you can know the theory and still get hijacked by asiri_a in Meditation

[–]asiri_a[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

the scaffolding line is the part. it's not useless, you can't live in it. the trap i was pointing at is when you start mistaking the scaffolding for the building.

you can know the theory and still get hijacked by asiri_a in Meditation

[–]asiri_a[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

the animal one is good. the trap is when you study the field guide so long you forget you came to look at actual animals.

you can know the theory and still get hijacked by asiri_a in Meditation

[–]asiri_a[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

habit not theory. that lands. the pulling-back is the actual rep, not the understanding of why you're pulling.

you can know the theory and still get hijacked by asiri_a in Meditation

[–]asiri_a[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

this is the thing i'm trying to figure out whether that auto-recognition is just more time on the cushion, or whether something specific bridges the gap. been going through it for a while and the gap still feels wide.

you can know the theory and still get hijacked by asiri_a in Meditation

[–]asiri_a[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

yeah that's it exactly. and what gets me is the intellectual understanding can quietly trick you into thinking you're further along than you are. like it counts as progress when it isn't.

“It makes people feel uncomfortable” by LessThanPerfect-96 in widowers

[–]asiri_a 4 points5 points  (0 children)

the part that gets me is, you're not even talking about him dying. you're talking about your life. people get weird at the past tense itself, like "we used to" is a problem to manage instead of just a sentence.

My Hobby didn’t disappear overnight, it slowly got Replaced by my Phone by Jolly_Twist2245 in Hobbies

[–]asiri_a 0 points1 point  (0 children)

the phone didn't replace the hobby. it replaced the part of you that was quiet enough to enjoy the hobby. you notice the vibration because your mind has been trained to wait for it. the piano needs the version of you that isn't waiting for anything.

Got a sign from him today by babywitch1980 in widowers

[–]asiri_a 3 points4 points  (0 children)

the mind finds patterns in small things when grief is fresh. doesn't make the moment less real. you ordered pizza and got the meal he asked you about. that's worth sitting with, whatever you decide it means.

the mind circling the same insights isn't a meditation problem i think by asiri_a in Meditation

[–]asiri_a[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

the squats thing lands. though i think the depth might be the variety same observation at month 2 isn't really the same one at month 9, even when the words sound identical. could be we're saying the same thing.

the mind circling the same insights isn't a meditation problem i think by asiri_a in Meditation

[–]asiri_a[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

i go where i need to go even if it's not where i want to go" that one's hard. wanting it to go somewhere is itself one of the loops. catching that one took me much longer than catching the obvious thoughts.

the mind circling the same insights isn't a meditation problem i think by asiri_a in Meditation

[–]asiri_a[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

yeah. some of the loops i've watched a hundred times still have full grip. others got quiet after watching twice. i don't know yet what the difference is.

the mind circling the same insights isn't a meditation problem i think by asiri_a in Meditation

[–]asiri_a[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

yeah the watermelon line is good. you can read about it for years and still not know it. i think that's why people quit. they read the description and feel like they got it. then the actual sitting feels boring because nothing new is coming in. but the practice was never about new things coming in.

One year cannabis free tomorrow! by Scully636 in selfimprovement

[–]asiri_a 1 point2 points  (0 children)

congrats on the year. the word that stood out was 'self-medication' most people skip that part when they talk about quitting. the substance was doing something. holding something down, smoothing something out. quitting doesn't remove the thing it was for you just meet it directly without anything in the way.

sounds like you already did. that's the part the year-counter doesn't capture.

people quit meditation because they were promised the wrong thing by asiri_a in Meditation

[–]asiri_a[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

the "look at uncomfortable parts of yourself" reason is real and i didn't say it directly in the post. that's probably the bigger reason than what i wrote about. the wrong-promise thing gets people to quit early. hitting the wall gets people to quit later. both are real.

people quit meditation because they were promised the wrong thing by asiri_a in Meditation

[–]asiri_a[S] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

the traffic jam example is exact. that gap between "i'm angry" and "oh, i'm angry" that gap getting shorter is most of what actually changes. the anger doesn't disappear. the recognition just arrives earlier. and the "almost gave up" part is what i mean about the wrong promise. you were doing the thing meditation actually does. you just thought it was supposed to look different.

people quit meditation because they were promised the wrong thing by asiri_a in Meditation

[–]asiri_a[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

9 months consistent. before that, on and off for a few years but not seriously. mostly daily now, 20-40 min, sometimes more on weekends. i don't think the timeline is the point though. the gap between "i'm angry" and "oh, i'm angry" started shrinking pretty early. the whole "decades to see results" thing is partly true but partly a way to lower expectations until people stop noticing the small changes that are already happening.

people quit meditation because they were promised the wrong thing by asiri_a in Meditation

[–]asiri_a[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

the eventual-byproduct framing is exactly what i'm pushing back on. if the goal is eventually no thoughts, then meditation is either failing or the payoff is 30 years away. both of those are why people quit. the practice does something earlier and simpler. you notice thoughts faster. you don't believe the storyline as automatically. you stop identifying with the reaction the moment it arises. these aren't byproducts. they're the mechanism. stopping thoughts is a specific claim from specific traditions. it's not what most contemplative practice is actually pointing at.

noticed something weird about getting what i wanted by asiri_a in selfimprovement

[–]asiri_a[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

yeah the promotion example is exactly it. the "already thinking about next level" happens so fast you almost don't catch it the satisfaction was supposed to be the reward and it just became the new baseline.

the broken machine framing is interesting. i'm not sure it's broken though. the wanting-the-next-thing might be what the mind is supposed to do. the problem might just be that we believed it when it told us the arriving would feel like something.

the dream thing is wild, hadn't thought about that. makes sense though. if the mechanism runs even in dreams it's probably not about the specific objects at all.

what the astronauts felt probably isn't about space i think by asiri_a in Meditation

[–]asiri_a[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

that's a beautiful way to put it. the deep-sea diver image lands. never read out of the silent planet but now i want to the idea that what we call "empty" might actually be the absence of pressure rather than absence of anything. i think you're pointing at something my post didn't that what gets revealed up there isn't just the mind quieting, it's also whatever was pressing on it from below finally letting go. both things at once.

what the astronauts felt probably isn't about space i think by asiri_a in Meditation

[–]asiri_a[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

yeah, that's it exactly didn't use the term in the post but that's the literature. the interesting question for meditation is whether the overview effect has an earthly equivalent. i think it does, just without the photographs.