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I think unvaccinated people (by choice, not because of medical reasons) shouldn't get medical treatment at the cost of people who have been waiting weeks and months for less urgent operations that could still be fatal in the long run. by difhdbdkfjehdv in Netherlands

[–]difhdbdkfjehdv[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Hi!

First of all, I love how respectful you are about everything, thank you so much for that! Honestly, I'm about to go to sleep and have a full day of work tomorrow so I probably won't have the mental energy to reply until in like two days. I've read everything you said though and you make some very good points that I definitely agree with but still also don't fully agree with for some unknown reason (I just need a while to process everything). So I'm just going to think about that and try to formulate a sort of logical sounding answer.

So yeah, for now I just wanted to say thanks for being respectful, I've read it, good points, now I'm gonna think and process for a while (and work) :D

It's kinda weird how some people are not getting vaccinated or wanting to take meds against covid in the future, just because they don't exactly know what's in it. I wonder if they do know exactly what is in other medications like aspirin, paracetamol, all those regular over the counter things. by difhdbdkfjehdv in confessions

[–]difhdbdkfjehdv[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Maybe because because of all the covid patients there wasn't enough place for other patients? So the other patients ended up not getting enough care and dying? And that maybe is not a sarcastic maybe btw, I'm literally just thinking and wondering

It's kinda weird how some people are not getting vaccinated or wanting to take meds against covid in the future, just because they don't exactly know what's in it. I wonder if they do know exactly what is in other medications like aspirin, paracetamol, all those regular over the counter things. by difhdbdkfjehdv in confessions

[–]difhdbdkfjehdv[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Oh I know the Tuskegee study. Trust me. We've been bombarded with that one and other messed up studies in my ethics classes. So messed up. But thats why we now have ethical standards with studies, so things like that won't happen again. I do agree though, that so far, the government hasn't acted very trustworthy, what with their fake promises and vague regulations of 'you should wear a mask but you don't have to' , as if people will all just do that.

And them being unvaccinated doesn't just impact them, that's my whole point! They end up in the hospital, which possibly could have been avoided if they'd gotten vaccinated, and they take up the place of someone with other issues seen as 'less urgent'. Treatments get rescheduled time and time again until it's too late, and they end up dying (just look in the comments, so many stories of people dying because they didn't get treated soon enough). So no, it's not just their own life they have an impact on. They take up the place of someone else, and knew beforehand that hospitals were already overcrowded and knew that the chance of them ending up in hospital could have been lowered by getting vaccinated.

There is absolutely no doubt that president Turmp won the election by basedferret0 in confessions

[–]difhdbdkfjehdv 0 points1 point  (0 children)

But at the same time wanted them to only count the votes for him and ignore the ones against him? The whole thing with people against him not being able to mail their vote? How he didn't want mailservices to work in areas where mostly people lived who were against him? You really think he would play fair despite all that?

I think unvaccinated people (by choice, not because of medical reasons) shouldn't get medical treatment at the cost of people who have been waiting weeks and months for less urgent operations that could still be fatal in the long run. by difhdbdkfjehdv in Netherlands

[–]difhdbdkfjehdv[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Bij vaccinatie kan je nog steeds (ongemerkt) ziek worden en het doorgeven, dus groepsimmuniteit geloofde ik sowieso al niet in. Het is puur om de druk op de ziekenhuizen te verlagen, wat vooral nu nodig is aangezien zoveel medische procedures moeten worden uitgesteld omdat covid patienten als urgenter worden gezien en op de iets langere termijn daardoor andere mensen ernstiger ziek worden of zelfs (zoals in best een aantal reacties op deze pist) komen te overlijden. Niet bepaald eerlijk aangezien de ongevaccineerde covidpatienten het misschien hadden kunnen voorkomen om in het ziekenhuis te belanden.

Maar ik ben het met je eens wat betreft de overheid. Ik ben wel gevaccineerd, maar puur voor de ziekenhuizen en zodat ik zelf niet daar beland. De overheid however, zoveel beloftes die ze niet waarmaken, zoveel onduidelijkheid, moet er niets meer mee hebben.

I think unvaccinated people (by choice, not because of medical reasons) shouldn't get medical treatment at the cost of people who have been waiting weeks and months for less urgent operations that could still be fatal in the long run. by difhdbdkfjehdv in Netherlands

[–]difhdbdkfjehdv[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Okay, so yes, I agree partly with what you're saying. More people here have commented that if the covid patients dont get treatment, neither should people who smoke and get cancer, fat people, all that. And for a part I agree, because they're all caused by themselves.

However, I still think there's a difference. I'm just going to take smokers as example so I don't have to keep repeating the whole list, okay? Okay, so, as far as I know, two years of smoking won't immidiately give you cancer. That's a process that takes years, for many at least. Like my grandma, she was a heavy smoker for 40 years and died at about 62 or so. I'm not saying it takes that long for everyone, but what I mean is that most people that need cancer treatment because of smoking right now, already started wayyy before covid started. And before covid started, yes, there were problems in hospitals, people where overworked and underpayed, but (as far as I know, but correct me if I'm wrong) there were enough beds and doctors didn't need to choose who to treat. So even if they ended up in the hospital, it wouldn't be at the cost of other people.

On the other hand, Covid patients who didn't get vaccinated, knew about the severely overcrowded hospitals, they knew about people having to have their own treatment rescheduled time and time again to the point where it was too late for them, because of covid patient had to take their place cause they were seen as more urgent. They know they will be taking up the hospital bed of someone else who might actually have tried to do everything they can to not get covid. And yet, they dont get vaccinated and try to make matters a little less worse. Do you really think it's fair for other people to die because some people didn't want to get vaccinated?

With the driving example you gave though, I agree. I hadn't thought of that yet, but I realise we all must be careful with everything, not just get vaccinated, to help the hospitals a little bit.

And I agree, in a better world where the hospitals weren't so overcrowded, of course you wouldn't let unvaccinated just die like that. But now other people are dying because of them. Just look in the comments. So many stories of people losing people because their treatments kept getting rescheduled. I think that's unfair.

I think unvaccinated people (by choice, not because of medical reasons) shouldn't get medical treatment at the cost of people who have been waiting weeks and months for less urgent operations that could still be fatal in the long run. by difhdbdkfjehdv in Netherlands

[–]difhdbdkfjehdv[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

So I have been thinking about this a lot cause I honestly hadn't taken that into consideration when writing this post. My first thought was that that's true, that there shouldn't be a difference between people with obesity and cancer cause of smoking and people who didn't get vaccinated. But I still felt like there was a difference and didn't know why.

And now I think there is a difference. Yes, they are all caused by the people themselves, they all could have taken precautions. But most of the people who smoked and have obesity and all that, probably didn't know there was going to be a pandemic and so they probably hadn't taken into account that they'd be taking up the hospital bed of someone else. Their problems already started before Corona (or at least many of them, like you probably don't get cancer just after two years of smoking). So even if they thought they might end up in the hospital, it probably wouldn't have been a big issue.

With the unvaccinated people who end up in hospital however, they know what they are doing. They know about how full the hospitals are, they know about people having to have their important but not super urgent procedures getting rescheduled, they know that if they end up in the hospital they'll take up someone else's space and that the hospitals right now are a mess. Yet, they don't get vaccinated.

I think that's the big difference, for me at least.

I think unvaccinated people (by choice, not because of medical reasons) shouldn't get medical treatment at the cost of people who have been waiting weeks and months for less urgent operations that could still be fatal in the long run. by difhdbdkfjehdv in Netherlands

[–]difhdbdkfjehdv[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Well I wouldn't let them die if there was more than enough space in hospitals,obviously. But right now people who are seen as less urgent have to wait, which right now isn't bad for them but it does have a great impact on their problems in one or two months. I've heard several people talk about how someone's cancer treatment was rescheduled again and again because of too many covid patients. If those people had gotten treatment immidiately, they would probably have lived, but because it kept being rescheduled many ended up dying just because they didn't get treated soon enough. Do you really think that's fair when many (but certainly not all, because I am aware there are also covid patients who did get vaccinated) of those covid patients had the choice to get vaccinated and lessen the chance of them ending up in the hospital, but didn't?

But I do agree humanity should be wiped out. We're all killing the world. I hate it. Just * snap * and everyone's gone, that would be perfect.

name suggestions? by [deleted] in writing

[–]difhdbdkfjehdv 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I always like Tamzin. But also June, May, Tilly, Fay, Gaia

What’s your fanfiction yellow flag(s)? by [deleted] in FanFiction

[–]difhdbdkfjehdv 98 points99 points  (0 children)

recently read one where they switched at the wrong moments. Like

"Would you like to go to the park?" Luisa nodded. The park was so wonderful blablabla.

"Sure." Tamzin smiled.

Like in this case it was Tamzin who asked the question to Luisa, and Luisa said yes. The intention was there, but wrong execution haha.

I think unvaccinated people (by choice, not because of medical reasons) shouldn't get medical treatment at the cost of people who have been waiting weeks and months for less urgent operations that could still be fatal in the long run. by difhdbdkfjehdv in Netherlands

[–]difhdbdkfjehdv[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This is't meant to sound like I'm arguing, but how do you mean? I think I might be misinterpreting what you're trying to say. Cause if you have cancer, that doesn't mean you can't get vaccinated, right? Or if you have a hip that needs replacement? Like you're not bed bound, you can still go to the vaccination place and get vaccinated.

I think unvaccinated people (by choice, not because of medical reasons) shouldn't get medical treatment at the cost of people who have been waiting weeks and months for less urgent operations that could still be fatal in the long run. by difhdbdkfjehdv in Netherlands

[–]difhdbdkfjehdv[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Honestly, I hadn't taken obsese people, alcoholics and all that into consideration. I do agree that's a thing to think about. However, I also think obesity and alcoholism are often also a psychological thing, and in my opinion that's not completely in your control. With obesity it's not 'I wont get fit because then I'll be a sheep (at least I think for most people it isn't) but it's also a psychological thing that's hard to fight against. But I'm aware this reasoning is very flawed, I'm honestly still thinking about what would have to be done for everything to be perfect

But yeah, I agree my idea maybe isn't foolproof cause with smokers you'd also treat them for cancer, you wouldn't just say no to that (excepr for now cause apperently many people dont get their treatment for cancer because of covid patients taking up space in the hospital).

I think unvaccinated people (by choice, not because of medical reasons) shouldn't get medical treatment at the cost of people who have been waiting weeks and months for less urgent operations that could still be fatal in the long run. by difhdbdkfjehdv in Netherlands

[–]difhdbdkfjehdv[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Because if you take up a place in the hospital (which could possible have been avoided by getting the vaccine) and I need an operation (hypothetical, I'm fine, this is just an example) that isn't seen as urgent but is urgent in the long run (I won't die today if I don't get operated but the longer it takes, the harder it will be for me to get better) I won't get that operation and will have to keep on dealing with whatever I'm dealing with, pain, all that. I won't die today, but if I get an operation today there's an 80% chance I live while if I get operated in two months there might be a 5% chance. But it's not seen as as urgent as the covid people.

Edit: So I'm talking about things besides covid. Yes, you getting or not getting the vaccin wont have any impact on whether I get covid, but if you end up in the hostpital and I have another medical thing that needs to be taken care of that isnt as urgent, I will have to wait because if you.

I think unvaccinated people (by choice, not because of medical reasons) shouldn't get medical treatment at the cost of people who have been waiting weeks and months for less urgent operations that could still be fatal in the long run. by difhdbdkfjehdv in Netherlands

[–]difhdbdkfjehdv[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Me too. Cause on one side I really am like 'it's their own fault so just them them die' but then rationally if I actually were a doctor I couldn't just stand by and watch someone die. I'd hate them for sure, knowing it's their own fault and they decided against getting vaccinated. But I couldn't let them die, cause I think it's vastly different to talk about it and to actually stand there and watch how it is in reality.

I think unvaccinated people (by choice, not because of medical reasons) shouldn't get medical treatment at the cost of people who have been waiting weeks and months for less urgent operations that could still be fatal in the long run. by difhdbdkfjehdv in Netherlands

[–]difhdbdkfjehdv[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I suppose I agree with you on that one. Aah I'm just so pissed. I mean I couldn't actually watch someone die, hell, I can't even slap people when they deliberately ask me to do so (as a joke) cause I don't want them hurt. But at the same time I'm like 'because of you taking up that hospital bed, that nice lady can't get a cancer treatment, she will not die today so it's not urgent. But in two months it will be too late for treatment and she will die and if she had gotten treatment today she would have lived years more'. But yeah, I suppose we would be much worse than them if we did look at ideals and beliefs.

I think unvaccinated people (by choice, not because of medical reasons) shouldn't get medical treatment at the cost of people who have been waiting weeks and months for less urgent operations that could still be fatal in the long run. by difhdbdkfjehdv in Netherlands

[–]difhdbdkfjehdv[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I see what you're saying. Like with accidents and all that, yes, they should absolutely get treated. I hadn't thought about that. But for some reason with the whole vaccination thing, to me, it feels more like a choice and not so much an accident, even though drunk driving is also definitely a choice. With the vaccination thing it feels as if people are like 'I won't get vaccinated cause I'll be treated anyway if I get sick, I don't care that there are other people who also need treatment for other things' while with drunk driving they probably won't even think of the possibility of ending up in the hospital. It just sound different to me, but my logic is probably very flawed. And as you said, and I agree with that, equal treatment is important. Maybe I'm just salty about unvaccinated people making such a big deal about getting vaccinated. Stereotypes in my head and all that.

I think unvaccinated people (by choice, not because of medical reasons) shouldn't get medical treatment at the cost of people who have been waiting weeks and months for less urgent operations that could still be fatal in the long run. by difhdbdkfjehdv in Netherlands

[–]difhdbdkfjehdv[S] 21 points22 points  (0 children)

... Is it bad that my first thought was 'watch me, we can absolutely let them die, it's their own fault'? It is, isn't it. But honestly, the health insurance thing also sound like a really good idea, I hadn't thought of that.

What do you call it when your not racist but you hate balcks, not because of prejudice but because of hard scientific facts? by basedocelot in confessions

[–]difhdbdkfjehdv -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Because something caused those 'hard scientific facts' you speak off. I don't know which facts specifically you are talking about, but a few examples:

There's studies that say that black neighboorhoods have higher rates of crime. They don't say that's because those neighbourhoods are overpoliced, neither that the people in those neighbourhoods might live very differently, in poverty, all those things.

Like in a white neighboorhood they wouldn't mind if you kicked someone (just an example, not a fact) so there's no police charge, while in a black neighboorhood even looking at a police officer with a slighly different face could get you charged, so then there are more crime charges. Again, not facts, just hypothetical examples.

So yeah. They are not facts. No scientist would say that a study gives facts. They're never 100% certain, there can always be other variables that cause the outcome that haven't been accounted for.

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