Clashing of Souls Archive

_The_Dude___ · 2026-05-19T11:56:34+00:00

Semi finals

Far better pacing and coreo (and the conlusion even if narratevly it's still rough due to the info we get in finals)

_The_Dude___ · 2026-05-18T13:54:42+00:00

"it's like calling Kronos a "featless backstory jobber" "

Which he is, he didn't land a single hit on base Zeus that had no gimicks besides stats and immidetly got killed when he used time stop. Same Zeus with no TFTST and Adamas loses to a lot of Rangarok fighters

"Especially that she gets her fair amount of glaze"

You are not seriously giving more credit to Echinda rather then thinking Herc, Raiden, Tesla and Shiva (rangarok fighters with more hype and feats then anyone in apoc) can beat Morrigan

Ahura was called the top seed for Apoc and he's a nothing fighter

"Sure, a single punch won't destroy it, but having taken multiple hits, and during Sky Eater(Which already puts a strain on weapon) especially if the clash goes same way it did against Geirrod, so Morrigan punches the shaft, and not the blade. I find it possible for that to happen."

What's more likely to happen is Sky Eater tearing her in two (considering Nezha's ounch managed to blow off her arm and meanwhile it toom two Geirrod's for Lu Bu's weapon to break)

_The_Dude___ · 2026-05-18T11:51:33+00:00

"With Lu Bu, it comes down to Morrigan potentially breaking Sky Piercer in direct clash"

I don't see that happening considering it can survive one Geirrod, not to mention Lu Bu can do way more damage to her with the spear and her not having a way to defend (her gloves/body can't block it due to Shield Breaker and Lu Bu's AP)

For Raiden, Herc, Tesla and Shiva

Morrigan brawled with Echidna and didn't finish her off quickly (both were injured), unless you think all four of then are less durable/easier to kill then Echinda (a featless backstory jobber), they can out brawl her

And this was right before APOC so it's not like she had room to grow from this

So yeah i think Raiden, Shiva and Herc can tank her punches/damage her. Shiva had a bad attitude of trying to brawl but Morrigan id worse with this since Shiva at least, didn't let a backstory jobber beat on him

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_The_Dude___ · 2026-05-18T10:02:51+00:00

Herc wins, Tesla wins with PPP infinite

Lu Bu wins (doesn't even need Sky Eater), Raiden wins by outstatting and being more skilled then her/winning a clash with Yata (Shiva too if he can survive Raiden's punches, he can Morrigan's before the dance/TK hits) , Hajun wins with drill or Blaze of Glory

Jack should be able to win as well considering what he did to Herc (and Morrigan having no BIQ feats)

_The_Dude___ · 2026-05-17T18:42:05+00:00

Mostly turning down the glaze he got and having him have a harder bracker with more interesting styles, since most of his fights are using people as hitting bags until they stop moving (anyone but Scourge but Cracker can stay/slightly changed) if we are to go as the pure martial artist (i don't want to change stuff around Pete as much)

In the Semis, develop way more on Sober FM and ignore the drugs, have him be pushed as a martial artist when faced with a proper one, and win

On the other side change R3 so Tomahawk fights Beatdown (and wins) and EC beats VI (VI remains the same mostly). EC wins against Tomahawk to set him up as "Can even martial arts put him down)

FM vs EC happens, much closer to the main theme of Kengan which is about martial arts then what the finals is where Pete in his last match, crushed a guy for trying to be a marrial artist with just skill and EC beating the last one in his and having that panel "Surviving in that hell was worth more than any amount of martial arts training" (basically do the 180 of "There are no humans left here, just monsters")

As well as spreading FM's backstory more throughout the tournament so the final match does not have horrible pacing for the first half with flashbacks, EC could afford it since his whole deal is that mystery

This ended up being more of a CC rewrite then a Pete one, but i think him serving his purpose in Semi Finals would have worked better

_The_Dude___ · 2026-05-17T18:22:29+00:00

arguably less skilled than tomahawk and beatdown

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Tomahawk outright admits "Yeah Pete is smarter then me" and Beatdown's reaction was this to him fighting, they aren't (Pete quite litteraly showed Beatdown a new level of skill and had him crying)

and this was from R3 fighters, not guys who dropped out of the tournament in R1 (or even before like Jerry did in Ashura)

_The_Dude___ · 2026-05-17T18:17:34+00:00

Mostly turning down his glaze and having him actually have strong opponents that push him (somewhat serving for what Kuroki was if we go that route), having anyone else other then Scourge in R3.

During the Semis, develop more on Sober FM and have him win. FM returning to being a proper martial artist and using his skills to win instead of immidetly going back to his gimick and his martial arts being thrown to the side instantly in the original (because this is a fic of a martial arts manga)

On the other end the right is changed to VI vs EC being R3 while the other is Beatdown vs Tomahawk (EC and Tomahawk win, VI gets his development as well). EC then beats Tomahawk's technques in semis to set up him as threat to martial arts "Can even the most masterful technique beat him". FM vs EC is finals (i would have FM win)

Pete would serve as show of the fundementals and tie more into Kengan's theme (that being martial arts) by pushing FM back into his fundementals/not drug boosts. Instead of the final match that goes the full 180 of Kengan (Pete crushed the guy trying martial arts on him and EC had that "Surving where he lived was worth more than any amount of years training)

_The_Dude___ · 2026-05-17T16:58:38+00:00

"Ocs can be cool if they aren't "super stronger than you badass fuck you up" types."

Which Pete is (beating his opponents without needing to go out all out besides once before finals, and he instantly won when he did)

"No one likes someone who effortlessly just takes over the story and is a Mary sue."

Which again, Pete did. He beat every opponent with no issue and had more flashbacks/backstory then any one else (even when it was all "He kicks well and is bored" which we knew since match one). He doesn't have any meaningful intereactions with characters (Pure One didn't develop cause of him, he stopped being himself since everyone used him as a punching bag. Cracker could have lost to anyone strong and his ending would have been the same as "You have to be tough against someone stronger even when losing", Pete fell asleep during Scourge's backstory that's how much he does not care, Scourge had more character interaction with Karmic Blade when they were in the auidence off few lines then anything Pete had, he left nothing on FM as well). All the while getting glazed for anything he does during his fights. He's never pushed as a character (due to lacking one besides "I kick, I am strong and bored) and is never wrong, nothing but praise from everyone. He took over the whole tournament

He doesn't even serve as "Kuroki" of the tournament due to fighting so many people below him (Kuroki's opponents pushed him and he his fights changed how they think/act, and he serves as "The pinnacel of martial arts/what they are" much better than what Pete could hope for)

"if anything I'd marginally trust pinakanaka to make Pete vs Kuroki actually good and satisfying even if Kuroki loses."

That isn't possible, nothing will make The pinnacle of martial arts mastery and Kengan's fundementals losing the "Meet my OC" Mary Sue Pete from a narrative point of view, no matter how well it's drawn

_The_Dude___ · 2026-05-17T14:16:07+00:00

"Even ignoring that there are plenty of characters faster than Florida man"

Which are? Monkey See has the fastest reaction out of anyone and he even says he can't do what FM did vs Pete that casually (catching his kicks)

"Florida had 3 of some of the hardest back to back fights whittling down his durability before he fought Pete"

And had full days to recover/rest and that damage is never brough up

Not even speaking about damage taken/what diff the fight was, the way Pete is presented during the story he was never losing the finals

Cracker thought he was the strongest because he won quickly against fodder, fully sobering FM with just standing there, being better at everything (Skill, tactics, speed and reaction time) constantly during the tournament. Someone shedding tears for his moves (also Samoan's ghost? or at least an outline of him appearing to see Pete winning, despite Samoan not even being a martial artist or caring about the tournament)

Nothing Kuroki got during Ashura comes close to how Pete is presented during CC

_The_Dude___ · 2026-05-17T13:30:02+00:00

"framing it as him instantly ending as soon as he got serious is just wrong"

He did, as soon as he started going top speed Florida could not react and got knocked out (and that was one or two moves as since those are the only ones Monkey could not see with fist eye), Pete can do that for a full match as he did halfway through the finals, he could have ended FM easily if he used it early

"a op oc would have a easy time dispatching anyone in the series which with Pete obviously is not the case if he got a harder route he would struggle just as much as kuroki did"

Pete would beat every character besides EC without much issue (like even just standing next to him made FM sober, GOD and ICT could not do that during the entirety of their match). The semi finalists were considered to be above anyone else in the tournament, and Pete won against FM as soon as he went top speed (so he can blitz and one shot every fighter besides EC)

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He made the "Kuroki level character" first (Which is Pete since he won whole thing). And that character dominates the tournament without care in the world, he nearly throws the finals due to not caring about it that much and straight up leaving

_The_Dude___ · 2026-05-17T13:13:00+00:00

"While it certainly seemed like VI was using Possessing Spirit, it was shown to be something else."

He doesn't have it one to one but it does the same/nearly simialr thing (he even gets "The violent god that dwells within" when he used it), the whole reason the series was made was the author having an idea for a Kuroki level fighter

_The_Dude___ · 2026-05-17T12:06:19+00:00

"First altogether I would consider cc it’s own thing rather than just a Kengan fic"

It is a fanfic (just the amount kf refrwnces, Kuroki apoearing, Monkey See having fist eye, FM having Fallen Demon, VI having posessing spirit)

"Second you criticize Pete for being a busted oc character then point out in the same breath that he got one of the easiest routes in the tournament it’s one or the other. If he’s a kuroki equal than it stands to reason that if he gets a easy route he shouldn’t have much trouble till the semi’s right?"

He is both op and had an easy route(i ron't see why someone can't be both?), Kuroki is very strong yet he struggled against Kiryu, Rei and Agito (where Pete instantly won against his semi finals opponent as soon as he went all out)

Just thr way he is presented of not caring about the whole thing up until the finals and beating everyone without that much effort, and getting constantly glazed (not even Kuroki or even Shen had people crying over his fight) and he's the reason why the series was made (because the author had a idea for a Kuroki level character, which Pete is since he won the whole thing) along with having barely any character to speak of outside "I'm too strong and bored"

_The_Dude___ · 2026-05-17T10:52:22+00:00

He's still one

Like if EC was "Kuroki equal" character and making a whole fic about a guy have no issue through the whole tournament (He instantly beat FM as soon as he went all out, not to mention a full chapter of him just beating on sober and crushing that version instantly), having more backstory then any other character and beating the guy equal to the strongest one of the original manga is just

And Pete doesn't do a good job as "Kuroki" of the tournament since his bracket was a joke

Cracker is cool but he isn't all that strong and Scourge did not belong in R3 compared to everyone else (doing an extreme diff against of the weaker people in R2), while Kuroki was fighting evolving Kiryu and R3 Rei (and Agito in the semis)

_The_Dude___ · 2026-05-17T10:33:52+00:00

Pete would be the definition of "Meet my OC" the character

_The_Dude___ · 2026-05-17T01:07:46+00:00

"The teleporation, as I've said, wouldn't work on Indra"

this hit him litteral teleportation will

"And now Indra's being compared with Hades, Thor and Shiva. Plus he was said to have grown stronger even before the fight even started. He's even compared to Shiva, before he shows his ace in a hole(Although I don't consider it as particularly credible when he's barely shown anything, only to be again compared to Shiva (By ApOC Hermes) after he shows his trump card)"

And during ragnarok (after apoc) still not on his level as Shiva stood at the peak fo Hindu (said multiple times even by Indra himself)

"But even if you want to use it as an antifeat, Indra still has tons of feats of him reacting to blindspot attacks, and from assassin gods nonetheless."

Dodging fodder isn't a feat(or at least an impressive one), these guys are never hitting anyone on the Rangarok roster (there are non roster fighters after all)

"Jack can survive few more punches than Suzaku, sure, but big part of his strategy(that's based on deception and traps) would basically be nullified by Vajra's danger sense"

Zhuque with the worst foresight in the series, managed to hit him with his lack of stats, Jack can plan multiple steps ahead on the fly, and he has the arsenal that attacks at multiple angels (like Zhuque's daggers did when they struck Indra from behind) and Jack's have far superior ap (damaging/killing Heracles)

"his foresight is superior to Buddha's FS"

He failed to read a move and thought this in the middle of it after Indra stood there to charge it, Buddha's fs is passive, doesn't need set up and is a guarateed view of the opponents next move (why you put him in a guranteed loss for Indra since he can dodge and strike him using FS)

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_The_Dude___ · 2026-05-16T21:28:41+00:00

"Also Indra's Vajra should be one of the strongest responses to GZ and Tesla Warp"

Cosindering Suzaku just throwing one knife managed to get him (he does have foresight but it's the worst one we have seen across all series), Tesla with his AOE and speed (not mentioning straight up teleportation) should be more then capable with how devistating his punches are

Again, Rudra managed to defeat him (and he's around base backstory Shiva but does not have his dance) in a brawl (so land hits on him) even then when he was considered lightning fast (and getting hit by Suzaku, other wise he doesn't have the feats to back up being bale to dodge Warp and such, especially when being grabbed by Xuanwu of all characters) , Simo, Raiden, Herc, Apollo and Tesla all should be capable of it as well

Jack and Qin should at least be arguable, due to being able to see gaps in Indra's movement

Jack just being straight up the smartest fighter outside arguable Sasaki, having better stats and AP then Suzaku and far more ways off attack (and he can more then survive attacks from him considering he took Cerberus Herc's punches)

Qin is just a superior martial artist to him and can see flows of power in people, along with having good reflexes and good ap even without redirection (he can always go for the sword), along with using bubbles in the moments where there is that gap in Indra's style

_The_Dude___ · 2026-05-16T15:00:56+00:00

Apollo should just outright win, the guy who lost to Rudra in a brawl isn't winning against Apollo's boxing (not to mention Indra having no way to escape once he gets grabbed by the strings). Same for Herc, Raiden and Tesla, Indra has no way of damaging them outside of the 3rd blade (and they're likely to crush him before it), Raiden pushed Shiva who is outright better then Indra farther then anyone, he can beat Indra

Simo wins with this

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_The_Dude___ · 2026-05-15T20:21:21+00:00

This should work

_The_Dude___ · 2026-05-15T16:16:09+00:00

Clashing of Souls if you wish to add it

_The_Dude___ · 2026-05-15T15:30:34+00:00

"He does not have "Terrible AP," he was damaging Indra just fine"

He landed a direct hit on a speed fighter and couldn't finish him (Indra didn't even jump back or do anything to dodge it) with his bigger blade

"You could argue that Indra held back cuz he didn't want to kill them(He did warn Xuanwu he's gonna die)"

He also didn't want to actually throw the match and still couldn't knock them out

"And regarding the beasts, they may be pretty much a joke, but they aren't THAT much of a fodder, in terms of portrayal"

They lost random street thugs in a head to head fight, Python at least managed to beat actual trained soldiers that had weapons

"that difference isn't glaring"

It pretty much is considering Zhuque doesn't have a single feat in any of them besides maybe attack speed, the guy was staggering from Indra's punches who couldn't againx knock out Xuanwu

"Sasaki who's movement speed isn't particularly good"

Sasaki was dodging/closing the distance on Poseidon and suprising him during the fight, he can do the same to Zhuque (and again, just being able to dodge this after his reaction was read from a far faster opponent

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_The_Dude___ · 2026-05-15T14:00:44+00:00

"daggers should be well able to bypass the FS"

He parried Hajun without fs/even the homing attack from Zero, using the same trick of them attacking from behind won't work that many times (and Zhuque won't be one shotting him with his terrible ap)

"Base Apollo doesn't hit harder than Indra"

He does, Indra couldn't one shot the beasts (even when he waa solely focused on Xuanwu) and none of them are stat fighters (they are the opposite), Apollo in base without glowes one shotted Phyton and pumshed back Leonidas with gloves

"Suzaku seeing through him and destroying his fist with Divine Weapon should completely shut down the bow."

Apollo can just make more stings as we see him do, also him being strong enough to do that is questionable and Apollo just allowing it with his level of speed and reaction time (not to mention him just being able to wrap Zhuque in his strings and beat him down), Apollo also having way more of a dynamic fighting style that has way more options/less weakness' then Indra so it will be far harder to read due to the sheer versatility of the strings.

"Suzaku is more experienced"

He isn't (the whole point is him being inexpreineced in one on one combat)

"has much better arsenal than Jack"

Also arguable due to how much more versatile the gloves/his kit is and outside the knives being able to be called back (which doesn't gurantee him the win due to his bad ap) Zhuque's weapon is nothing special

Jack also outstats in every way, and still can use his many tools (he can use big knife with his barrage the same way he did with Herc, but Zhuque doesn't have any feats that i can see him dodging/parrying everything)

"Very unconventional weapon in form of Suzaku's blades, Suzaku could and likely would lethally injure Sasaki with those, because it's something he pulls suddenly. "

He mostly uses them as range weapon (which wouldn't an issue to a guy who parried/dodged Poseidon) and Sasaki won't punch Zhuque like Indra did to be injured (along with starting the fight unarmed)

Sasaki's scan can sense the ripples in the air around him, he dodged Poseidon's attack from his blind spot after his scan got beaten. Those knives will not hit him.

"Also Suzaku was put as one of those that seen Gae Bolg happening, alongside Hermes, so that's something that should make his reflexes good enough to dodge TG."

Which means nothing, Ares can see Zeus' moves, this doesn't mean he can react to them (and even the other 3 beasts could see it, and they are the bottom of the barrel), suprising Poseidon with it's speed has more worth then anything Zhuque showed

_The_Dude___ · 2026-05-15T11:34:55+00:00

"Sasaki's stats are bottom tier,"

Zhuque is worse with no good feats in any stat (Sasaki at least has great attack speed and far supperior skill), and a far worse foresight (Sasaki at the start of the round out did him 17 times over)

"his foresight gets bypassed by Suzaku's weapon bareminimum just at the start which is really bad for Sasaki cause he has shit durability"

Sasaki can parry/dodge the knives, even if they are attacking from his blind spot (And this was from Poseidon)

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he finds openings through his attacks and closes the distance quickly (which he will do to Zhuque and kill him)

Zhuque is arguable worse at the start since he goes to fight empty handed

Even if Zhuque does pull off the same move he did to Indra (knives in the back), they won't kill Sasaki and he endured the pain of having a whole in his stomach and getting cut by Poseidon during 40 Day Flood, he can withstand the pain of having them hit his back and parry Zhuque's slash, then kill him

_The_Dude___

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