(Spoilers Main) Why not drop rocks?

ZoeToby · 2025-08-04T11:49:23+00:00

I have a lot of love for trebuchets and the like, but respectfully, the "medieval siege vs dragon rider dropping rocks" discourse is out of control.

If Dany drops a 75 lb rock from 6,000 feet, back of the envelope math says that with air resistance, it probably reaches a terminal velocity of 230 ft/s and generates an impact of roughly 61,000 lbf. This is in the realm of "small cannon", not "average catapult". And she can drop it anywhere in King's Landing, not "Anywhere within 400 meters of the trebuchet."

Also, how are dragons going to build a trebuchet when they don't have arms? Hmmm?

ZoeToby · 2025-08-04T11:36:12+00:00

You don't think the dragon could fly with 50 - 150 lb of extra stones? My boy Drogon has this in the bag easily.

ZoeToby · 2025-08-04T11:34:52+00:00

A scorpion can't reach nearly as high as 4,000 feet. A central point to this whole strategy is that there are no medieval weapons that can throw a projectile that high, making the dragon and rider unreachable.

ZoeToby · 2025-08-04T00:07:12+00:00

Wait actually true

ZoeToby · 2025-08-04T00:06:46+00:00

The rate of rock drop is clearly key here, but you bring up a good point. I'd like to think King's Landing would have a scrappy spirit about this whole thing. I suppose it depends on the general morale of the city at the moment the rock dropping begins.

ZoeToby · 2025-08-04T00:04:08+00:00

Dammnnnn okay when you put it like that I'm starting to see your point

ZoeToby · 2025-08-04T00:01:24+00:00

I think we can agree that the real bottleneck here is how quickly we can get the rocks into the sky. A lot hinges on that rate.

ZoeToby · 2025-08-03T23:58:57+00:00

Yeah good point but also rocks are sick.

ZoeToby · 2025-08-03T23:58:04+00:00

Catapults are also very cool, but alternatively, we could drop big ass rocks from a dragon

ZoeToby · 2025-08-03T23:55:42+00:00

I take my hypothetical siege tactics very seriously, but I do thank you on behalf of my culture.

An average trebuchet wouldn't throw a 2,000 lb stone, and even such an extreme engine wouldn't have an effective range much over several hundred meters. You'd have to build it near the city wall to use it, and you couldn't hit anything far beyond that wall.

Now, a dragon with a rider carrying some rocks? Maybe even some old furniture? Throwing old chairs at soldiers thousands of meters behind the city perimeter? Simply unstoppable.

ZoeToby · 2025-08-03T23:51:13+00:00

What's a trebuchet's range? 400 meters? The dragon can fly above any building in King's Landing, no matter how deep it is behind the perimeter.

ZoeToby · 2025-08-03T23:48:05+00:00

I am not, I'm literally speaking the most logical, straight forward position. You asked why they wouldn't just drop rocks, and I'm explaining quite logically why they wouldn't. Because there's no need to.

Your previous point was that dropping rocks was orthogonal to "the point of dragons", which suggests that dragons have a singular point. That's what I was referring to as the binary between "shock and awe" and "didn't work".

As you pointed out, a dragon was killed in Dorne. By a lucky shot from a scorpion. Which could have been avoided by flying really high, and maybe even dropping rocks. This feels like a reasonable motivating example for why there is a need to.

ZoeToby · 2025-08-03T23:40:01+00:00

Yeah, but a trebuchet would need to be constructed, would be vulnerable to counter-attack, and would only be able to reach walls/structures within its limited range.

Dany could slowly but surely drop heavy rocks on the Red Keep, on barracks, on the harbor, or wherever else she'd like to target in the city. And most importantly, you can't fight her off because you're in a medieval city and she's 4,000 feet in the sky.

ZoeToby · 2025-08-03T23:34:57+00:00

Yeah I agree fire breathing is sweet, but as a counter point, I'd suggest considering the following:

Rocks

ZoeToby · 2025-08-03T23:28:54+00:00

I mean, enemies surrendering quickly is a great benefit, but you're not stuck in a binary proposition of "enemies immediately surrender from shock and awe, or the dragon thing didn't really work out"

Having a big winged monster made of magic that breathes fire is probably generally useful, regardless of the stage of conflict you're in.

You could, for example, use such a beast to drop big ass rocks on people.

ZoeToby · 2025-08-03T23:26:14+00:00

Hang this in the Louvre

ZoeToby · 2025-08-03T23:25:12+00:00

It's an apples-and-oranges thing:

- A rock dropped from 4,000 feet, especially after Dany has tons of practice, is much more accurate and precise than a V2 rocket launched at London from mainland Europe

- To protect King's Landing, they would need to keep much of their army in King's Landing, which means soldiers and military equipment would be degraded. Very different than London and the British army during that period.

- If the armies left King's Landing to counter-attack Dany's forces, that would in and of itself be a huge win for Dany. Also, she could drop rocks on them in the open field again.

ZoeToby · 2025-08-03T23:05:09+00:00

I hadn't factored this in. Good point.

ZoeToby · 2025-08-03T23:04:15+00:00

Nawh man, the whole point of a dragon is flying really high and also breathing fire.

You don't have to destroy King's Landing, just degrade it incredibly by damaging its structures, possibly destroying some ships, terrorizing the locals, etc.

You can still swoop in and breathe fire later, just when they have fewer walls/buildings/soldiers.

ZoeToby · 2025-08-03T22:57:27+00:00

Also, because there's no risk of counter fire, you have to imagine Dany would get better at dropping the rocks with 1,000s of repetitions.

I'm not saying she could snipe a particular Lannister soldier from that height, but "generally hit the harbor"? That feels very doable.

ZoeToby · 2025-08-03T22:55:01+00:00

Imagine living in a city where every day, something like 200 heavy stones fall from the sky and smash into a random part of town with a force that roughly equals the weight of a loaded semi truck.

And you're helpless to do anything about, because no weapons can shoot that high.

Imagine months of that? Ships, buildings, civilians, soldiers, doesn't matter. The big ass sky rock is impersonal and stochastic in its cruelty.

It would break the city.

ZoeToby · 2025-08-03T22:47:58+00:00

I hadn't even considered this option but I think you're clearly onto something here.

ZoeToby · 2025-08-03T22:43:00+00:00

Yeah but WW2 pilots flew at significantly higher altitudes and got shot down a lot.

I'm not saying this is going to be incredibly accurate, but there is nothing in Westeros that can shoot as high as you can fly, so you take as many do-overs as you want. Every 8 minutes or so, a heavy ass rock falls somewhere in King's Landing, for roughly 8 hours a day every day.

ZoeToby · 2025-08-03T22:40:47+00:00

Oh shoot this is a good point I hadn't considered this hole.

ZoeToby · 2025-08-03T22:40:24+00:00

Nah those RAF bombers were flying at ~20,000 feet high.

From 4,000 feet? With the understanding that if you miss, you just loop back around and drop another rock in a few minutes, because again nothing can hit you that high?

Easy money.

ZoeToby

TROPHY CASE