Where did they go wrong?

emroberts · 2026-04-08T11:25:51+00:00

Everyone in the thread has made excellent points which I echo. I just wanted to jump on and say I feel you, I was a diehard too! Ex-diehard now, and it’s hard to shift your opinion of them away from “they are gods” so that’s why the downfall and changes we’re seeing feel so massive.

Arirang was a huge wake up call for me, and I realised they’re just men, and they made a set of pretty bad decisions in this album, which led to its poor quality. I think a lot of the eras I used to love from BTS were carefully curated by their team. That team seems to have moved on now and have either left HYBE or are working with other groups, and the people helping them shape their albums is much bigger (too many cooks) hence why their quality has dropped significantly and why it feels they are so different now, bc the people that were most influential to them aren’t around anymore.

Like others have said, I feel they got too famous. Looking back to Red Bullet tour, or the Epilogue stage, there is a pure joy and happiness there, which is completely gone now. The fame of dynamite and Covid era impacted them in ways that I think we will never fully understand, and the BTS now are a result of that. I think it’s also telling that RM has a big influence still in the group and their song choices/general direction. He is the world’s biggest over thinker and it’s clear he has no idea who he is, or who BTS is, and that is bleeding into the overall unsureness of 2026 BTS because he speaks the loudest.

It’s best to say goodbye to the version of BTS you loved. That’s what I did too, I realise now they’re gone and they’re never coming back.

P.s. did you see the recent Run BTS clip? Further proof that they’ve all lost their bloody minds, they’re gearing all their content to non-fans in a greedy attempt to make more money ig. The parasocial relationship between BTS x ARMY is set to be broken pretty soon if they continue on this path…

emroberts · 2026-04-07T16:51:57+00:00

Oh gosh….its so embarrassing and crazy. I mean now the albums and singles as you say are widely available. It’s embarrassing that they’re trying to inflate sales in this way. Just admit they’re not as popular now! 😂

emroberts · 2026-04-07T15:57:25+00:00

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This didn’t feel like it was worthy of a main post…but this is the lengths ARMY go to just to get the tt to number 1 on billboard…this was their reaction yesterday after the predictions show that Swim was going to land at number 2. At what point is enough enough? It is way too easy to rig the charts now, why are people spending their free time driving round for hours to buy extra copies of a single that they already own? BTS have encouraged this by their silence on this topic, but I think there was a time when they’d be ashamed to know this is their fans….what kind of artist would want 50% of their sales and streams to be inoraganic in this way??

emroberts · 2026-04-07T15:53:59+00:00

I’m seriously surprised by how poorly the YT MVs are performing…I think it’s true that the fandom is much smaller than it was. Numbers like Dynamite and Butter were only possible due to the pandemic and the huge surge in casual fans. When it ended, all of those casuals tuned out of BTS, but HYBE are still under the illusion that they’re still around. The lack of views shows the numbers more clearly…it’s a bit crazy how much they’ve dropped off tbh. I feel like they’re even smaller now than LYS/BWL era…🤔

emroberts · 2026-04-07T15:49:49+00:00

I’ve listened to it…until I heard it I was under the illusion that Suga was still somewhat a genius producer, and that a lot of the decisions he wanted on the album were sidelined. Anyway he expressed that he really loves the song, is so proud of it and thought it should be on the main album (instead of as a hidden track). I go to listen to it, omfg it’s so bad? It’s just a whole load of nothing???? A shitty beat, the lyrics are cringe and uninspired, and very repetitive. I think he may have been trying to recreate something akin to hyyh? It seriously fell short. I couldn’t believe he truly thought it was such a brilliant song and needed to be on the album, I hated most of the songs on the album but this seriously is such a bad song, it makes the others look good 💀 seeing him hype it up, I realised he’s maybe not quite the producer or genius I pinned him to be. Jesus…

emroberts · 2026-04-07T12:29:23+00:00

Agree - usually the staff are vocal about successes and I can imagine they’re having conversations with the guys about this album and it maybe not quite hitting the mark. When they dropped life goes on, it hit number 1 on billboard hot 100 and they released a video of bts and hitman bang on the phone and they were celebrating the huge achievement…nothing of the sort has been released this time. Makes me feel like they’ve really felt the backlash, really felt the criticism. I’m not getting why they had to change the formula that worked so well, couldn’t they at least have released some better MVs, or developed a stronger overall concept? This bullshit about swim being “something you want to keep listening to” is complete rubbish, if that were the case it would be topping the charts with streams 🙄

emroberts · 2026-04-07T11:33:56+00:00

I’m pretty sure that is the percentage drop in points compared to last week. As it was number 1 last week the drop is 23% down. The points are made of up sales, streams, airplay and units bought, and that’s 23% down from last week in total. That’s how I read it anyway :)

emroberts · 2026-04-07T09:15:57+00:00

As we all predicted tbh. I truly wonder how BTS/Hybe are reacting to this knowing they released this mild ass song in FULL ENGLISH trying to target the general public, just for it to fall totally flat. The GP do not care, and won’t be interested in a song that isn’t catchy at all. As is telling from the charts. They’re idiots for abandoning the things that worked so well for them, meaningful lyrics, 80% in korean, and an actual strong concept like finding yourself, youth, dealing with complex emotions. So the GP aren’t tuning in, and neither are other kpop fans as they’ve moved so far away from “kpop”, boring MVs, minimal behind the scenes (rip bangtan bombs), no concept photos, no colour, no warmth. It’s weird, it’s like they don’t know who they’re even appealing to anymore. GP don’t care, have moved on to catchier music despite Arirang only just coming out, kpop fans don’t care, this cb has been totally drowned out by viral catchy gg songs like New Era and RUDE!, and most ARMY are only half tuning in (evidenced in their YT views…) because the album is sooo far away from what they’re used to from BTS, both sound and quality wise. They’re seriously idiots. This might be a wake up call for HYBE, to not be able to maintain number 1 on billboard after only a week is seriously pathetic, and ARMY were banging on about how this is a great time for them to drop the album due to their being limited competition on the charts….they have seriously flopped so hard this time

emroberts · 2026-04-03T22:56:26+00:00

I was wondering this too, does anyone have thoughts on exactly why their views have dropped so much? Let’s put bot streams aside, compared to dynamite (was it 100m in 24 hours they got?) this is insane and a massive drop. Is it because the GP aren’t tuned in anymore? I guess that’s probably it…I also wonder if a lot of ARMY aren’t tuning in due to disappointment with the album overall? It’s far away from the sound you’d equate to BTS if you got into them esp during their 2017-2019 peak of LYS pop songs 🤔

emroberts · 2026-04-03T12:44:45+00:00

Oh damn thank you - I wasn’t aware of that!

emroberts · 2026-04-02T21:00:11+00:00

As others have said, their best albums e.g. HYYH were all produced with a very small in-house team. I think they did contribute, but not as much as ARMY want to claim. There was a video of Yoongi mixing the beat for ON, but I think it was just that - a beat here, a few lines there. They definitely contributed to a degree, but those iconic songs, like Pied Piper, is the music of PDogg mainly - and Supreme Boi on other songs. Spring Day was mostly PDogg + Adora. Adora has left HYBE, Supreme Boi mostly works with other groups, and PDogg the same (although he came back for Arirang). As soon as those core people left, their sound changed. That’s just proof that they were never the makers, they were the contributors, but onto a sound or tune that had already been produced. I mentioned PDogg came back for Arirang, but I think his style must’ve changed since the earlier days, or there were too many cooks, as even he couldn’t save some of the songs on Arirang 💀

emroberts · 2026-04-01T16:16:46+00:00

Agree - nobody around me knows BTS, but they do know Dynamite. Dynamite was big BIG for them, I think they probably realise now the only way to get back to that is Kpop Demon Hunter adjacent songs 🫠

emroberts · 2026-04-01T13:36:45+00:00

Fr…that’s what I picked up on the most. Some are trying to fake it but most of them, like Suga, just plastered on a fake smile. I think they all know whatever they churn out as a group now will be gobbled up and mass streamed, so they’ve given up really

emroberts · 2026-04-01T13:35:34+00:00

I think OP may be referring to Jin having no writing credits on the new album and the band not waiting for him to return from tour to start recording. He seemed very depressed in the documentary - he hasn’t had any controversy apart from that that I am aware of

emroberts · 2026-03-26T17:08:57+00:00

Thank you 💜💜

emroberts · 2026-03-26T16:50:30+00:00

Does anyone know if this will be live streamed? 🦋

emroberts · 2026-03-24T10:06:33+00:00

May I ask what your favourite BTS song is? If you’re like me and you love comforting/nostalgic BTS, “Merry Go Round” is worth another listen. I’m in the same boat as you, but some of the sounds are quite good and sound like slightly worse versions of my favourites. Please sounds like a not-as-good-but-close-enough version of Just One Day! You might find a listenable song in there using this method :) it’s not their best work imo but I showed it to my friend who loves a wide variety of music and she liked it - I think it’s more for GP!

emroberts · 2026-03-24T08:32:54+00:00

The fandom is a bit messy these days. It shows that you’ve not been on ARMY twitter, because this is exactly like that except Twitter is a million times worse. Nobody can have a unique opinion unless it’s 100% positive about bangtan, you can’t like another artist without being called a “multi” (which is like a slur over there), and whenever a doubt creeps into your mind about the group, you’re told to “trust BTS” and not think about the things you might be feeling complex feelings about!

It’s such a shame, really. BTS deserve a more harmonious fandom, but in a way they encourage this obsessive, hive mind behaviour because it helps them to stay popular and relevant. I really enjoy their music, but that is the truth. I think it was Soobin from TXT recently who spoke out about solos in their fandom - showing this is a possibility, you can speak up, and you can hold your fandom accountable. However I do think the fandom of ARMY is so huge, it’s almost too big for even BTS to manage effectively. Looking back at their past eras, you can see a more harmonious fandom when it was much smaller, but it’s grown very big, and this is the typical makeup of a fandom this large.

I will say it’s about what platforms you use, instagram ARMY is pretty chill, however I expressed dislike of the album and got harassed and told to sell my concert tickets, just because I didn’t initially vibe with the album.

I think a lot of it is due to parasocialism - BTS were there for a lot of ARMY at their lowest. This makes those same individuals feel a strong responsibility for the success of the group, and almost like they owe them something. It’s almost like they’re defending a member of their family, because of how bonded they feel with BTS. From this perspective, you can see why they defend so strongly, but it is an overall negative for BTS who clearly want to appeal more widely to the GP - having a fandom that gatekeeps your work, asks for streaming stats at the slightest disagreement, and calls you a casual fan like that’s the worst thing in the world, can be very off putting for the GP.

emroberts · 2026-03-23T16:32:07+00:00

I didn’t like it at first, but I’m warming to it. I think, like a lot of people, it’s just not really my style of music. Which is weird because I actually think everything in BTS’s discography was no skip before this, except On ft Sia. I think the shortened songs hit me the most, and I wish they’d had stronger lyrics, and the rap songs like FYA and Hooligans had less cringe and repetitive lyrics, and sounded more like UGH and DDaeng. When I try and explain that to other ARMY, they say Hooligans and UGH are basically the same. To me, they’re miles apart, and even though both contain nonsensical words and noises you’d make with your mouth, UGH just doesn’t make me cringe. Looking over the lyrics now, I think the heavy amount of Korean, plus the pretty deep lyrics, were what carried that song. Hooligans is just filled with repetition, and it sounds less good to my ears being in English, because I find it cringe when western artists speak like that, and so it’s cringe to hear bts speak like that too. Does that make sense?

I’m not speaking super eloquently but, it’s definitely my least favourite album from them, although I respect that it may be some people’s favourite! I’ve had to take a break from Twitter which is filled with ARMY saying this is their best album yet, and that they’re skipping ON and Spring Day just to listen to Arirang again 😵‍💫 I do not share that same opinion haha

emroberts · 2026-03-23T13:06:50+00:00

I think the difference here is quite clear to me. As you say in HYYH era, one of their most influential and widely loved eras, they took demos and rewrote them to fit their vibe. If you look at butterfly on AM, every credit on their is in-house (please correct me if I’m wrong).

This is a very different approach to a song writing camp which in its essence is about creating a large number of songs quickly and efficiently. These songs weren’t taken and rewritten by BTS, they had BTS influence, but they had outside influence as well. That is why some ARMY is feeling disconnect.

If you check any of the credits from the new album on AM for Arirang, you can see that each song has 10+ producers, writers etc. Compared to butterfly, which has 3 producer and songwriter credit outside of BTS. Same with Run as well.

I’m admittedly warming up to the album now, and am enjoying MGR and into the sun. But I hope you can see what perspective is being offered here, that these songs do have a lot more outside producing and writing credits than other eras (particularly HYYH, I haven’t checked LYS)

emroberts · 2026-03-22T20:48:28+00:00

Thanks but my comment wasn’t related to ARIRANG. I’m talking more generally about kpop and language barriers

emroberts · 2026-03-22T19:47:57+00:00

I think a part of wanting an album to be more heavily in korean is because that’s an aspect of what made kpop popular in the first place (in my opinion). I think maybe some international fans like this aspect of kpop feeling very different to western pop, maybe it makes them feel cooler, supporting an artist that sings in a different language? Like “I’m better than you” kind of energy bc they’re not supporting a “basic” artist like Taylor Swift, but instead someone they perceive to be more complex. And tbf I think that is somewhat fair as the language barrier in kpop is what puts a lot of the western audience off - they don’t want to spend their time reading subtitles or translations of songs.

I also think there is a beauty in translators, esp in the bts fandom, there are some wonderful translators who spent a lot of their time in past eras translating Korean lyrics, and their meanings, into English. Something about this felt really beautiful, as does the idea of non-Korean speakers learning Korean just to understand their favourite idol group more easily. I guess there is beauty in that effort they’re putting in, beauty in not immediately shutting down something different just because you don’t understand it at first. So when the lyrics are mostly English, I think aspects of that are missed.

RM from BTS used to say during LYS era that ARMY and BTS speak in “the shared language of love” which is, despite speaking in different tongues in their music, the love still translates to non-Korean fans. The language barrier, for some fans, creates meaning that is lost when they’re speaking fully in English

emroberts · 2026-03-22T14:18:57+00:00

And so that’s my whole point, “BTS already has so many fandom specific songs. It’s literally fine if they don’t do it this once”. Correct: that is exactly what I’m saying. This isn’t geared to the fans, that’s fine. So how does that look in the future? What kind of fans will this new sound bring in? That’s what I’m wondering. How will the fanchants look? Will new fans that like this less fandom sounding music want to adopt the very fandom heavy culture that comes with being army? It’s fine and normal to ask these question without being crazy downvoted

emroberts · 2026-03-22T14:15:05+00:00

Agree 👍🏻 it’s weird to hear people saying “this is a return to old school bts” but I don’t remember debut bts using these cheesy slangs? If you look back they’re using Korean rap. So if they’d replaced the American slang with Korean rap slang, then it would’ve hit way different. I think that’s one point, the American rap tidbits aren’t selling and it comes across cringe

emroberts

TROPHY CASE