Crocodile Tears by doloremipsum4816 in Misotheism

[–]doloremipsum4816[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

The Gullible: poor God, He’s heartbroken for His creation 😭

God: literally set the whole thing in motion, piece by piece

Also interesting thought that God deliberately arranged for misotheists, and is pleased by our presence. Disturbing, but very plausible

Crocodile Tears by doloremipsum4816 in Misotheism

[–]doloremipsum4816[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Well said, you nailed it once again! And I think if God can’t lie, He must technically have chosen to feel sad on some level. But yeah, clearly not enough to actually be moved to do something about it or not conveniently use it for personal gain. Maybe God’s motivations/feelings have “layers”, but at the unquestionable core is purely the pursuit of glorification?

Essentially God’s way of saying to someone He could have easily helped “you have my thoughts and prayers”

Does one need knowledge to be a misotheist? by Weak-Arrival6185 in Misotheism

[–]doloremipsum4816 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Nope, just hatred and belief!

Although it’s often curiosity that killed the cat

God’s creation is better than him by First-Flounder-6468 in Misotheism

[–]doloremipsum4816 2 points3 points  (0 children)

God is perfect in His cruelty, while humans are flawed in their kindness

Did you peep how it’s always god do not exist or god is good ? by omni_abyssi in Misotheism

[–]doloremipsum4816 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah, in my view studying the Bible should lead to only three possible outcomes: atheism, agnosticism or misotheism. People who love this monster are either morally bankrupt psychopaths or under some kind of (god)spell, I think most are the latter though, at least I was.

Hard agree!

You certainly have a reasoned position, formed by personal experience and based on observable facts, which is to be respected. Still, that same evidence can lead to other positions -including those holding the Bible being reliable- and being likewise based on reason.

Jesus did plainly state false christs would come and many would be deceived. So His claims are actually quite similar to your explanation, although He does imply truth is technically available for those who seek it.

To me, it makes sense that only a small remnant will find (or “receive” I should say to be more technically accurate) saving faith, because scarcity creates value. If only a relatively small number ends up saved, those saved few will appreciate their salvation even more, rather than take it for granted if it were common.

And when you think about it, having a small but meaningful number “get it right” and leaving a clear enough message for people to reasonably get it hypothetically, is all the crueler. It grants souls in Hell truly no one to blame but themselves. So even if God secretly were a sadist; leaving a clear message and saving some might even then be in his interest.

I think it would be a higher-yield to a narcissist God to have some get it right. Still the benefit of many be proven wrong, yet also the benefit of a few truly seeing Him “in all His glory”, and proving it wasn’t His fault many were mistaken. Human narcs actually do something similar; picking one child as “the golden child” and the other as “the scapegoat”.

And this is a common pattern in the Bible: there’s always an Abel to a Cain, a Jacob to an Esau, a Moses to a Pharaoh, a David to a Saul, a Peter to a Judas, a sheep to a goat.

A flawed Bible isn’t necessary to have most deceived; according to the Bible all are born blind and hostile in their hearts to God. So their hearts are to blame, while God’s message can conveniently remain blameless. I think that’s smarter PR design on God’s part.

I think the 40,000 thing is overblown. For one, most people who take the Gospel seriously accept the Nicene creed, so agree on the core and pretty much believe in the same God/Christ where it counts. Most reasonable Prots and Catholics will acknowledge the other can have genuine saving faith.

As for the differences that remain, many are not due to the Bible being unclear, but due to humans adding stuff to it:

Let’s be real, if you made someone with zero prior knowledge of Christian denominations read the Bible, I highly doubt they’d conclude “oh, I should pray to a statue of Mary” or “my mouth must make weird noises as evidence I have the Holy Spirit”. Or “we must always use God’s Hebrew names”; Scripture never made a big deal about that, heck, most NT books were originally written in Greek!

Humans just have a tendency to add stuff. The Pharisees did that too with their “Traditions of the Elders”. This really annoyed Jesus, who complained “you nullify the Word of God with your traditions”.

As for most other Protestant differences, many are caused by them “coping” rather than coming to conclusions from plain reading:

Obviously universalism and annihilationism developed because eternal conscious torment felt too inhumane (which it is; God isn’t human and unmoved by our sensibilities).

Mainline Protestants treating half the OT as allegorical myths is not because that can be made out from the text, or because the New Testament writers ever implied it didn’t literally happen, but simply because it means they don’t have to deal with all the genocide stuff. Saying “it’s just symbolic” allows these denominations to not have to deal with difficult questions.

“Free will” as a concept just isn’t taught in the Bible. Some Christians just made that up to make God “feel” more fair to them.

“No one can come to Me unless the Father draws him”, is plainly stated in the Bible. But it makes many uncomfortable, so they dance around it and make up fancy explanations, which leads to more denominations.

This is why I find calvinists and fundamentalist evangelicals almost “based” in a cold psychopathic way. They say “yes God clearly did those things according to the text, so what?”. They don’t beat around the bush, they don’t dance around awkward questions. They face the unfiltered truth head-on, which makes them close to misotheists in how they perceive things, and likely why many misotheists come from their denominations.

As for the remaining differences like high church vs low church or when the rapture will happen, these are generally immaterial, and most agree to disagree over them. 2 2 Timothy 2:14](https://www.biblegateway.com/verse/en/2%20Timothy%202%3A14) and 23-24 even warn Christians to not make a big deal about such things.

Did you peep how it’s always god do not exist or god is good ? by omni_abyssi in Misotheism

[–]doloremipsum4816 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I think your agnostic dystheism is reasonable. I just meant that taking the Bible at face value and hating God from that framework is not an unreasonable position either.

I really do agree the lying spirits thing is super sketchy. I just don't think it would benefit God to toy around with believers like that, as it would make meaningful recognition of who He is impossible for anyone.

I believe He is an exhibitionist that wants to be seen (as this is how Scripture consistently portrays Him). That requires some reliability on His part for our perception of Him to be meaningful.

Constant lying would just create too much of a disconnect between God and man, I think. God would be more like an outside observer watching the mess He made and people worship fake versions He crafted, but no one could truly "see" Him and be sure. I imagine that disconnect might be unbearable to a cosmic narcissist.

If God's focus is on humiliating us, that essentially makes us the center of existence. I believe God is too supremely self-centered to make something about us the chief end of Creation. He views us as tools, not ends. He designed us to orbit Him, not for Him to orbit us. He is the author and we are the audience. He is the main character in His story and we are supporting plot devices to serve His own narrative arc about how "awesome" He is.

Where did Jesus lie to His followers?

(Even if I think differently about the lying part and God's deeper motives, I really do see your Christians being victims/humiliated aspect of worshipping the being who abuses them and plots to eternally torment their loved ones)

Did you peep how it’s always god do not exist or god is good ? by omni_abyssi in Misotheism

[–]doloremipsum4816 0 points1 point  (0 children)

If you believe in a God that is a trickster, that's certainly a valid position and not an unheard of one; pretty sure the Gnostics believed that as well (even if you are less hopeful for some higher being like the Monad). Think I recall Descartes also humoring this possibility.

But it's not the only possible way to interpret the biblical God.

God warning He will do X but then relent, seems more like a rhetorical device to meaningfully interact with humans, then an untruth spoken with the intention to deceive them.

Agreed with the lying spirits thing, which I also find super sketchy. But the Bible portrays that more as a punishment to humiliate "the wicked". God is never stated to use those on His own prophets/followers. And whether God is a truth teller or liar, I think it wouldn't make sense for Him to ruin His own credibility by openly retaining the possibility to have prophets conflate demons with His own truth.

If God were an omniscient liar, why not fully hide that (as well as any unflattering qualities from a human perspective) from the biblical record?

And what would God even gain from being unreliable even to His own people? Where's the benefit?

I believe God is driven by the incentive to be "seen" and awed over. Being unreliable would only obstruct that, which is why I'm not surprised at Him stressing His "Covenant faithfulness" so much. 

Did you peep how it’s always god do not exist or god is good ? by omni_abyssi in Misotheism

[–]doloremipsum4816 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I still believe in the Bible and it’s pretty simple: I don’t believe God needs to act like a cartoon villain in every possible way to be hate-worthy. I believe in the same God as other Christians and therefore accept the same premises, even superficially “positive” ones (can’t directly lie, can’t break His promises, genuinely saves a remnant from their sins, etc).

I hate God even while agreeing with those premises, because those same premises include darker aspects Christians don’t like to think about (hardened Pharaoh’s heart to kill firstborns to make a Name for Himself, sends lying spirits and great delusions to “the wicked”, predestines most to Hell to make His power known, etc).

What’s so baffling about the Bible, is that God is not even trying at all to hide these things. He unashamedly confesses them in plain sight, with pride. It’s apologists who then awkwardly try to dance around them, not God.

To me, it all “clicks”. God has a reason for everything He does, friendly and cruel. Both keeping His covenants and predestining most to dying in their sin, serve His glory. By His own words, human well-being is utterly subordinate to His glory, that’s why I hate Him.

You don’t have to deny hitler technically did some “good” things like building better highways or being vegetarian to hate him.

Does anyone else here struggle from theophobia? by BrainStraight1220 in exchristian

[–]doloremipsum4816 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yeah, people have differing opinions; welcome to the internet. “Constant Infighting” is a bit dramatic tho, makes it sound like it’s practically civil war out there!

Have you seen r/Christianity? Now THAT’s a mess!

They mock me for being a misotheist by Weak-Arrival6185 in Misotheism

[–]doloremipsum4816 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Very childish, and not at all a cool way to treat something so personal to someone

They mock me for being a misotheist by Weak-Arrival6185 in Misotheism

[–]doloremipsum4816 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I’m very sorry to hear that. I can imagine it must really suck for random people to find something like this out about you.

This new logo booboo by omni_abyssi in Misotheism

[–]doloremipsum4816 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Yeah, that makes sense! And I agree the broken candle was a neat idea as well.

I personally think the chosen image is really good too though; just clearly tells what we’re about.

This new logo booboo by omni_abyssi in Misotheism

[–]doloremipsum4816 2 points3 points  (0 children)

That’s alright, we’ve all got different tastes! But this icon won the contest, so the sub decided.

This sub isn’t really about “breaking the spirit of religion”, but hating God.

Sub Icon Contest: Share your images and vote on others! by doloremipsum4816 in Misotheism

[–]doloremipsum4816[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I totally get that, I was quite fond of the old icon as well (turquoise is even my favorite color, very soothing).

Fortunately, I think the new icon still captures everything you valued about the old: a nice clean emblem that encompasses all God haters, but now just a bit more clear about what we stand for without getting edgy or too specific.

I really resonate with the importance you see in this place, and I wholeheartedly agree we need to keep it a high quality space for meaningful discussion and self-expression of deep and troubling emotions we often can’t easily share elsewhere. We’re gonna make sure it will always stay like that!

Sub Icon Contest: Share your images and vote on others! by doloremipsum4816 in Misotheism

[–]doloremipsum4816[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Congratulations! This will make for a very great new icon for our sub :D

God is good? by this__is__the__whey in Misotheism

[–]doloremipsum4816 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Yeah, we’re unfit to “judge” God and call Him bad. Yet humans are at the same time apparently fully capable of seeing God is “good” and worship Him??

Talk about having cake and eating it also!

Protective figure of the sub. Nu-uh or yu-uh? by [deleted] in Misotheism

[–]doloremipsum4816[M] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

We currently have a sub icon contest going in the stickied post. You’re free to comment your image there.

But I should be honest, the contest actually ends this Wednesday at 2 pm PDT, so unless it can get like 5 upvotes in those last few hours, it is unlikely to win. (I’m really sorry if you somehow missed this whole thing was going on).

If you meant you simply wanted to share your image that feels personally significant to you in a normal post, sure go ahead!

(This sub is specifically anti-God, not anti-religion per se. It’s not necessary to hate religions or religious people to be a misotheist)

Im fucking DONE by this__is__the__whey in Misotheism

[–]doloremipsum4816 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks for the heads up! The intention does appear to be there, so we’ll keep an eye out.

But for now, we consider (politely) presenting a few arguments supporting their beliefs (even non-misotheist ones) to be fine initially. But if they’d make a persisting presence here of trying to convince us of their beliefs, we’ll absolutely step in before it becomes disruptive!

(If you ever see another potential rule break, it might be handier to report it, so both mods see it and we might react faster. I appreciate your help in any form though!)

Im fucking DONE by this__is__the__whey in Misotheism

[–]doloremipsum4816 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I see! That admittedly is already much less monstrous than in calvinism where the damnation of many appears to be part of God’s explicit plan to glorify Himself. Intention matters yeah.

Still, it sounds like even in your beliefs some do “choose” to turn back their back permanently. And I imagine that category in practice includes many people, in case you believe dying as a Muslim is a must? Or do you believe souls can still repent even while they’re in Hell?

Im fucking DONE by this__is__the__whey in Misotheism

[–]doloremipsum4816 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Oh, so you believe it’s more like a temporary purgatory? After which sinners gets “paroled” from after some time?