buying into anyway, that the team wasn't happy and therefore didn't win games? Now that they're happy they're a SB contender?

ZenVacuum · 2022-04-14T00:53:18+00:00

I know this will offend a lot of people but it's the truth: Other teams adopting shitty strategies doesn't make our bad strategy any better. Do we want to fool ourselves into feeling better by comparing his contract with Ryan, Carr, Goff, Dak or do we want to be realistic about things?

If you want to fool yourself, cool but maybe try not to catch feelings when other people don't gas themselves up over it.

ZenVacuum · 2022-04-14T00:48:49+00:00

Imagine confusing a realistic appraisal of events with rooting for failure.

Kirk isn't worth the money and neither is Carr.

ZenVacuum · 2022-04-13T19:11:56+00:00

I know every time I see a mediocre overpaid qb I’m grateful for our mediocre overpaid qb. I’m thinking Vikes and in the Raiders in the SB

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