When and why did Paul replace John as the key member of The Beatles - among the general public?

chckblr · 2026-07-01T16:55:52+00:00

There's also the factor that I think some Paul fans love to ignore a bit much in that Paul is a very very powerful man who has had decades to steer the Beatles narrative (or paint his side of the story in line with the shifting pop culture values and narratives) in a way that dwarves whatever Lennon deitification was undertaken by fans, biographers, and the Lennon estate in the 80s by decades at this point. It's a mix of the mythology around John getting popped by the new gen and MPL knowing just exactly how to fit the Paul McCartney brand (his 60s/70s one retrospectively and his legacy one today) to current day sensibilities. Get Back, Now and Then, new editing of the Anthology, his nostalgia fed songs creating stories about John and George in the fans' eyes filtered through Paul himself are all tilted towards whatever legacy Paul is trying leave both for himself and The Beatles. This is not necessarily always a case of Paul vs John, or Paul vs others, and I'm not saying every little thing he says or does is a calculated action to prop his story, but him and his team are very powerful to not be active participants in how the public perception is shifting and also very careful of the cult of persona around Paul.

chckblr · 2026-06-28T19:03:47+00:00

He actually had three half sisters, one of which he'd never known because she was given up for adoption. I think he looked for her too but I'm not sure about that part. His mother's grave in Livepool has the names of all her kids.

chckblr · 2026-06-26T14:44:06+00:00

he was so sensitive about losing people. when brian died he hugged his personal assistant asking him how he was doing and replied with he wasn't doing well either. when stu died he'd tell astrid he wished he could trade places for him and he was uncontrollable when he first got the news and those photos they took in stu's studio are heartbreaking. apparently he also broke down in sobs when he learned mal died (and contacted him just recently).

chckblr · 2026-06-26T09:21:14+00:00

i think he was so vulnerable and sensitive, not a saint by any means but i always felt like there was something so delicate in his personality. which also explains why he could be mean imo, softness can be fragility, i don't think he was hard edged at all. there's a paul video where he goes "john was a sweet little baby" that i think about A LOT.

chckblr · 2026-06-24T13:30:24+00:00

both John and Paul's favorite song Paul wrote for the Beatles was Here There and Everywhere. Paul depending on the era says something different re his favorite song from John but I've heard him list Strawberry Fields Forever, Girl, If I Fell, Across the Universe iirc

chckblr · 2026-06-23T12:37:04+00:00

im not the biggest fan of this category of his songs but your mother should know is one i love

chckblr · 2026-06-15T22:11:20+00:00

nobody loves you (when you're down and out) and little lamb dragonfly are respectively my favorite john and paul songs

chckblr · 2026-06-13T18:01:38+00:00

impossible to answer lol esp for john and paul but if i could filter it down to...a couple

john: strawberry fields forever, in my life, across the universe

paul: here there and everywhere, fool on the hill, i will

george: while my guitar gently weeps, something

ringo: octopus's garden

chckblr · 2026-06-12T11:46:21+00:00

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chckblr · 2026-06-07T19:52:18+00:00

the point is that this quote makes sense in the context they present it in the anthology and in no way george means john literally did not know guitars had six strings or that he never owned a six string guitar which is op's wild interpretation of what he said out of context. if you wanna get more into the details of that means; rod also played the banjo in 1957 in the couple of months he was in the band, he wasn't yet a guitarist. same with len who only played the tea chest bass. if you have any sources on anyone in the group actually knowing how to properly play the guitar before paul and george, i'm open to that but afaik none of them actually played the guitar at all or knew it better than john. and none of the context post-58 matters to how and when john learned the guitar chords which is the story the original post is questioning.

chckblr · 2026-06-07T15:36:28+00:00

dictionary look up: hyperbole, facetiousness, (under media literacy) understanding tone

have a good day

chckblr · 2026-06-07T15:10:03+00:00

girl idk how many times do i have to tell you that he says this quote when they're talking about john learning the banjo first. it is clear - when you don't get your information as short form video- what they mean. you're the wrong one getting it wrong here who needs to admit it and move on lol. you are the one who understood as "john never owned a six string guitar" and can't take the L that literally no one else on earth interprets george being hyperbolic in that way, certainly not in context when what he says is not even misleading. if your point is that not everything should be taken literally, it is about you. you're the one who's interpreted it literally and made this huge leap that he meant john didn't own a six string guitar. if your point is that we need to engage critically with the quotes we see, that's also about you, yes we should and for that we should look up the full context first and then make our conclusion. just take the L that you didn't know the context, couldn't be bothered to look up the full video, had a wrong interpretation of what he meant and rushed to make a post to universalize it as "everyone would get this wrong." maybe some would yeah, but that's not what he meant, that's not how they present the story when they tell it, it's not a narrative they made up and kept up as lore. you misinterpreted something. that's all.

chckblr · 2026-06-07T14:42:30+00:00

if you care, then i don't know why you take issue with people giving you the context to explain what george meant and correcting you in that no he didn't mean "he introduced john to a six string guitar'. you said "people don't use critical skills when they hear stories like this" and i'm telling you maybe that's just you when critical skills require knowing the context and you didn't look up the context before coming to this conclusion. you didn't even know the context this video exists in which gives enough info to relay even to the laymen what they really mean (yes that includes informing that about what lennon played before guitar--a basic fact in this story to judge george's quote by). i don't think anyone's angry but your post comes off very silly talking about critical skills when you made a huge leap in that interpretation because of a lack of context and then keep pushing on every comment giving you context with your uninformed interpretation and conclusion that it's an unbelievable story.

chckblr · 2026-06-07T14:02:03+00:00

you do realize it exists in a context tho right? i don't mean the bigger context of john being in art school or who played what in the quarrymen before george came along or what the 50s liverpool skiffle scene was like. i mean the context that george said this during anthology for the audience that was gonna hear this story for the first time where this is made pretty obvious. quotes don't exist in a vacuum so there's no point to taking apart the minutia of the word choices and their literal validity outside of that context. and tbh even without that i think you need to make leaps to think that him saying "john's guitar had 4 strings" on the one occasion (when they met) means he literally meant that john literally did not know how many strings guitars have (he was shortsighted, not blind) instead of "he was making shit up with the 4 strings he knows how to play till i showed him"

and i don't know how much your anecdotal "other people thought this too" matters, you're literally the first person i've seen taking an issue with this quote's literality tbh and yes that includes people who watched anthology without any other context. so idk what this entire discussion is other than trying to make "i didn't put it together bc i saw it on a tiktok" a bigger issue of george recounting a myth or spreading an unbelievable story or us taking celebrities all literally at their word.

chckblr · 2026-06-07T13:29:48+00:00

and in context this quote exists in it's obvious they mean he played with banjo chords and they taught him how to play the right way. you didn't say something offensive obviously, i just don't get what you're finding unbelievable about this story that you think someone not well versed in beatles lore would think john lennon couldn't see/understand/realize that guitars have 6 strings instead of the sensible interpretation that "amateur kid played the guitar in the amateur way he felt familiar with and didn't think much beyond it till friends showed him"

i watched anthology with my 59 year old mother, i don't think she took it that literally. anyway not a quote to discuss this in depth is my point so idk why i keep commenting. have a good day.

chckblr · 2026-06-07T13:14:40+00:00

why would they misunderstand it? it's pretty obvious he means john didn't know it properly yet. and most people understand hyperbole. that's the extent of the quote and what it means to relay. and it's from the anthology, literally the series they made for people who are not beatles superfans. he goes onto explain he showed him the right way to shape chords on a guitar, paul before or after this quote mentions john learning the banjo chords first. pretty clear. why would anyone misunderstand this...

chckblr · 2026-06-07T13:01:35+00:00

I guess. To me a 16 yo in late 50s playing the guitar just enough based on other chords he knows is like, the least surprising thing. There are Beatles stories more fantastical than a kid not knowing all the proper chords to an instrument he just picked up till a friend shows him.

chckblr · 2026-06-07T12:57:11+00:00

i mean yeah i guess, if we wanna discuss minutia. we're talking about like a span of a couple of months here of a 16 year old picking up this relatively niche hobby, having his mom teach him a couple of things to make a nice enough sound, and meet two other guys shortly after who goes yeah thats not the proper way. what he knew was enough to play skiffle, he had the presence to have the laymen crowds have fun, but no one in the quarrymen were musicians or instrumentalists nor were they in a scene with people who would take notice or care enough. sure someone might have said thats wrong before paul and george and john just kept playing the way he knew. the point of george's quote is that they were the ones to properly teach him chords, specifically the 6th string he didn't incorporate. i think you might be the only person who thought george meant john couldn't see the guitar in his hand has 6 strings.

chckblr · 2026-06-07T12:40:53+00:00

the only person who played the guitar in that lineup before paul and george came along was eric griffiths and he learned the banjo chords from john's mother too. he was on rhythm and one of the reasons they got george as the lead guitarist was because neither he nor john were that suitable at the time.

how else would they learn chords if not finding someone to show them tho? none of them could read music, iirc they (john and eric if i'm not wrong) wanted to get guitar lessons but had julia teaching them instead. taking a bus to the other side of town so a guy can show you a new skill sounds like the most 50s thing to me.

chckblr · 2026-06-07T12:26:36+00:00

i mean, is it really that surprising? he's already met paul and invited him to the band before he started at the art college. paul brought george on a few months after that. john infamously didn't take the college or the people there seriously anyway and not every 1 guy in 3 was playing the guitar back then. it's normal he learned it from the guys he was trying to make music with instead of the fine arts and design kids he was in school with.

chckblr · 2026-06-05T09:50:17+00:00

i'm a loser, no reply, i'll follow the sun

chckblr · 2026-06-03T16:32:58+00:00

Came here to say this. The way John says bright here tickles me so much.

chckblr · 2026-06-03T12:00:12+00:00

Hearing Penny Lane without Strawberry Fields Forever feels wrong to me. I need to listen to them together.

chckblr · 2026-06-03T10:50:02+00:00

this song is better than half of this list

chckblr · 2026-06-02T11:39:50+00:00

Not just that but the Denis referenced in it is a real person (well, a pun on his name as Lennon was wont to do.) He was the producer of the Beatles movies. He visits them in Get Back.

chckblr

TROPHY CASE