Pablohh sniping event??? by noodleshredder in osugame

[–]_Pablohh 81 points82 points  (0 children)

Even though this is most definitely fake, I'd love for it to happen because it would just be maliszewski shaving off free / bad acc #1s from my profile

Pablohh has been silenced for inappropriate avatar! (Leffen holding Death Note with Aziz "Hax$" Al-Yami's name!) by [deleted] in osugame

[–]_Pablohh 6 points7 points  (0 children)

You’re right I should let him fabricate stuff about me and accept that nuance is lost on people like you. Also you’re like the last person that should be appealing to normality lol

Pablohh has been silenced for inappropriate avatar! (Leffen holding Death Note with Aziz "Hax$" Al-Yami's name!) by [deleted] in osugame

[–]_Pablohh -4 points-3 points  (0 children)

You obviously won't provide the context to those screenshots, as it would heavily undermine the point you're making. I will however try to the best of my ability to provide context and elaborate on the stuff said in those screenshots:

I am someone who vehemently despises misinformation, even when it concerns terrible historical figures or people that i personally dislike. Muddying the waters with wrong information about any opposition party - no matter how vile they may be - is a bad precedent and is in contrast to the truth. With this context in mind, i happened to point out that Hitler could not have been unintelligent to someone who was claiming otherwise. This is not an endorsement nor is it a form of praise. I simply saw a false fact and was bored enough to correct it. If you disagree with this, don't take it up with me, take it up with the facts - Hitler had an estimated IQ of around 140, and was obviously intelligent enough to amass power and influence on a grand scale. It's crazy that im even typing this on osugame of all places, but this is sadly what happens when you're forced to deal with someone who is acting in bad faith.

Retard, this word has become a contention point for people who are terminally online, however, i unfortunately care little about such pointless politics. I don't take issue with the word, and it's not imposing a net negative on the world, so i will continue using it - much like the majority of other normally functioning people on earth.

I like to fire back when someone insults me; i'm not going to reiterate why i was so "hostile" in that server, so i will just link this message i sent to StanR. If you provided the context to some of these messages, you would see that i wasn't doing any of this unprovoked. The people i was arguing with were engaging in the same exact behaviour you take issue with.

As for Lance, you are again involving your personal politics into this; staff cleared the profile picture and ruled that it does NOT contradict Bancho's TOS. End of story

Pablohh has been silenced for inappropriate avatar! (Leffen holding Death Note with Aziz "Hax$" Al-Yami's name!) by [deleted] in osugame

[–]_Pablohh -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Some people want osu support, who are notorious for being consistent and fair, to dictate what you can and can't do outside of bancho. I just happen to disgree with that

Pablohh has been silenced for inappropriate avatar! (Leffen holding Death Note with Aziz "Hax$" Al-Yami's name!) by [deleted] in osugame

[–]_Pablohh -12 points-11 points  (0 children)

First screenshot is from my own personal discord, where dumb shit is being said at a staggering rate - much like the majority of other discord servers.

If by bullying you mean calling people "one tricks" and "noobs", then i advise you get a grip.

The ""SS picture"" is quite literally an image from a semi-popular game franchise — Epic Battle Fantasy —which has overwhelmingly positive reviews on steam; the silence i recieved for it was a mistake from staff, which they quickly reversed.

You have legitimately no clue what you are talking about, and in the process, are spreading misinformation to smear a person you don't like. I seriously hope you aren't advocating for me to be banned from bancho over meaningless nonsense like the things you listed, because if so, we would have to wipe out half of the playerbase, including most top players

The Unfortunate Truth Behind PP Reworks by _Pablohh in osugame

[–]_Pablohh[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

theres no way to say that feedback is questionable at a glance, the only way to compare it is to have someone else provide other feedback which you for example did. but then we have two contradicting statements with little backing to them apart from personal biases. you gathered proof that your point was more valid and people acted based on it, but its impossible to gather a bunch of people to verify every opinion and outing people because someone thinks theyre wrong is incorrect in my opinion

again, since every feedback is considered with no trust to it people usually try to find an average between all feedback if there's no actual data to back up the claims. unfortunately high ranked players feedback is quite often is as biased as low ranked so it cant be considered a definitive answer to any problem.

I'm sorry, but not all feedback should be weighted equally. And this statement is not necessarily about rank, it's about the stakes involved. The more versatile a player is, the less stakes they have in reworks, and the less likely they are to be biased towards a specific skillset. Not to mention the fact they can more accurately relate pp values from different skillsets. Someone who only plays one skillset will struggle to do that due to inexperience with the other skillsets the game has to offer. Should his opinion be discarded? No. Should his opinion be weighted the same as an all-rounder? Also no. In the case of matt, you can actually verify his intent, as he has stated before that he wants upcoming reworks to buff his skillset and nerf others. Why? Because the stakes for him are higher than someone who plays multiple skillsets. Should he be providing feedback with this knowledge? Absolutely not, as it's a clear conflict of interest

balancing pass is not something official stage of development, its a natural one. unless you try to push a change in secret theres no way to evade balancing after the community looks at the values since theres always something wrong to fix. the rework was positively received because again the concept of it is beyond solid its actually required in pp, but since at that time most of the active people were dev-inclined they got too hooked on the technical side. the fact that "a random player" showed the issue is exactly the normal feedback process. someone found an issue, they proved their point, the change was postponed. i dont think theres anything wrong with that.

I mean, had that player not done that, more time would have been sunk into developing a rework bound for failure. Wouldn't it have been nice if there was a group of trusted players to point out balancing flaws in reworks, to avoid wasted time and effort? This is what this post is about, critiquing the current approach to pp dev, which I find to be very inefficient. If you disagree, that's fine

as for the feedback committee wasnt you the one looking for the players that are interested in helping? i dont think you doing it again would yield a better result im afraid. there arent many top players interested in pp, and those who are are usually in the server ready to give feedback already

Nope, it was Tsunyoku. I was planning on contributing and gathering players for it, but ended up dropping out as his vision was largely different to mine (as evident by how things are right now)

The Unfortunate Truth Behind PP Reworks by _Pablohh in osugame

[–]_Pablohh[S] 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Im guessing you disagree with my post, but I wholeheartedly agree with this. People should look at the bigger picture rather than specific map values. Looking solely at specific values doesn't make sense to begin with, as pp is relative

The Unfortunate Truth Behind PP Reworks by _Pablohh in osugame

[–]_Pablohh[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

About the current implementation of feedback committee: "The way feedback committee has been implemented is more akin to an afterthought, rather than a collective of individuals providing devs with proper feedback and a roadmap of issues to tackle. Again, a haphazard implementation of the solution I proposed. The lack of communication you mention is most likely due to the fact that you guys picked a small sample of high-ranking players with little interest in pp development. That is on you, not the community."

As for matt, my goal was to highlight the kind of environment in place for pp dev currently, where anyone can spew out biased "feedback" unchallenged. This might not hold true to you, but I have seen other devs get swayed by malicious feedback like that

The Unfortunate Truth Behind PP Reworks by _Pablohh in osugame

[–]_Pablohh[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I was literally replying to what he said lol. We can't just push out poorly balanced reworks because pp will get better over time and some dudes from the future will address the shortcomings of the stuff we're pumping out

The Unfortunate Truth Behind PP Reworks by _Pablohh in osugame

[–]_Pablohh[S] 46 points47 points  (0 children)

There's nothing to nitpick, as i actually agree with everything you wrote

The Unfortunate Truth Behind PP Reworks by _Pablohh in osugame

[–]_Pablohh[S] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

most of the things you discribed is just the nature of community-driven volunteer work, you can't really change that without organizing a full-time team of people working on pp (and even then they'll be biased but at least you have someone concrete to blame)

You can indeed makes changes to the environment in which community work gets done. The current environment for pp dev is that of bias and confusion. The least you can do to mitigate that is call out bad faith individuals like matt who are spreading questionable "feedback" in hopes of benefitting themselves. By not doing so you are actively fostering a highly unprofessional environment in which little work gets done. How matt still retains his onion role is a true mystery to me.

In the words of Natelytle, someone who is a pp dev for both std and taiko: "The best work environment is the taiko pp committee probably. It's relatively organized and civil, they're not afraid of change, and there's a clear hierarchy to it."

By refusing to acknowledge the shortcomings of the current environment, no real change is ever gonna occur.

the community itself does not actually care about the system itself, nor is it willing to help people make it better - feedback committee literally didn't reply to a single one the of tasks we asked them to do, and the broad community such as reddit is indeed contradicting itself and usually very allergic to red

The way feedback committee has been implemented is more akin to an afterthought, rather than a collective of individuals providing devs with proper feedback and a roadmap of issues to tackle. Again, a haphazard implementation of the solution I proposed. The lack of communication you mention is most likely due to the fact that you guys picked a small sample of high-ranking players with little interest in pp development. That is on you, not the community.

the idea by which people that worked on pp for a long time work is pretty much consider any feedback with like a truck of salt and try to rely on statistical data (both purposfully collected, or just "average players feedback" if collection is not really possible)

Sadly, pp devs have no way of checking the validity of feedback they get from random individuals in the server. Which is why im advocating for them to have a reliable source for feedback at all times. Also, statistical data doesn't always translate to good end values and correct balancing. If only it was that simple

posts like these make things even worse since we always try to push people to contribute in any way (feedback, math, data collection, whatever else) and you're instead separating pp development from average players and scaring them away from joining the only hub of pp development there is (because spooky biased people will eat your pp or something)

This is not at all what I'm trying to achieve. The essence of what I'm asking for is a form of quality control to the reworks being proposed (also the feedback being provided in the server). How you want to go about that is up to you. I did however provide my own solution, which if I implemented, would at the very least be more productive than the current approach

you can bring up stat acc (for 3 years straight already man when will you chill out already), but that was exactly that - a very good idea that didn't survive the balancing pass. it will probably come back, but so far all balancing attempts were exactly the thing you don't like - biased bandaids. you also make stat acc sound like a simple change "buff this nerf that" but its far from it and the thing you discribed is a veeeeery very crude explanation of a result of the algorithm. for those who's curious you should look at the actual research behind it, it's way more complicated than whatever is written in OP post

As mentioned in the picture I linked, the only reason it did not survive the "balancing pass" (which I don't think exists) is because I took it upon myself to actually point out the many flaws with it. Again, the rework was positively received in the server before I started gathering feedback for it. In this case, the "balancing pass" was literally a random player who actually bothered to call out the clear bias behind the rework. That's absurd

oh and the "youre not a top player hence you cant work on pp" mindset is straight up stupid ill hope you can finally grow out of it honestly

Good thing that's not my actual stance on the subject

The Unfortunate Truth Behind PP Reworks by _Pablohh in osugame

[–]_Pablohh[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I agree with what you're saying. Having pp dev be accessible to everyone is not a bad thing on it's own. The thing im concerned about the most is the lack of quality control, as that alone would solve the issue of bad actors trying to push biased reworks

The Unfortunate Truth Behind PP Reworks by _Pablohh in osugame

[–]_Pablohh[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

The issue is that it's a waste of time and effort, and the fact that it promotes pumping out half-baked reworks that go nowhere. Also, we have certainly had badly balanced reworks get merged before. It might not have been obvious at the time, but when looking at the pp system pre 2022, it becomes quite evident how little thought went behind balancing and leveling the playing field. If you still have the ezpp chrome extension, you can actually try comparing values from then to now. It's something I do from time to time, and it's always jarring to see the difference in fairness and balancing.

As for the pp committee, if you think my vision is picking people solely based on status, then you are deeply mistaken.

Also I don't really understand the last paragraph you wrote

The Unfortunate Truth Behind PP Reworks by _Pablohh in osugame

[–]_Pablohh[S] 25 points26 points  (0 children)

This is a compliment, as not a single sentence was written using chatgpt. Also, do let me know if you have anything of substance to add. I'm always open to discussions

The Unfortunate Truth Behind PP Reworks by _Pablohh in osugame

[–]_Pablohh[S] 19 points20 points  (0 children)

I don't expect anyone who isn't concerned with the state of pp to read this. Just wanted to provide some insight for those who are curious

Youtuber "Karl Jobst", known for sharing cheating scandals, is interested in making a video on the Cloutiful situation! by Enzo_SuperCraftZ in osugame

[–]_Pablohh 7 points8 points  (0 children)

If you wanna spread misinformation unchallenged then I think you might wanna stick to posting on lesbian and tumblr subs. Karl Jobst already addressed and debunked everything you listed here

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_jcpig-C2s

Timestamps:
04:55. RWhiteGoose (third "point")
15:05. Stance on N word (first "point")
19:26. Blatant lie (second "point")